How i made the C5 more comfortable

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Patxi
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How i made the C5 more comfortable

Post by Patxi »

HI guys!
"Yesterday, when I was mad", following some topics i posted in this forum, i decided to change the front spheres of my C5 2.0HDI Estate with the ones from the 1.8L petrol version.
A small musical interlude first - the rear spheres on the Estate do not change with engine, as the front ones do.
Here's how i did it:
First i used, perhaps, an unusual sphere removing tool... do you know those clippers used to fix pipes on to the ceiling? I used the ones with a rubber inside. 'Cos they would only give 110mm, i had to used longer screws.
Because i didn't have a wrench to unsecrew the front depressurization screw (that sits on the right longeron, between engine and suspension tower)- use a small 10mm wrench- , i started to remove the right sphere - a LOT of room for working. Left side is... ya know, tight! - but , due to pressure in the circuit it was *really* hard to unscrew it. Took me an hour to replace it. Screwing clip to sphere, hammering, unscrewing clip,h..... i used some fibre and cotton disposals i bought in the drug store to soak the leaking LDS. When i finnaly removed the sphere (phew!!!), my acking back was a mess. But no turning back now..!
And now, for the left sphere. I had to clean very well my sphere removal "tool", because the rubber slipped due to LDS between it and the metal rings. And i thought to myself "I'm gonna stay here all night...". [xx(]
Note: i started the job at 6:15PM and ended at 8:45PM - not bad at all for the 1st time, huh?
So, i attached to the sphere my clip, whammo (a 1,5cm whammo... not much space on the left side remember? - fuse box) and the little thingy just started to spin! OH JOY!!![:D][:D]
Sphere replaced, tightenned by hand. Both rubber washers where changed, too.
Engine running, and call Cindy Crawford! It's time for some Citaerobics! Up, down, up, down, some 5 times... i'm lazy!
No leaks! Checking the fluid level, i added around 1 liter, having in mind the former fluid level. The Citroën's tech spec book (some 500 pages) doesn't tell much on how to visually check the fluid level. Just mentions a "window" on the fluid containner and that it is seen with the suspension resting on the stops.
Road test (this is what i worked for):
Bad roads, bumpy roads, good roads, turns.... Smoooooth, just lika silka![8D] Man, now THIS is what i call a Citroën ride! [:D]
The only difference is in the more pronunced body roll while turning, but not much. I'm just waiting for some nice dry tarmac (it's been raining since yesterday) to make the ultimate test.
Have a C5 2.0HDI and not satisfied (like me) with the harshness of the ride? Just change the spheres! (but don't tell your Citroën dealer if you're still in the warranty period[;)])
Final notes: Pics will be posted here, as soon as i get a digital camera. The spheres are similar on the outside with no visual differences . No drilling is possible on these spheres. The main orifice has a pin crossed in the middle (perpendicular to the hole - darn!)
488 Euro were spent on this. Ouch! [B)]
All the best,
Francisco
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Hi, Francisco.
I'm glad that you didn't spend your money for nothing.
So, central bore is different than on LHM spheres? Can you tell its approximate diameter, and did you see any difference between main orifice on HDI and 1.8 sphere? How thick are the discs around the bore (approx)? On Xantia, there are 4 disc, 0.825 mm thick in total (3 x 0.22 + 1 x 0.165 mm).
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AndersDK
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Post by AndersDK »

Yep Francisco -
As Alexx writes - defo highly interesting with actual differences on spheres.
Another point : do you have the dreaded C5 rear suspension thudding/thumping/knocking during drive ?
Jon

Post by Jon »

I'd be very interested if someone could post the Volume/Pressure/Damper of C5 spheres. I'm actualy very keen on buying a C5 2.0/2.2 HDi but I appreciate that the ride comfort is not what it should be.
Also, the LDS fluid, I am told that this is basically VW/Audi PAS fluid with an orange colourant, can anyone confirm? If so, we're quids in, we've got loads where I work, cheap!
Patxi
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Post by Patxi »

The central bore's diameter is aproximately 3,5mm. It has 3 discs, together they measure around 0,8~0,9mm. This is the HDI's original sphere's measurements.
Because i did the work on the basis of "pop one out, pop the other one in", i couldn't get data from the 1,8L spheres, although i had them in my house sitting all day...
It's just a pity that i can't do the whole service and change the rear ones too to go with the front being more soft. But at least, comparing with the car, i have 44 bar against 35 back there. You can't have everything...
The body leans a little bit more and seems that the front wants to get just a teenie weenie bit under the body (i'm used to it on my Frontera, with the shocks more soft)while entering turns, but the behaviour does not seem to be greatly affected, having a heavier engine under the hood.
I'm aware of the diferent driving it now requires, but on normal ridding it seems the same C5 i met a 3 weeks ago.
No "snap, crackle and pop" [:D]on my suspension. The C5's assembling date is 17/12/2002.
Thanks for everything guys! [:D]
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Jon

Post by Jon »

Thanx, I look!
Patxi
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Post by Patxi »

Jon, as you request:
HA3:
Version/Volume/pressure/damper diametre
Front
1.8L petrol/385ccm/57 bar/ 1,9;1,3
2.0HDI(90bhp&110bhp/385ccm/57 bar/1,75;1,3
Rear:
all as above/385ccm/don't know/don't know
Note: for the rear suspension, the sphere pressure was wrong in early units (same for damper dia?)
HA3+
Front
petrol versions above 2liter/385ccm/44 bar/ 0,9;0,48
3.0V6 and 2.2HDI/385ccm/52 bar/ 0,9;0,48
Rear
Same as above. Maybe correct.
all as above/385ccm/31 bar/1,4;0,94
Hydractive regulator accumulator:
Front: 385ccm/62 bar
Rear: 385ccm/45 bar
As for the LDS, it costed me 11 Euro (around 9 euro with no VAT -> 19%) each 1L cannister.
I just can say that is smells and slips like good old thin oil for electric razor heads (and sewing machines too!) [:P]
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Francisco, thx for the info. So, it seems that total thickness of discs is similar to that in Xantia. But, 3.5 mm central orifice sounds way too big. It must have smaller diameter in the middle part, and that part is important. Can you take another look?
On two test drives with C5 (2.0 Hdi '03 and 2.0 16v '02) I didn't hear any knocking from the rear, but on HDi there was some strange noise from the front, like drop-link was on his way ... although the car had about 10.000 km.
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AndersDK
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Post by AndersDK »

LDS - what's this abbreviation for (in french) ?
- anyone have the exact specs for this fluid ?
Patxi
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Post by Patxi »

Image
Image
The C5's HDi spheres and the "special" removing tool
Cheers!
Patxi
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Post by Patxi »

LDS: "Liquide Direction Suspension"
Patxi
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Post by Patxi »

Can't get to the inner bore, not even for "eye measuring" due to that small bit crossed on the hole.
But it probably is the diameter on the specs...
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AndersDK
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Post by AndersDK »

Tx for all your information Francisco (Patxi) [:)]
- you have been extremely helpfull [:X]
It will be a while - at least here in DK - before DIY work would be an option on C5. Nobody here knows the faintest on this latest generation Citroen Hydropneumatic suspension.
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Francisco, nice pictures.
One more question. Is it possible to make closer photo of damper valve, say from 10-20 cm?
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