Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Moderator: RichardW
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Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Hi guys, going to do my biggest job yet, dreaded clutch!! Now as i understand it, the steps go a bit like this
Wheels off
Drive shafts out
everything on top of the gearbox out (battery box, ECU, air pipes etc)
Starter out
Slave cylinder out
crank sensor out
Prop up engine under sump
Undo gearbox mounts
Gearbox off
replace clutch and pressure plate thingy using alignment tool
everything back on
save money.
Any tips or advice? ive got about 2 full days to do it with access to a nice warm dry well lit garage but itll be on stands jacks. I do have air tools.
Never done a clutch but if you dont do one you never will right?
Also any help with parts appreciated
VIN: VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]
Wheels off
Drive shafts out
everything on top of the gearbox out (battery box, ECU, air pipes etc)
Starter out
Slave cylinder out
crank sensor out
Prop up engine under sump
Undo gearbox mounts
Gearbox off
replace clutch and pressure plate thingy using alignment tool
everything back on
save money.
Any tips or advice? ive got about 2 full days to do it with access to a nice warm dry well lit garage but itll be on stands jacks. I do have air tools.
Never done a clutch but if you dont do one you never will right?
Also any help with parts appreciated
VIN: VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]
- GiveMeABreak
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
When are you planning to do it? - I can put a procedure up for you tomorrow if it will help?
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Probably one of the engine to gearbox bolts is fitted from the engine side, and is behind the exhaust cat, so you need to remove that. You need to remove the flexi exhaust pipe under the engine. It may well be necessary to remove the subframe to get the box out. Getting to the top bolt on the starter (at least in 1.6 guise) on this engine is a complete git!!
Richard W
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Not for a week or so will need a weekend without the kids! A guide would be great!GiveMeABreak wrote: ↑10 Jan 2020, 23:55 When are you planning to do it? - I can put a procedure up for you tomorrow if it will help?
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Ok, I'll put something up today for you.
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Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Thanks for those tips m8! Im on the 1.4 unsure how diff this will be, willing to bet its no easier hahaRichardW wrote: ↑11 Jan 2020, 12:56 Probably one of the engine to gearbox bolts is fitted from the engine side, and is behind the exhaust cat, so you need to remove that. You need to remove the flexi exhaust pipe under the engine. It may well be necessary to remove the subframe to get the box out. Getting to the top bolt on the starter (at least in 1.6 guise) on this engine is a complete git!!
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Procedure for Removal and Refitting Clutch on a C3 (A51)
Tools:
Removing
Pre-requisite - remove the gearbox See the procedure a few posts down:
Gearbox Removal
CAUTION: Some flywheels have through threads.
Do not allow the threads of the 3 retaining rods to protrude when screwing -
Risk of deformation of the secondary flywheel.
Screw in the 3 retaining rods [0217-B2Z] in place of the fixing screws (1). Do not allow the threads to protrude.
CAUTION: When compressing the clutch mechanism, do not cross a
hard point when tightening the central screw of the tool [0217-A].
The tightening must not exceed 10 turns clockwise.
Compress the clutch mechanism (2) with the central bolt of tool [0217-A] (at "a").
Finish removing the remaining bolts (1).
Release the clutch mechanism (2) by moving the central bolt of the tool [0217-A] (at "a").
Remove tools [0217-A] and [0217-B2Z].
Remove:
Checking - Cleaning
Visually check:
Deoxidise and degrease the following parts using a degreaser (LOTIWAR TCE 10 - Mechanical cleaner):
use a wire brush without damaging the parts.
Greasing
CAUTION: Strictly observe the lubrication step.
Refitting
CAUTION : Observe the tightening torque values.
If it is impossible to check the absence of friction (inaccessible clutch disc),
ighten the central screw of the tool [0217-B2Z] by a maximum of two additional turns.
Tighten the 3 bolts (1) to the specified torque.
Unscrew the center bolt of the tool [0217-A] (at "a") by several turns to detension the clutch mechanism (2).
Remove tools [0217-A], [0217-B2Z] and [0217-CX].
Refit and tighten the remaining 3 bolts (1).
Refit the gearbox.
Torque Settings - Clutch
Tools:
0217: Clutch Mechanism Compression Tool 0217-A: Clutch Mechanism Compressor 0217-B2Z: Retaining Rod (∅ 8mm) 0217-Cx*: Clutch Centring Drift Note: The exact centring drift will vary with engine type. In this case 0217-C6Z is the correct one for the DV4C engine that the member has. |
Pre-requisite - remove the gearbox See the procedure a few posts down:
Gearbox Removal
Fit the tool [0217-CX]. | Remove the 3 bolts (1) (Every second bolt). Position the tools [0217-A] and [0217-B2Z] on the clutch mechanism (2). |
Do not allow the threads of the 3 retaining rods to protrude when screwing -
Risk of deformation of the secondary flywheel.
Screw in the 3 retaining rods [0217-B2Z] in place of the fixing screws (1). Do not allow the threads to protrude.
CAUTION: When compressing the clutch mechanism, do not cross a
hard point when tightening the central screw of the tool [0217-A].
The tightening must not exceed 10 turns clockwise.
Compress the clutch mechanism (2) with the central bolt of tool [0217-A] (at "a").
Finish removing the remaining bolts (1).
Release the clutch mechanism (2) by moving the central bolt of the tool [0217-A] (at "a").
Remove tools [0217-A] and [0217-B2Z].
Remove:
- The clutch mechanism (2)
- The clutch disc
Checking - Cleaning
Visually check:
- The flywheel face for damage or scores
- The flywheel for wear
- The condition of the starter ring gear
- The clutch mechanism (2)
- Check the condition of the crankshaft seal ring
- Check the condition of the primary shaft seal ring
Deoxidise and degrease the following parts using a degreaser (LOTIWAR TCE 10 - Mechanical cleaner):
- The clutch housing
- The primary shaft
- The clutch bearing guide (according to equipment)
- The clutch fork (according to equipment)
use a wire brush without damaging the parts.
Greasing
CAUTION: Strictly observe the lubrication step.
CAUTION: Protect the interior of the clutch housing from splashes of grease. Vehicles equipped with a gearbox that has a mechanical clutch bearing: Spray a little grease MOLYCOTE G-RAPID PLUS (aerosol) on the splines of the primary shaft and on the clutch bearing guide tube (at "b" and "c"). Vehicles equipped with a gearbox that has a hydraulic clutch bearing: Grease the splines of the primary shaft with MOLYCOTE G-RAPID PLUS (at "c"). CAUTION: Do not soil the clutch disc lining - Risk of skating. Establish the clutch disk (3) on the spline shaft and perform multiple translations to distribute the grease. Remove the clutch disc. |
CAUTION: An excess of grease will contaminate the clutch friction plate and cause noise in neutral, slipping or juddering of the clutch. "d": Traces of grease present on a clutch disc polluted due to excess grease. "e": Traces of grease present on a clutch housing polluted due to excess grease. CAUTION: Clean any grease that may be projected onto the rotating friction. Remove the surplus grease on the top of the grooves and the end of the input shaft using a cloth. Note: The film of grease deposited on the rotating elements must be as thin as possible to avoid splashing. |
CAUTION : Observe the tightening torque values.
CAUTION: When refitting, place the face of the clutch disc, where the N° PSA 96 XXX XXX 80 is marked, gearbox end. Refit the clutch disc (3). Centre the clutch disc (3) using tool [0217-CX]. | CAUTION: The clutch mechanism and disc are paired at the factory and cannot be replaced separately. CAUTION: Any fitting of a clutch mechanism with automatic free play adjustment (whether new or re-used) must compulsorily be performed using the compression tool [0217]. Refit the clutch mechanism (2). N.B.: Do not remove the tool [0217-CX]. |
CAUTION : No resetting of the clutch wear adjustment is permitted. Position the tools [0217-A] and [0217-B2Z] on the clutch mechanism (2). Screw in the 3 retaining rods [0217-B2Z] in place of the fixing screws (1) Do not allow the threads to protrude. Tighten the 3 bolts (1) by hand. |
Gradually compress the clutch mechanism (2) until it contacts the primary flywheel (at "f"). Check the absence of friction:
|
ighten the central screw of the tool [0217-B2Z] by a maximum of two additional turns.
Tighten the 3 bolts (1) to the specified torque.
Unscrew the center bolt of the tool [0217-A] (at "a") by several turns to detension the clutch mechanism (2).
Remove tools [0217-A], [0217-B2Z] and [0217-CX].
Refit and tighten the remaining 3 bolts (1).
Refit the gearbox.
Torque Settings - Clutch
(1) Clutch friction plate. (2) Clutch mechanism. (3) Clutch mechanism fixing screws (2).
|
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Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
There's a Haynes-ism if I ever saw one!!Citroen.service wrote:Pre-requisite - remove the gearbox
I think that was the bit the OP was interested in really....
Richard W
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
I didn't ask as that's another marathon and was hoping he could do that bit!
@ ultra2extreme: If you need the gearbox removal bit too, let me know...
Oh, sod it, I'll put that up as I suspect he'll need it anyway
Topic Temporarily locked for gearbox procedure to be created.
@ ultra2extreme: If you need the gearbox removal bit too, let me know...
Oh, sod it, I'll put that up as I suspect he'll need it anyway
Topic Temporarily locked for gearbox procedure to be created.
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Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Gearbox Removal / Refitting C3 (A51) Manual 5 Speed Box
Note: Always replace the 2 x Gearbox Centring Pins.
Official Tooling
Removing
CAUTION: The transmission is removed from under the vehicle.
Refitting
CAUTION: Adhere to the tightening torques.
CAUTION: Always replace the gearbox centring pins.
Check:
Protect the interior of the clutch housing from splashes of grease.
Apply the recommended grease uniformly on the stop guide and the input shaft.
Grease the fingers of the clutch fork.
N.B. : Use MOLYCOTE G-RAPID PLUS grease.
Remove the surplus grease on the top of the grooves and the end of the input shaft using a cloth.
CAUTION: An excess of grease will contaminate the clutch friction plate and cause noise in neutral, slipping or juddering of the clutch.
CAUTION: If the clutch disc is reused, the disc hub must be free of traces of oxidation.
N.B.: Check the presence of new gearbox centring pins.
Clean the bolt threads.
When refitting, the thrust must be on its guide and positioned by the throw-out fork.
CAUTION: Do not crush the starter motor electrical harness while refitting the gearbox.
Attach the gearbox to the engine.
Refit:
Refit the bolts (8).
Attach the gear engagement and selection cable sleeve stops (at "b").
N.B.:The sleeve stops are locked automatically on refitting. Check that the cable stops are locked correctly.
Couple up:
Couple up: The gearchange transfer rod ( as "c").
Refit the fixing: Earth lead (3).
Connect the connector ( as "a").
Reclip the ancillaries battery electrical harness sheathing (4).
Refit the ancillaries battery support .
Secure the electrical harnesses attaching to the service (ancillaries) battery tray .
Refit:
Reconnect the ancillaries battery.
Refit:
Initialise the various ECUs.
Remove the vehicle from the ramp.
Here endeth the lesson....
Note: Always replace the 2 x Gearbox Centring Pins.
Official Tooling
0216-G2: Forks for Removing Gearbox Control Rods | 0012-Z: Lower Engine Support Crossmember "a" : Transverse engine support bar "b" : support "c" : Safety bolt "d" : Longitudinal engine support bar "e" : bolts "f" : engine support "g" : bolts "h" : bolts "j" : Pliers |
CAUTION: The transmission is removed from under the vehicle.
- Place the vehicle on a two-post ramp.
- Set the gearbox in neutral.
- Disconnect the ancillaries battery.
- Lift and support the vehicle.
- Drain gearbox.
- The front wheels
- The front left-hand splash-shield (/)
- The drive shafts (/)
Remove:
Remove the ancillaries battery support. | Unclip and move aside the ancillaries battery electrical harness sheathing (4). Disconnect the connector (at "a"). Remove the earth wire (3). |
Uncouple using tool [0216-G2]:
Move aside all of the gearbox control cables . Uncouple the gear engagement lever rod from the lever ( as "c"). Pivot the gearchange transfer earth (7). Remove the securing bolts from the starter . Move aside the starter without disconnecting it (Suspend it using an iron wire). | Remove the bolts (8). Move aside the hydraulic clutch control slave cylinder (9) (Without opening the hydraulic circuit). |
Remove:
| Remove:
|
Remove:
| Position:
|
Position the support "b" of tool [0012-Z] in place of the reaction link rod (13). Fit and tighten the bolt (12). | Position:
|
Remove the engine-gearbox coupling bolts (17). | Remove:
|
CAUTION: Adhere to the tightening torques.
|
Check:
- That there is no leak at the crankshaft seal
- There are no oil leaks at the stop guide
- The state of wear of the clutch
- The state of wear of the declutch bearing
Protect the interior of the clutch housing from splashes of grease.
Apply the recommended grease uniformly on the stop guide and the input shaft.
Grease the fingers of the clutch fork.
N.B. : Use MOLYCOTE G-RAPID PLUS grease.
Remove the surplus grease on the top of the grooves and the end of the input shaft using a cloth.
CAUTION: An excess of grease will contaminate the clutch friction plate and cause noise in neutral, slipping or juddering of the clutch.
CAUTION: If the clutch disc is reused, the disc hub must be free of traces of oxidation.
N.B.: Check the presence of new gearbox centring pins.
Clean the bolt threads.
When refitting, the thrust must be on its guide and positioned by the throw-out fork.
CAUTION: Do not crush the starter motor electrical harness while refitting the gearbox.
Attach the gearbox to the engine.
Refit:
- The engine-gearbox coupling bolts (17)
- The (16) bolt
- The stud (15)
- The nut (14)
- The bracket (19)
- The 2 bolts (18)
- The starter motor
- The fixing screws of the starter
- Remove the tool [0012-Z].
- The reaction link (13)
- The bolts (12)
- The stabiliser bar (10)
- The bolts (11)
Refit the bolts (8).
Attach the gear engagement and selection cable sleeve stops (at "b").
N.B.:The sleeve stops are locked automatically on refitting. Check that the cable stops are locked correctly.
Couple up:
- The gear engagement cable ball-joint (5)
- The gear selection cable ball-joint (6)
Couple up: The gearchange transfer rod ( as "c").
Refit the fixing: Earth lead (3).
Connect the connector ( as "a").
Reclip the ancillaries battery electrical harness sheathing (4).
Refit the ancillaries battery support .
Secure the electrical harnesses attaching to the service (ancillaries) battery tray .
Refit:
- The air inlets and resonator (1)
- The engine management ECU
- The service battery
Reconnect the ancillaries battery.
Refit:
- The ancillaries battery cover (2)
- The drive shafts (/)
- The front left-hand splash-shield (/)
- The front wheels
Initialise the various ECUs.
Remove the vehicle from the ramp.
Here endeth the lesson....
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help
Marc
Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Amazing, thank you @GiveMeABreak !!
Could someone explain the special tool for pressure plate removal? ive never seen a special tool for removing a clutch assembly and ive always seen people use a universal alignment too for refitting, which i have. Is this one of those things only dealers do? or are some clutches "special"?
TIA!
Could someone explain the special tool for pressure plate removal? ive never seen a special tool for removing a clutch assembly and ive always seen people use a universal alignment too for refitting, which i have. Is this one of those things only dealers do? or are some clutches "special"?
TIA!
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
No worries.
The tool's function is to improve the centering of the friction plate and to eliminate engine jerks, vibrations and noise, by compressing the clutch mechanism when tightening the fixing bolts.
PSA have the main tool and there is a different part ([Cx]) with the centring drift 'x' varying according to engine. They use this across the range of PSA engines when doing the clutch.
The tool's function is to improve the centering of the friction plate and to eliminate engine jerks, vibrations and noise, by compressing the clutch mechanism when tightening the fixing bolts.
PSA have the main tool and there is a different part ([Cx]) with the centring drift 'x' varying according to engine. They use this across the range of PSA engines when doing the clutch.
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Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Thanks for that m8! Good info! Is it mandatory to do the job? Or will i get similar result with a universal alignment tool?
I have this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-CL ... SwQodZb3jZ
I have this one https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-CL ... SwQodZb3jZ
- GiveMeABreak
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C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow - x 5644
Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
All I can see is that they designed it for a purpose, so it must be to both aid alignment (which other tools can do as you have found, but also to eliminate issues like juddering as described). I'm sure there are garages that don't use this sort of thing - so difficult to compare - but I would suspect it is to avoid the issue in the first place as a result of fitting.
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Marc
Marc
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Re: Going to do my clutch C3 MK2 2011, tips?
Ok m8 thanks for that, i get ya. Thing with these special tools is, as i've seen them for other things like locking cam pulleys on timing belts etc, where the heck do you get them? i search the part numbers the handbooks mention and you get nothing