C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

Post Reply
shone
Posts: 8
Joined: 25 Oct 2019, 21:39
Location: Belgrade
My Cars: Citroen C5 x7 138 fap

C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by shone »

Hello to everyone,

I just buy seats from exclusive c5 2008-2011, with electric motors inside the seats, heats, massage option on one and so on...., full leather.
My idea is to try to put this seats in my C5 2009 non-exclusive, with standard seats.

If anyone know the electric scheme for connector or can give me any advice it would be wonderful. I notice that those main connector below the seats are the same like in my car, but amount of wires are not the same, I have 8 (two doubles) while there is 15 (two doubles) in seat with no massage, while in those with massage there is 16 wires on main connector.

I guess it is not a good idea to just plug new seats on my car ? Maybe it will work, without memory for the position of the seat, of course, but I afraid to try that because I am not sure that the wires position and power are on the right place between each connectors, no matter if it look the same.

If someone have experience in this, please ?

Thanks in advance.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Nope - it simply won't work as a swap.

I don't know if you have an Exclusive X7 or not - but the wiring harnesses are different for a start. Next the Door Control Module will also be different and not compatible.
Another member had an Exclusive with non-leather seats - so he had most of the wiring, but had to get the door cards and the control module fitted and some other things. These are not like the earlier MK I C5s where most of the wiring was in place. The X7 has multiple wiring looms, Front, Supplementary, Fascia, Intermediate and rear for the cabin and these are all different depending on model and build date.
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
shone
Posts: 8
Joined: 25 Oct 2019, 21:39
Location: Belgrade
My Cars: Citroen C5 x7 138 fap

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by shone »

Thank you for your reply.

So there is no chance via original connector, from my non-exclusive car.
This means that only way will be if I can connect power to the seats an make it work as stand alone units.

Is there someone who, at least, try this seats work with connected power outside of the car ?
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

That won’t really work as the system relies on connected electronic control units in the seats that talk to the control modules and the BSI. These are multiplexed electronics on a CAN network

If you have your VIN I can see what module you have and what harnesses. Do you also have the year of the donor vehicle from which the seats are from?
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by Peter.N. »

I fitted leather electric seats in my Mk1 C5 and all the connectors were under the carpet but I think the electronics have changed a bit since then.

Peter
User avatar
myglaren
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 25362
Joined: 02 Mar 2008, 13:30
Location: Washington
My Cars: Mazda 6
Ooops.
Previously:
2009 Honda Civic :(
C5, C5, Xantia, BX, GS, Visa.
R4, R11TXE, R14, R30TX
x 4888

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by myglaren »

Dead easy on the Mk 1.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Apart from the modifications to some of the earlier engines, there is nothing else whatsoever the X7 has in common with the earlier C5 MK I or MK II. It's a completely different vehicle. :wink:
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
shone
Posts: 8
Joined: 25 Oct 2019, 21:39
Location: Belgrade
My Cars: Citroen C5 x7 138 fap

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by shone »

GiveMeABreak wrote: 26 Oct 2019, 10:26 That won’t really work as the system relies on connected electronic control units in the seats that talk to the control modules and the BSI. These are multiplexed electronics on a CAN network

If you have your VIN I can see what module you have and what harnesses. Do you also have the year of the donor vehicle from which the seats are from?
Thank you a lot for your effort.

My VIN is VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff], while donor seats are from c5 2010., if I can I will try to get also vin from donor car. Seats are full, both with heats while driver seat have massage.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

I compared my X7 that is about the same build date and engine as yours (but right hand drive) as I have all the kit on mine from factory - so could check the harness details (comparing with the Left Hand Drive equivalent harness with same functions)

So you don't have the Driver's control unit, for the Electric Seats and ambient lighting, shown as item (20) on the Diagram.
Shone Door Control Unit.PNG
You also have a different Seat and Belt Harness for vehicles without Electric Heated Seats and Memory Control:
Shone Seat and Belt Harness.PNG
And also the Front Door Harness is different for vehicles without Ambient Lighting and Electrochromed, Memory Controlled, Heated, Folding Indexed Mirrors
Shone Frond Door  Harness.PNG
You obviously have a Left Hand Drive, so the harnesses are different - but I have looked at these too for you and they are still different for non-controlled, memory heated seats.

I think I mentioned that another member changed the door cards and had to have the control module sent as the wiring int he door was different as I mentioned above.
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
shone
Posts: 8
Joined: 25 Oct 2019, 21:39
Location: Belgrade
My Cars: Citroen C5 x7 138 fap

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by shone »

It looks this is mission imposible for me. Only way at the moment I see in solution to make seats working as stand a lone, only sensor for belt and airbag can be connected with slightly changes. :(
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Just be careful what you do - if you accidentally trigger the airbag it could be really dangerous.
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
shone
Posts: 8
Joined: 25 Oct 2019, 21:39
Location: Belgrade
My Cars: Citroen C5 x7 138 fap

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by shone »

Yes, I know about airbag, actually I am searching for some instruction how to open seats, especially those backplate plastic, how to unmount it from sets so that I can take a closer look to everything inside.

I am curious what will hapened if I connect it to my car, since connector is the same, at least phisicaly ? Hmm.
aronbv
Posts: 8
Joined: 12 Jun 2020, 10:10
Location: Brasov, Romania
Lexia Available: Yes
My Cars: C5 III 2009
x 4

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by aronbv »

shone wrote: 26 Oct 2019, 18:19 Yes, I know about airbag, actually I am searching for some instruction how to open seats, especially those backplate plastic, how to unmount it from sets so that I can take a closer look to everything inside.

I am curious what will hapened if I connect it to my car, since connector is the same, at least phisicaly ? Hmm.
So, here i am, practically with the same problem, I have the seats, but without massage and heating. How could i power them? Any advice is greatly appreciated.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36996
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

You have to remember that all these control components are integrated into the comfort CAN data network. All the control units talk to each other and then to the BSI. You need the right harnesses and control units. The main ECU under the seat has tie ins to the various motors ion the seats and other electronics and these need to connect to the right electrical harness to talk to the other systems and components in the door and BSI, fusebox etc. These aren't like the MK I or MK II seats that were simpler to retrofit, because of the additional functions and features and further integration.
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
Steveo
(Donor 2020)
Posts: 144
Joined: 31 Dec 2019, 20:05
Location: Barnsley
My Cars: Citroen C5 Estate 2009
x 13

Re: C5 x7 electric seats in car with non-electric seats ?

Post by Steveo »

Hi all
Any update on this retro fit?
Regards
Steve
Post Reply