Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

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mrpedersen38
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Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

Hello.

I'm in this sad situation where the massage/lumbar function is dead.
i took the seat apart and found the right motor for lumbar up/down movement is dead.
The cobber inside the DC motor where the "Coals?" ride is completely worn away, Flaking away...
the motor would "stick", where hitting it with a screwdriver started/jerked it enough to get contact with other pads of the commutator.

Does anyone here know where to find a replacement?

I have searched and searched and contacted the official Citroen Dealership here in Denmark, and they cant get that part. Only the entire seat... so not worth it for them to source it?

Junkjards local to me only have the models in without the high end seating :(
im thinking about searching in Germany, because the high end C5 models are a super rare sight here in Denmark.
In the danish "Car register" there's only a small handful of V6's and 3 4banger 2.2HDI versions, in the whole "but small" country ;)

I really hope someone can whip up a bit of magic.
im 100% sure i've seen this motor somewhere else in toys and other electronics with the long sensor shaft where the magnet wheel sits.
the electronics are EASY to swap over.

My first plan was to swap the motor/PCB with a motor from the other seat, but they are only the short shaft version, otherwise identical specs.

From another thread: viewtopic.php?p=599233
Part 14/16
Part 14/16
X7 Lumbar.PNG (192.07 KiB) Viewed 54 times
Motor part: 14 or 16. (Same part)

At the moment i can't afford to support the forum and unlock VIN lookup or anything.
I had to replace: ECU, tires, parking sensor, DPF temp sensor lately so the money bucket is a tad low at the moment, but when i have spare room i surely will, i'm having lots of joy on this forum, so i wish to support in the near future.
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myglaren
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by myglaren »

If it is the carbon brushes that are flaking then you should be able to find some similar enough to fit, with a bit of fiddling.
I used to buy FIAT alternator brushes and shave them down to fit our Hoover washing machine motor.
mrpedersen38
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Joined: 11 Dec 2019, 10:46
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

myglaren wrote:
18 Nov 2021, 15:10
If it is the carbon brushes that are flaking then you should be able to find some similar enough to fit, with a bit of fiddling.
I used to buy FIAT alternator brushes and shave them down to fit our Hoover washing machine motor.
Haha, a genius way to fix the Hoover :D

The Brushes or coal are in perfect shape.
It's the copper they are riding on, the "commutator" that is worm away completely.
and as far as i know, the old motor is not salvageable or repiarable.
i plan on stealing the circuit board, and finding a new motor. but i might be completely out of luck though :(
Attachments
DC-Motor-Diagram.gif
DC-Motor-Diagram.gif (40.41 KiB) Viewed 49 times
mrpedersen38
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

The Commutator looks like this.
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IMG_2066.jpeg
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The part you are describing is part of the 'Lumbar Assembly' and as it's just short of £1000 UK, you can see why - as it probably has the motors on for the massager.

These fail because - how can I put it delicately - if one is of larger proportions, and makes frequent use of the function (and of course I include any previous owner) then it just strains the motor.

I had this function on my X7 and only used it rarely on long journeys - but it is quite effective and does push quite hard into the back (like a shiatsu massage), so largely / heavily built people will add to the strain on these motors.
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myglaren
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by myglaren »

I wonder if you could just find a replacement motor.
Is there a makers ID on it - they are surely not specific to just Citroen seats.
mrpedersen38
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
18 Nov 2021, 15:46
The part you are describing is part of the 'Lumbar Assembly' and as it's just short of £1000 UK, you can see why - as it probably has the motors on for the massager.

These fail because - how can I put it delicately - if one is of larger proportions, and makes frequent use of the function (and of course I include any previous owner) then it just strains the motor.

I had this function on my X7 and only used it rarely on long journeys - but it is quite effective and does push quite hard into the back (like a shiatsu massage), so largely / heavily built people will add to the strain on these motors.
Exactly, Citroen here in DK cant/wont supply the part, and at 1000£ i understand why..
I have found some motors on ebay, but all with the shaft to short for the encoder wheel.
I have found a motor from a Old crate i have in the basement, and again, shaft to short.
And the non massage motors with 2 pins for 10£ on ebay from an Audi: Brose 982675-104 . (Mine has Audi/VW logos aswell).
The 2 pin and 4 pin versions are the exact same motor, just a shorter shaft on the 2 pins :(

The car have 300.000km almost now, and i bought it at 240 and used it regularly, i can see the seat have been taken apart before, and the overheat protector is soldered ON THIS MOTOR, so what youre saying is making alot of sense.
Im not particularly large, but im definitely not small or light either and with 194cm/ 6feet4 its more fun ;)

I just hope someone here on the forum knows or have an idea where to salvage the DC motor from.
HackAndSlash style.
it is "just a DC motor" the circuit on the motor is Good, just the commutator.
i fear i'm on my own if i wont pay up front for the assembly.
mrpedersen38
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

myglaren wrote:
18 Nov 2021, 16:07
I wonder if you could just find a replacement motor.
Is there a makers ID on it - they are surely not specific to just Citroen seats.
There's no markers on it, all motors are sanded to hide it.
But the wires/plugs have VW/Audi Logos on them.

I have found some Train model motors with same dimensions and double shaft on ebay. that maybe match.
(edit: Never mind, cryptic info on the listing)
I wish i knew the RPM of the DC motor from the car seat...
i have found these numbers from ebaylistings with the 2 pin NON massage variant:brose 982675-104

I have seen the motors on, Lexus, Audi, VW, PSA, Merc and surely Many more.

I'm searching like a crazy on ebay.
mrpedersen38
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by mrpedersen38 »

Ali express might be my rescue... weird to say.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005003491698222.html

A seat height adjuster motor from a Mercedes looks to be identical, only thing i need to do is swap the circuit board and worm gear.
Maybe shortening the shaft.
6£ incl. shipping.
i might order 2 of those.

but damn what are the odds :)

I will keep this thread updated.
BUT im still open for suggestions!
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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by GiveMeABreak »

It's sad but I've also had to point a member over there today for the entire electric handbrake module!
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Gregor
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Re: Citroen C5 massage seat replacement motor

Post by Gregor »

It's nothing like a good mechanic specialized in repairing e-motors couldn't fix. In my young days I fixed the same thing on worn alternator in Visa 11 RE. Some guy machined rotor on his lathe and put a new copper part on. Search for a AC/DC motors service. It should also be quite cheap to fix it.