Zel's Fleet Blog - BX, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D & 230TE, AC Model 70.

Tell us your ongoing tales and experiences with your French car here. Post pictures of your car here as well.
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Zelandeth
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

Michel wrote: 08 Dec 2020, 22:31 Great stuff Zel, as always.

Would plastic numberplate nuts and bolts hold the indicator stalk secure?
Possibly...Though to get it sitting properly secure you have to have them pretty wicked tight. It really isn't a particularly great design...and that's nothing to do with Invacar/AC...the stalk is straight out of the Lucas parts bin.

I'm going to have a proper look at it next time I'm in the garage and have a think. What I might do as my next plan of attack before resorting to sealant will be to measure the hole in there and have a look at what I've got to play with. If there's enough meat on the casting around the screw holes I might try drilling it out and properly tapping a hole with a reasonably coarse thread and sourcing a matching bolt - then going to town with the thread lock when bolting it up. Got to be better than the stock self-tapping screw arrangement!
NewcastleFalcon wrote: 08 Dec 2020, 22:21 Love the location shoots Zel, Lovely pics keep them coming.

Lots of creativity possible with the Invacar in particular. How often do you see a decent "brochure setting" for photo's of an invacar? Certainly not from the manufacturers when they were launched. But now....its such a quirky little icon that it would be fun seeing it in one of those typical glossy brochure settings.... on a long gravel drive up to some ornamental lakes, or in front of a stately home you know the type of thing.

I like the "lights on" pics of bpth the XJS and the Invacar.....I think I'll give that a go myself with my point and shoot camera see how they turn out!
I certainly plan to keep getting shots of all the cars out and about, the more comical looking locations for the Invacar the better. If she keeps driving like she is at the moment there should hopefully be plenty more to come.

Does make me feel sad for how much stick they got at the time though. Do have to wonder if some of the derision they were treated with would have been avoided if when AC designed the Model 70 if they'd used a more modern looking body rather than the recycled shell from the Mark 67 Invacar just with the addition of flared wheel arches to accommodate the wider rear track. Under the skin with the possible exception of a couple of bits of seat and some of the wheelchair attachment points there's absolutely nothing in common...yet they looked the same so were assumed to be just as poor a substitute for a car.

Well to be honest, that's being a bit unfair to the Model 67 too...Like most of the Villiers engined machines they were a product of their time...Essentially a 40s/50s design built down to a cost. Given that life tended to be lived rather more locally back then, the need to be able to go beyond 40mph or so really wasn't the huge issue that I think a lot of folks made it out to be.

Yes the cabin of the Model 70 is very basic. Yes it's a noisy little buzz-box. No, it's not as stable as a car with a full compliment of wheels. No, it's not going to have Ford worrying about sales of the Cortina...but I've driven a fair number of cars from the early 70s which are no better to drive than the Model 70. I mean the simple fact that it's quite content to cruise at 60...I remember that feeling like it took honest effort in my first Metro...and that was a car from 1986. I reckon that if AC had put their minds to it the Model 70 with a few tweaks could have been an honest competitor to the likes of the Fiat 500/126, Reliant Kitten/Robin etc segment. I've already seen what a huge difference just adding a bit of soft(ish) interior trim and a better seat has made to the car.

In fact it very nearly was...at least three prototype "Town Cars" were made, two three and one four wheeled I'm aware of...all four seaters. and as far as we know - from the steering wheel back mechanically they are at least largely Model 70. Most likely with the 650cc variant of the Steyr-Puch engine though to handle the extra weight.

They're contemporary with the Model 70...All of these look so much more modern though - albeit seeming somewhat more dated in their own way because of it nowadays.

Afraid I've absolutely NO idea where these photos originally came from - I've seen them posted a plethora of times over the last few years in various forums. So I'm afraid I can't credit the original sources in this case other than "the internet." If anyone DOES know the actual source, please feel free to let me know.
3b75e418e39d54ced1d68e7a3e0fac65.jpg.86a4749ad30f4eeb41c397371a7aee38.jpg
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Model 70 exhaust system clearly on show there!
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This one I believe is now in a private collection over in the USA.

Not sure about the other two below.
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Obviously with the microcar boom dying off by then and the explosive success of the Mini in that sector they never took it beyond the prototype stage...but I do find myself wondering about it as one of those "what might have been?" sort of situations. If AC were planning something like this from the start though I reckon it may well explain why some aspects of the Model 70 are - for what it is - quite so over-engineered. Suspension, drive and chassis are hard to fault. They just plonked a really basic body on top of it.
Current fleet:
07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 73 AC Model 70, 62 Rover 110.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by CitroJim »

Nice one Zel, love the pictures :D
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

The run out yesterday went largely to plan but was marred slightly by the indicator stalk making a bid for freedom shortly before I got home. The stock mounting arrangement for this is at best "flimsy" thanks to it relying on two self tapping screws fastened into the plastic of the stalk assembly (bakelite?).

Using a nut and bolt isn't really an option due to the proximity of the terminals for the indicator switched circuits to the hole in the body where the fastener lives.

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If you find a bolt with a really shallow head you might just about be able to get away with it, just. Nothing I have in stock is small enough though.

I've a couple of ideas in mind, but the first one I wanted to try was tried today...Drill the holes out, tap them properly and stick a bolt of a carefully measured length in.

Step one...drill out and tap the holes.

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Result was a nice clean thread.

I went with a standard M6 thread as I had fasteners that size in stock, and it seemed a decent step up but without risking taking too much meat out of the assembly I was trying to secure. Also was the biggest I could get away without having to also drill out the holes in the metal back plate.

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A healthy dose of thread lock was added before bolting things together.

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I took the opportunity to tap out the holes in the backing plate that the plastic cover attaches too so I could get that securely fixed and get rid of two rusty fasteners.

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Much better.

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Washers were fitted there to both keep the end of the bolt where I wanted it (precisely level with the end of the threaded hole) and to allow me to actually tighten things up without the bolts disappearing into the recessed hole in the backplate.

Really need to get some paint and touch in the space where this switch used to live.

Likewise I need to get a bit more loom tape in and extend the covering on the loom to the stalk the last few inches to the back of the switch.

Nice to be rid of a couple more of the list of rusty fasteners in the cabin too.

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Historically the baseplate always wobbled around a bit when the switch was used. Reckon this is why it was able to work loose over time. It now seems to be rather more solid from the looks of things.



Hopefully this will stay put this time. If not I've got a few more ideas up my sleeve...but they're rather more of a bodge. whereas I feel that this is more just an improvement on the original setup. I need to pick up more dog food tomorrow so will probably take her out to carry out that trip unless the weather is horrible so we can see if it works then.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by CitroJim »

Excellent :D A tap and die set is not something one uses every day but by gosh, they can certainly save the day ;)

That Zel, is better than new!
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

I never realised quite how much the indicator stalk was wobbling around before. Now it's properly secured the action is so much more positive. You can also now reliably cancel the indicators with a tap of your finger now - you used to have to make a very deliberate action to do that. It's a small detail but it makes the car far nicer to drive.

First time I've been out of town since sorting the condenser and cleaning/gapping the points today. Once on the A5 the difference was plain as day. Holding 60 is definitely way easier now. 70 has always been *achievable* with a long enough level road, but actually cruising at that speed wasn't really viable. Now however she's quite happy to reach and maintain 70 with a bit more left in the tank if needed. The oft quoted 82mph max (though no one seems entirely sure where this came from as it's not in any of the official documentation) feels a lot less optimistic now.

Still can't quite believe how composed she feels at that speed. No wobble, no horrible vibration, nothing feeling like it's going to fly apart at any moment...she just thurms along quite happily. Sure she moves around a little in the wind and when you pass a lorry, but nothing alarming. It really doesn't feel like you're doing anything which is over-stretching the capabilities of the car.

Being absolutely honest, at 70 the Lada buzzed and vibrated more than TPA does.

Random photo from while she was out and about today.

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Definitely an effective way of making modern cars look huge. Still reckon she's a good match for a lot of my journeys as 95% of my trips are on my own.

Also managed to spot a nice coincidence a few miles later on.

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I always enjoy catching things where the numbers line up like that. If I miss 12345 I will be most irked! 12354 is the big milestone though as that will mark 1000 miles since she was brought back to life.

I know the whole "it just keeps feeling better the more it's driven" thing is a bit of a cliché where classic cars are concerned...but it is honestly how it feels lately.

The appearance of the TI-30 calculator a while ago sparked a bit of discussion in a few places. This one...

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Got to love a classic LED display.

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Just a shame the camera can't capture the colour properly.

I used to collect a few things like this years ago, but it's been a good 15 years since I really looked at things like this, and I gave quite a lot of them away a while ago...however following the conversation I got thinking about it again...and ended up rummaging around eBay. This arrived this morning.

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This cost me a whopping...£0.99 and £5 postage. There was another mid 90s Casio one in the package too but that's a pretty generic example. If anyone's interested I'll snap a couple of photos. However it was this one that caught my eye. I've not been able to find a date on it anywhere, but from the styling, weight and fact that it's a full 15mm thick makes me think very late 80s. Oh...and the ZX-80/81 style membrane keyboard too.

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Yes, it is *precisely* as awful to try to type on as the aforementioned Sinclair products!

The moment I saw that though there was a distinct moment of "Yep...I need that!" Don't usually find these things of too much interest unless they're particularly interesting from a technical standpoint - I really want to get one of the Casio ones with the funky three colour displays (CSF-"nnnn" model series as I recall), and am watching a few on eBay now I've remembered they exist. I've always wanted to take a proper look at the display tech on those...have always assumed they use some form of pigmented LCD or polarisers with some sort of coating which only interacts with specific light wavelengths (sort of like those coloured dichroic halogen lights that were popular back around 2000). I've never actually seen one of these in person though, so am really curious. This one was obviously a pretty early example of this type of this type of product though so was worthy of interest.

...There's a job lot of another five late 70s/early 80s calculators on the way as well.

See what you lot made me do? I hadn't touched this hobby in the best part of 15 years until this week!
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07 Volvo V70 SE D5, 85 Sinclair C5, 84 Trabant 601S, 73 AC Model 70, 62 Rover 110.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by mickthemaverick »

Great news on the indicators!! As for the renewed interest in calculators we always knew we could count on you Zel!! :lol:
I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure!
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by myglaren »

I had a Ti-30 in the late seventies - for work and work bought it.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

The windscreen wipers on the Jag have been becoming increasingly glitchy of late. Normally a sharp thump on the scuttle would get them working again - until last time I needed to go out in a hurry when they decided to play dead entirely. The behaviour seemed to suggest the motor wasn't making it quite all the way to the fully parked position (which is slightly further over the screen than the normal wiping range).

Given I knew the drains had been clogged for goodness knows how long the motor had most likely spent some time under water so I was hoping it was going to be a simple case of dirty contacts or dried up grease in the linkage.

Figured it was worth pulling the grill over it off and seeing if I could see anything obviously amiss. Looked like it would be a simple case of pulling the wiper arms, undoing a couple of bolts and lifting it off...right?

Of course not, because Jaguar. Having unfastened everything I could see it still wasn't interested in budging more than a few millimetres.

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Peering under the edge it became obvious there was a load of hardware attached to the underside, with no obvious way to detach it. Attempting to get a wrench into the bolt only resulted in me dropping it into the void under the grill.

Eventually I figured out that the whole wiper assembly remains attached to the cover and you just have to sort of wrestle it out through the not-quite-wide-enough gap.

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Those spindle gear boxes look suspiciously like the same ones used in the Invacar...given the amount of BMC parts bin hardware in there it wouldn't surprise me.

Nothing hugely obvious amiss, though the whole drive assembly and spindles were really dry. So everything was drowned in penetrating oil and I then splodged as much grease as I could be hand into the spindle boxes (pretty easy as they're not sealed) without pulling things to bits any further as I was being mindful of having to go out pretty soon to collect groceries.

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I'm under no illusions that I won't be back in here, most likely I'll need to dismantle the motor gearbox itself to give it a thorough clean and re-grease as the original lubrication has probably long since turned to plastic. As it is though the wipers now move at about twice the original speed and appear to be playing ball...the issue has been intermittent though so only time will tell.

With everything back together I headed for my grocery collection slot, via a fuel station (again).

Stopping at the first junction after that I noticed the dash lighting seemed really dim.

Um...yeah, that would do it.

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The alternator appears to have lost interest in charging. I legged it home and switched cars. Further investigation revealed no working ignition light either...so either bulb has gone or we've got an issue with the brushes most likely.

Of course when I went back to the car half an hour later to park it it behaved perfectly again.

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Yep...sticky and/or worn brushes methinks.

Won't that be fun...the alternator is one of the nice easy to get to things...

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Oh...no I actually meant the other thing. You can barely see the thing. I changed the belt for it a couple of months ago and that was a full day's job pretty much!

Never a dull moment...

I did finally get a bit of time to start putting the basic text for a website update together (first time since 2017!), got a ways to go but have made a start at least. Decided to use something lacking in distractions to assist in concentrating on what I was actually working on.

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Really do like the keyboard on this too. It's definitely physically the same board that Acorn used in the Archimedes range (A3000/3010/3020 at least), which was always my favourite to type on of the machines from that era. Amiga wasn't bad...Atari ST came miles behind with their horrible mushy mess. Funky shaped function keys couldn't even redeem it. No idea when I'll actually get the update finished and uploaded, but at least I've made a start.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by CitroJim »

I used to have one of those Amstrad PPC machines Zel :D They are good! It was my first 16 bit machine and the first PC-compatible after years of running 8 bit CP/M machines...

I got mine cheap from the Tottenham Court Road as it had a very 'foreign' keyboard on it for some obscure language... Good for touch-typing practice!!
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

CitroJim wrote: 13 Dec 2020, 14:57 I used to have one of those Amstrad PPC machines Zel :D They are good! It was my first 16 bit machine and the first PC-compatible after years of running 8 bit CP/M machines...

I got mine cheap from the Tottenham Court Road as it had a very 'foreign' keyboard on it for some obscure language... Good for touch-typing practice!!
I really like it. The form factor is downright bizarre but actually works a lot better than it looks like it should. The only real criticisms I have of the machine are the lack of a display backlight and that there was no provision made for a hard disc. I know there are a couple of third party add-ons for that, but they're like unicorn's teeth these days and I doubt I'll ever find one (at a sane price anyway).

I do need to find a better text editor though, Tasword is just a bit too clunky for me, especially given it mangles the formatting a bit when justifying text, adding a load of carriage returns and additional spaces. I can't remember if any of the earlier versions of WordPerfect would run on an 8086/off a 720K floppy...might be an experiment for an evening this week.

-- -- --

So, have I fixed the issue with the Jag's wipers? Nope...Worked perfectly until I turned the wipers off for the first time, then refused to start again until I thumped it again.

Fine. We'll pull the wiper motor apart, clean and generally service it then. My money is on it just being a dirty or sticky switch/brush. Given that the wipers work absolutely perfectly once they're started without any juddering or lack of torque I reckon it's a simple dodgy contact.

The plus side is that with the removal of four bolts (well, three in my case as one is sheared), removal of one plug and pulling off the washer feed tube the whole assembly just lifts off the car. So I've brought it into the house so I can work on it tomorrow inside when it's forecast to be tipping it down all day.

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Parts manual is already coming in handy with a nice diagram showing what to expect when I start stripping it down.

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Hopefully shouldn't be a major headache to sort. At least it will give me the opportunity to *properly* clean up and regrease things rather than the slap-dash job I did yesterday.

The calculator thing has definitely snowballed again. This little bundle was bought a few days ago and is on the way.

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This was mainly for the Sharp one as it's a style I've not seen before. Though the TI-1250 is a nice addition as I've already for a TI-1200 (same thing but sans memory functions), and the Casio LC-828 will be a nice companion for my really battered LC-826.

In addition I also just bought this off eBay.

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That will be the first one in the collection to use a neon display which will be a nice box to get ticked off.

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We do have a fault with the display whereby the top segment in all the digits is missing...Hoping this will just be a duff transistor (given the display will almost certainly be multiplexed that would make sense to me). Based on a little research I believe that this is a Kovac K-80D, dating from 1972 it looks like. Should be an interesting little addition to the collection - and actually a bit nice to have a fault to hunt down. Probably the only reason it went for less than £15, anything with a more exotic display than a VFD tends do be quite pricey.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by xantia_v6 »

Zelandeth wrote: 13 Dec 2020, 23:54 I do need to find a better text editor though, Tasword is just a bit too clunky for me, especially given it mangles the formatting a bit when justifying text, adding a load of carriage returns and additional spaces. I can't remember if any of the earlier versions of WordPerfect would run on an 8086/off a 720K floppy...might be an experiment for an evening this week.
Try https://vetusware.com/download/Sprint%201/?id=4468 (I have not checked that the link actually leads to a working version of the software). IMO the best dos word processor for machines with limited resources.

On the XJ-S wiper, just be thankful that yours doesn't have the earlier version of the wiper made by Electrolux (!!!), who should have stuck with home appliances. They were a real nightmare for performance and reliability, with a peculiar self-parking mechanism and spares drying up in the early 80s. I still have one of those on my car, but one heaves a sigh of relief every time the wipers actually move when the switch is operated. The feeling of anticipation is enhanced by a delay of one second (for the parking mechanism to unwind) before the wipers move after you turn them on (or operate the single-sweep).

When the XJ-S was being developed in the 1970s, I think that Jaguar were threatening to drop Lucas as a supplier (over quality issues), so my car was built with an Electrolux wiper and a Motorola alternator.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by CitroJim »

Loving the old calculators Zel :) I have a couple here, one a Casio FX-570 I used at work when Computers were proper computers in 6' racks.. The FX-570 was able to work in binary, hex and most critically to me at the time, octal :)

The Ferranti Argus 700 machines I looked after worked in octal...

My FX-570 shows evidence of having worked hard and it certainly did!
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by Zelandeth »

CitroJim wrote: 14 Dec 2020, 07:32 Loving the old calculators Zel :) I have a couple here, one a Casio FX-570 I used at work when Computers were proper computers in 6' racks.. The FX-570 was able to work in binary, hex and most critically to me at the time, octal :)

The Ferranti Argus 700 machines I looked after worked in octal...

My FX-570 shows evidence of having worked hard and it certainly did!
A pretty close relative of my fx-451M I imagine.
IMG_20201203_173010.jpg
Which also has binary, hex and octal modes. Saved my sanity on more than one occasion at college. Earned me dirty looks from several classmates who had newer and shinier calculators which had half the functionality.

Still love the way Casio fitted a pretty comprehensively featured scientific and engineering calculator into a package no bigger than a typical four/five function pocket example of the period.
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by CitroJim »

That's a very close relative Zel :)

I remember those well, having some keys in the fold-out case was cool :cool:

Here's my FX-570... One half of the folding cover has disappeared - it broke at the hinge through hard use!
Casio FX-570
Casio FX-570
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Re: Zel's Fleet Blog - Xantia Activa, Jag XJ-S, Sinclair C5, Mercedes 208D, AC Model 70.

Unread post by xantia_v6 »

Zelandeth wrote: 14 Dec 2020, 14:53 A pretty close relative of my fx-451M I imagine.

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Which also has binary, hex and octal modes. Saved my sanity on more than one occasion at college. Earned me dirty looks from several classmates who had newer and shinier calculators which had half the functionality.

Still love the way Casio fitted a pretty comprehensively featured scientific and engineering calculator into a package no bigger than a typical four/five function pocket example of the period.
Snap!!!

I still have one of those also. I used mine while writing 6800 assembly language microprocessor code, and eventually the flexible pcb in the hinge started to fail.