C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

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ianboylett
Posts: 16
Joined: 06 Mar 2019, 22:21

C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Hi ,
Have a strange issue with my picassso 2013 selection 1.6 HDi 90.
Vin VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]

Few weeks back had a error code pop up Engine repair needed. Lost any performance. Once engine restarted it was fine even if engine light stays on.
Garage said was for probably fuel filter but as mot and service was already booked following week, code was reset . Run ok for few days then same issue.
Had service and mot and seemed ok again for few days. Same issue, pulled off engine cover off to look for leaks that may let in air and noticed screw missing from filter housing and one seemed half in at an odd angle.

Back to garage who said they would fix - and they put another filter on.
Drove it like an italian for few days - 350 miles seems fine then code again.
Got a reader which shows p0087 fuel rail/ system pressure too low.
Freezeframe shows
DICTFRZF P0087
LOAD_PCT(%) 99.6
ETC(F) 183
MAP (inHg) 62.2
RMP (/MIN) 1895
VSS (MPH) 31
IAT (F) 75
MAF(LB/MIN) 6.896
FRP (PSI)169583
BARO (inHg) 28.9

Took into Cit dealership and asked for a fuel filter change thinking id been stitched up , they confirmed filter was new and suggested until 2nd code pops up its just going to be guess work.

What i have noticed is that it only faults when tank dips below half - with 250 miles remaining i guess around 4 gallons and less when accelerating on a incline.
Thinking that this may then be an issue with sender unit but Citroen spares dept say this is just a sender no pump with only pump being the HPFP.

Any suggestions as best course of action would be?
Cheers

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Hi and welcome.

Just had a look at the fault code and the correct reading for that code on THIS engine is the following:
Fault codeP0087
After sales description of the fault codeFuel circuit : The pressure measured in the injection rail is less than the setting
Description of the diagnosticsThe pressure measured in the fuel high pressure common injection rail is lower than the reference value for 820 ms even though the electrovalve is open to the upper limit
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsEngine running
Conditions of disappearance of the faultIgnition switched on
Down-grade modes if fault presentIrreversible deactivation of the vehicle cruise control (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Irreversible deactivation of the vehicle speed limiter (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning messageWarning lamp MIL
Main customer complaints likelyJerking/stalling
Lack of power
Starting problem
Suspect areasClogging of the fuel filter
Air leak on the fuel filter
Leak in fuel circuit (low pressure)
So this will cause the cruise control and speed limiter to be deactivated until the ignition is stopped and the engine restarted the next time.

Suspect areas as you can see are a blockage in the the fuel filter or an air leak or a leak in the low pressure fuel circuit.

Start with the fuel filter, maybe you have a blockage in there that is stopping the fuel flow.

ianboylett
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Joined: 06 Mar 2019, 22:21

Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Thanks Marc,
Its been ok for a week and then back again twice.
Cant see anything physical but then it seems everything is squeezed into the smallest space on modern cars. Its had 2 filters in last few weeks so not sure chucking more in will have any effect.
It did throw up a couple of codes at the weekend P0003 and P0245 when I tried to start the car after filing up.
It may be however due to the odb wifi reader being left in as it started straight away when removed

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Here's those other 2 codes....
Fault codeP0003
After sales description of the fault codeControl of the fuel flow regulator : Short circuit to earth
Description of the diagnosticsElectrical fault detected for 230 ms
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsIgnition switched on
Conditions of disappearance of the faultIgnition switched on
Down-grade modes if fault presentEngine stopped
Irreversible deactivation of the vehicle speed limiter (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Irreversible deactivation of the vehicle cruise control (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning messageWarning lamp MIL
Main customer complaints likelyJerking/stalling
Lack of power
Starting problem
Suspect areasFuel high pressure flow regulator
Electrical harnesses
CONNECTORS

Fault codeP0245
After sales description of the fault codeTurbocharger control: Short circuit to earth
Description of the diagnosticsElectrical fault detected for 1,4 s
Conditions of activation of the diagnosticsIgnition switched on
Conditions of disappearance of the faultDriving for 5 minutes
Down-grade modes if fault presentIrreversible deactivation of the vehicle cruise control (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Irreversible deactivation of the vehicle speed limiter (Need to switch the ignition off and then on, in order to make the function available again)
Deactivation of taking account of the tight spot information
Switching on of the warning lamp and/or warning messageWarning lamp MIL
Main customer complaints likelyNoise
Slightly higher fuel consumption
Lack of power
Suspect areasTurbocharger
Turbocharger fixed geometry control electrovalve
Fuse
Electrical harnesses
CONNECTORS

ianboylett
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Thanks Marc,
Decided to see it i could get diagnostics so popped into a local bosch place.

Their diagnostics guy is booked till week after easter! but comes recommended.
They did do a quick read and clear codes - one that torque did not see was dpf additive was low and suggested getting this done proir to diagnostics.

How do i know what additive i have - main dealer just said will do it for £260 but seemed a bit cagey waffling on about a pouch...

Thanks


Ian

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Give me a sec....

Right, your C3 Picasso uses a 1.1Lt Eolys Pouch. The correct additive is 'Powerflex' for your car. So you have a soft pouch that sits inside a hard shell casing.

The part number is: 9678033680. If you stick with this exact part number you cannot go wrong.

You can but this from Eurocarcare for £108.60 plus shipping:
http://www.eurocarcare.net/oil-and-flui ... pouch.html

Or from here for £128 inc. shipping:
https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Genuine-PEUGEO ... 1233788205

You will have to get access to Diagbox though in order to reset the additive counter after the operation, so the ECU knows you have replaced it and to remove the warnings - because the volume remaining is not physically measured, but is estimated based on mileage, fuel quantity and amount of additive injected. Here's the one:
ECC Eolys.PNG
s-l1600 (1).jpg
s-l1600.jpg
Unless the warning has come on the dash, I would leave it, as it is quite expensive and you may well have some fluid left to use. Once the warning comes on saying 'additive level too low' or similar, it will have worked out the mileage to the next due service - and determine if you will be able to make it before running too low. If it thinks you have too many miles to go before the next service, it will flash the warning on.

Hell Razor5543
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Just a thought, but it might be worth asking the dealership (if you go to them) to also run a diagnostics on the C3 at the same time, as it is likely they will have to hook up their diagnostics equipment to reset the additive system anyway.

ianboylett
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

I got car early 2015 with approx. 18k on it.
I have added over 110k faultless miles till recently and has never been mention at service so I can only assume it must be low by now?
Is it possible that DPF not at is optimum can cause the low pressure code by messing with injectors? or am I likely to have 2 issues

ianboylett
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Joined: 06 Mar 2019, 22:21

Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Taking time to read the invoice for the diagnostics it was code 1445 Additive Adding exceeded max threshold - particle emissions filter.
Not sure this means my eolys bag is empty as digging round on here may indicate the DPF is full / EOL.
Is this just a counter/age trigger or a real issue - wondering if a can of K2 DPF spray through the Temp sensor hole is worth doing or having a proper clean?

MikeT
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by MikeT »

ianboylett wrote:
18 Mar 2019, 10:16
Taking time to read the invoice for the diagnostics it was code 1445 Additive Adding exceeded max threshold - particle emissions filter.
Not sure this means my eolys bag is empty as digging round on here may indicate the DPF is full / EOL.
Is this just a counter/age trigger or a real issue - wondering if a can of K2 DPF spray through the Temp sensor hole is worth doing or having a proper clean?
I've had warnings on both my 1.6HDI's that the DPF is EOL, based on the additive consumption reaching a threshold during it's service life.
Despite this, I've observed Diagbox live data (Average distance between regenerations, DPF differential pressure & Soot Load readings) which showed they're both still perfectly serviceable then by telling the ECU I'd replaced them (not even had to clean them) and they're still regenerating just fine.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by GiveMeABreak »

ianboylett wrote:
15 Mar 2019, 18:47
I got car early 2015 with approx. 18k on it.
I have added over 110k faultless miles till recently and has never been mention at service so I can only assume it must be low by now?
Is it possible that DPF not at is optimum can cause the low pressure code by messing with injectors? or am I likely to have 2 issues
Your build date was 2 April 2013 just for info...perhaps a typo?

ianboylett
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Hi Marc
I was 2nd owner , had 18k on it @ 2 years old.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, with you :-D

Going back to the filter issue - 125k miles would be about right for DPF life, but you should of got some pressure differential codes if it was getting blocked - and as you've indicated it seem to be regenerating fine at present.

ianboylett
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by ianboylett »

Yea I think I need to get a Lexia to learn and stop guessing.
Was looking at something like this but 98/xp?
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Scanner-Diagbo ... A419158031

Hell Razor5543
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Re: C3 Picasso Odd behaviour

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Unless you plan on doing a lot of diagnostics on PSA vehicles you don't need to buy a Lexia system. There are forum members who have them, and are willing to help out other members. Here is the list, but not all of the members on it are still active;

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=56452