Head Gasket and head repair

[hungryhound69]

Hello,

I had a failed head gasket on a C3 1.4 2008. I am trying to figure out if I can save my head or get a reconditioned head. I haven't yet measured the head for straightness as I need to get a straight edge first. However, I did measure the head thickness and it comes out at around 110.9-111.0 mm which suggests that it has already been skimmed once. I can get a reconditioned head and told I need a 2 notch gasket (I think that's a 1.4mm gasket-I may be wrong). But I also have seen 1.6mm gaskets so I am wondering what are they for. I am attaching pictures of the perished gasket I took off as it has 2 notches but I though the notches need to be closer together and one of the notches is some sort of registration.

So my questions are:
1. If my head passes the straightness test what thickness gasket should I use?
2. If It doesn't can it be skimmed any more or is it at the limit of usefulness as the factory specifies 111.0mm to be the minimum head thickness.

Thank you all in advance

[Stickyfinger]

I think you are correct that that is a 1 notch gasket.....BUT, see below

I would not trust measurements "done at home" for either warping or thickness, take it to a professional for checking and advice regarding the gasket to use.

Eling (OEM supply)

[hungryhound69]

I was going to check the warping just to see if it was badly out of true and then take it to the local engine rebuilding workshop. But since then I clean up the corners and measured the head thickness with callipers. On the 4 corners I got 110.5/110.6 and on the other corner 110.7/110.8 so either my callipers are rubbish or it has been skimmed one before but then how did the car work without the valves hitting the cylinder heads with a one notch gasket or there is sufficient clearance. Before I take it to a specialist I want to know what I'm talking about and whether the head is even worth skimming. I though the limit is 111.0mm and you don't skimm after that.

[hungryhound69]

PS I looked at that Eling gasket you posted, it's a 984.136 a 1.27mm thickness. But the 117.831 listed as +0.2mm repair grade is 1.47mm and it has 2 notches similar to what I have but what confuses me are the 3 notches in the middle of the Eling gasket witch are present in both the 1.27mm and the 1.47mm

[Stickyfinger]

I just used that image to show the notch layout....not sizes.

[ozvtr]

There are only 2 sizes. 1.2 (stock) and 1.4mm (repair). Plus or minus 0.1mm. So 1.1 to 1.3 stock and 1.3 to 1.5 repair.

This picture explains what the other notches are for.
I'm not sure that a new head is economical. I have found that the exhaust valves tend to get pitted and need to be reground anyway. So a "valve job" will need to be added to the cost of the head.
It's hard to say. The valve seats might need to be replaced. That will bump up the cost of a repair.
I don't know how much your machine shop guys charge!
I got the head skimmed, valve regrind on the inlet and exhaust valves and new exhaust inserts for $500AUD. That's about 300pound. I think I got a good deal!
I would recommend that you strip the head down to the head and valves. Then take that to a machine shop. See what they have to say.
Don't even think about putting the old head back without a machine shop looking at it!!!!!
The TU3JP cylinder heads turn into bananas if you over heat them. There are two reason why the head gasket fails. 1) the engine has over heated for one reason or another and the head is no longer flat. 2) the triangle shaped oil seal in the gasket fails and you get oil in the coolant or coolant in the oil.
I have replaced three TU3JP head gaskets in three different cars. The first one I DID NOT take to the machine shop. I am now getting coolant in the combustion chamber!! But I didn't know better at the time.

[ozvtr]

So to decode the head gasket notches, a 1360 capacity engine will have a notch at "1".
No head gasket should have asbestos, so the "C" notch should always be there.
Looks like ELRINGs' supplier code is a notch at "A" and "B". I would ignore the A and B marks (supplier codes) as they are not really relevant to us.
Stock thickness (1.2mm) has NO notch at "R" but a notch at "R" is 1.4mm (repair) thickness.
Remember, the manufacturers have a 0.1mm tolerance. So ELRINGs 1.27mm stock and 1.47mm repair spec are within limits.

[hungryhound69]

Thank you ozvtr.

I was confused by the perished gasket I peeled off the engine block (pictures above in initial post) as it only had one notch in the thickness indicator area and I though there should be 2.

I wasn't going to use the old head if I could help it at all. I cleaned it up and measured the thickness of the head. All the values are below 111.0 at around 110.7-110.8 so it deficiently cannot be skimmed any more. I wasn't going to get a brand new head but look for a re-manufactured one that hasn't been skimmed beyond the spec from a specialised engine rebuilding machine shop. Although there are some aftermarket gasket at 1.6mm (AJUSA 10155610) but I'm not sure how safe that would be to skimm my old head even more. Definitely not recommended by Citroen. I suspect that it has gone banana shape since I had a catastrophic failure whilst driving. Loss of power, white smoke out of exhaust and engine cut out. When I had the car towed to my house and I started to take it apart there was very little coolant left to drain so it definitely severely overheated. So first I check it with a straight edge if it passes then I'll take it to a engine rebuilding shop to get a proper test but if it is warped, as seen by a home test, then no point to do anything with it. And maybe no point doing anything with it even if it isn't warped as it been shaved too much.