DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

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Dannio636
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DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hi
I have just bought a DS5 Hybrid4 2012. Car ran fine on a long journey home from just buying it.
After 4 hours of sitting on the drive the alarm went off and I could not stop it. I tried the different key fobs, putting key in the slot, starting it. Nothing would stop the alarm. The deactivate alarm button doesn't seem to do much wither i noticed. Maybe this is an alarm module or the siren unit failing.
I have disconnected the battery and put it on a charge with an 'intelligent' charger over night.
This morning, put battery back on and left it a while to settle. The alarm didn't immediate go off. After some time i sat in the car and before starting it the siren went off again.
Is this something seen before?
Last night I called the AA and they could not deactivate it.
The siren has evidently worn its own internal battery out again... So silent for the moment but battery disconnected.
Any advice? I only have an generic reader, evidently I need to buy a Citroen specific one...
Any thoughts welcome..
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

My suggestion would be to replace the unit. When the internal backup batteries go they don't get charged / hold a charge from the main battery, so it's the same as if somebody tried to cut the power to the circuit - it goes off until the internal battery runs out. I've had several go on various cars and replacing the module has resolved the issue of the alarm going off randomly (mostly after locking the car). You original unit is 10 + years old , so I would expect the internal battery to be on its last legs by now.
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hi Marc, thanks for replying. do you know where the siren is located.. this car is very new to me so no idea where it is located. Is it a 'simple' swap out of the part or does it need recoding? I'd also be interested in finding the alarm module in case that's the next bit that needs replacing.. I would presume that would need recoding..

Thanks
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

If the alarm warning lamp remains permanently on when you switch on the ignition, this indicates a fault in the alarm system.

All I can tell you is the siren is located somewhere on the front right wing and the ECU is located in the passenger glovebox - probably near the BSI, so be careful there.
DS5 Alarm.JPG
(6) is the siren
(8) is the Alarm ECU

As far as the Alarm ECU goes, it does not need VIN coding of course, but here are both country parameters and various sensitivity settings for the Volumetric sensors that need programming according to seat trim, and the sensitivity of the X and Y axis anti lift sensors.
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hi Marc, again, thanks for the help. It does look like the siren as opposed to the module in that case as there is no light showing on the alarm disable button.

I will do a BSI reset according to:

viewtopic.php?t=61997

one more time and then if that doesn't do it I pull the siren and replace... Hoping the neighbors don't mind again..

Thanks for your help here.. will let you know the outcome in case others have this problem
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Yes, please do.
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hi. Thought I'd give an update..

I trickle charged the battery as you know, and made sure it had plenty of charge. Was about to undertake the bsi reset procedure etc when I thought I would look at the keys as the AA person put a new battery in....

I compared the keys and the fob with the new battery in had the prongs bent so that it wouldn't touch the battery.... I have taken it apart now and fixed that so the fob works (both fobs back to working...)

Put battery back on in the car, rest bsi.. road tested.. and it seems that there are no issues and the car is back to working. I will monitor the 12v battery.

Was able now to check the firmware of the info system and im on 2.86 which I'm pleased about. Not sure what else I should look into with the car as it is new to me? Any tips and ideas welcome.. Does the hybrid battery ever get all the status bars full? it never gets more than 3/4 full indicator it seems..

Anyway, Marc, thanks for your help..
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

No worries and another problem highlighted by incompetence - I mean if the AA can't put a simple battery in a fob properly, what does that say about their mechanical skills?

Glad you sorted it and will now be wary if it happens again.
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Some people should never be let near to 'complicated' items. Today I had to investigate why a delivery locker was off line. I found that the Commando Plug had been replaced, with the earth and neutral wires being swapped around. This, obviously, would have caused the circuit breaker (at the distribution board) to keep tripping. Rather than check their work the 'electrician' then went 'downstream' to a junction box and disconnected all three wires to the locker (which would have then allowed the circuit breaker to stay live). Once I corrected these issues the locker was working properly. I have escalated these 'problems', in the hope that the client host makes sure their 'electricians' can wire a plug properly!
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hello.. so the issue is back! This time more interesting. The siren goes off if you unlock the car and the alarm button light flashes. I have not, as yet replaced the siren as the siren sounds for a bit then stops... then will sound for a bit.

So, even when you have started the car it will sound. Then stop... If it does sound then if you tap the area around the inside door lock release it will make the siren stop.. but sometimes come on again.. It will do this with both front doors.

It is very erratic as to the behavior..

I now have diagbox.. hasn't helped in the slightest.. but then again Im new to this.. What essentially should I do to rule this out. The key point is that the alarm button in the car is flashing..
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The flashing alarm button is just an indicator that the alarm has been triggered. I've never know the actual siren to be faulty yet, it has always been the alarm module / ECU that was faulty / internal battery end of life. I would be starting there.

If you have Diagbox and ran a global diagnostic, it will, when completed list any fault codes. Pop up any you have.

There are only 15 alarm fault codes available and will as an example show FEEA, FEEB, F00F or 9EE1 as examples. There's not a lot of troubleshooting or further explanation of the codes on the alarm as most of the faults will be uncharacterised - but as said, the replacement of the module generally stops the premature triggering of the alarm.
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

I would run DiagBox, do a Global Test, and note down ALL of the error codes (maybe take photographs of the details of each one). Then see if you can clear any of them (some may be able to be cleared), and then run the Global Test again. Any error codes that have come back are likely to be an actual problem, rather than a glitch.

DON'T make any setting changes with DiagBox UNLESS you know what it will do! There is no UNDO function, so if you make a mistake it could be awkward. If you don't know what a setting does leave it well alone. There are no instruction with DiagBox as the PSA Group never intended for members of the general public to use it.
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Hi, so the only one that related to the alarm was a FEE2. A fault on the anti-lift sensor - Cause Low stop *1.
The light flashes in time with the siren..
This evening.. wife went out to car, got in, drove off... has come home.. and it hasn't gone off this time.. Very temperamental.. Shame, rest of it is great..
Is the anti - lift sensor in the ecu? I was going to check out where the ecu was today but Marc had said near the BSI and fuse box.. I didnt fancy playing there today
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, so that helps. FEE2: Fault on the anti-lift sensor: Not characterised

So the Anti Lift function is incorporated into the Siren unit. So this is the likely suspect and it seems it's not happy about the angle - compared with the reference values. I'd also make sure the wiring to the Siren module is ok and the earth has good contact and that the module has not been moved, knocked or upset during routine maintenance. 'Mechanics' can end up causing more damage if they are a bit clumsy.
DS5 Alarm B.JPG
"X" Axis of the horizontal plane (Vehicle).
"Y" Axis of the horizontal plane (Vehicle).

The anti-lift protection detects the lifting of the vehicle or of one of its wheels.
The anti-lift function is integrated with the siren.
The anti-lift sensor is active when its output is earthed.
The anti-lift function continuously compares the position of the vehicle on each of the axes X and Y with a reference position.

The siren will be set off in the following instances:
  • If the difference between the 2 positions is above a predefined angle
  • On the detection of a lift of more than 3 degrees (at a speed above 1°/min)
A fault is forwarded and maintained on each failure of an attempt to take the reference angle.
After a failure, if an attempt succeeds, the fault changes to intermittent.
After the activation of the alarm, if the reference angle can no longer be acquired, the anti-lift function is not activated and the fault is maintained.

While the siren is triggered, the measured angle values are not used so that the vibrations of the siren do not interfere with the measurement.
Dannio636
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Re: DS5 Hybrid alarm problem

Post by Dannio636 »

Thats great thank you.
Think I will just replace the siren unit. The tilt I think is intermittent from the way the siren sounds.. and the way the light on the switch in the car flashes.. not a patern just random flashes. Hoping this will solve it.
Is there a procedure for the replacing and setting up? or is it a straight swap?