Xantia Head gasket?

Allanxantia · Unread post by **Allanxantia** » 21 Jun 2005, 03:25

New to Citroen. Picked up an old MOT'd Xantia 1.9 D with suspected head gasket failure for next to nothing. It is a 93 in excellent condition with full history, worth saving. Before I go to far just want second opinion.
It won't start, turns over but sounds like no compression. Lost power on the motorway, lost all water and died. AA man said it was head gasket, has done 139k so it is due! Had been using a bit of water for a while. Being the non turbo diesel it all looks fairly straightforward to take the head off and see, can really only be the gasket or the head, either way a cheap fix.
Problem is there seems to be no water in the oil or vice versa. seems to be just water getting into combustion chambers.
Is it the head gasket? will I get it checked and skimmed and stick it back on.
Usually a VW person so thanks in advance.

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 21 Jun 2005, 03:33

Hi.
If it was on the motorway, there is a VERY good chance then that the HEAD has cooked too, warping to hell, so it will be head off, skim, new gasket and a hop in chance of have a bit of life ...
NON turbo units are easyer to do, as there are no turbo feed and return pipes to dissconnect, just an exhaust. The head WILL come off with exhaust manifoild, but you will need to reach behind to remove the inlet manifold to get at the head bolts..
If you'd like a FULL detailed explanation of the job, let me know and I'll mail you with an how to...
GOOD Luck
Regards

Allanxantia · Unread post by **Allanxantia** » 21 Jun 2005, 03:49

I hope you are right. Done all the normal checks, belt hasn't moved etc. access isn't too bad. I was just surprised that is is knackered to the extent it won't even run, never seen total failure this way before. Trying to get it on the road for as little as possible

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 21 Jun 2005, 03:53

still worth getting presure tested other wise you might waist your loly,if ok after testting,you must have skimmed,then you will need valves sunk to corect depth,if you dont they will contact pistons best of luck malcolm

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 21 Jun 2005, 03:53

Having done MANY heads and seen many other failures I would be PRETTY sure!!!
A hose could have split or anything .... Good luck

Allanxantia · Unread post by **Allanxantia** » 21 Jun 2005, 04:24

Paul,
If you could mail me a how to I would be delighted. Got a haynes and I reckon I would be OK but shortcuts are appreciated. Also, is it expensive to get the valves ground back as suggested?

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 21 Jun 2005, 05:17

It seems unlikely that you would lose all compression due to head gasket failure. Even if the cam belt is intact it could have slipped. Take the rocker cover off and see if the camshaft is in one piece.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 21 Jun 2005, 13:07

you have to have valve seats cut deaper then you will need to re/shim valve clearances,also it is faulse econamy to use any shot cut in this job,you need to find a good cylinder head machine shop regards malcolm

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 21 Jun 2005, 13:12

ps as peter said if it has lost compresion its more likly cam belt slipt or broken,bent some of the valves,depends how fastit was going when it happend

Allanxantia · Unread post by **Allanxantia** » 21 Jun 2005, 14:08

All of the holes in cam shaft, crankshaft etc all line up as I have bolts in them in preparation for removing the head. My only other thought might be that the head is damaged internally, which is just a new head from the scrapper. I'll just have to take the head off and see.

Unread post by **citroenxm** » 22 Jun 2005, 00:45

Hi. You would be rather surprised. I've had complete compression loss due to a head gasket and warpped head... Those surfaces have to be PERFECTLY flat I'm sure you know, and also, Gaskett thickness should also be observed too, use a gasskett with 3 notches in it, the thickest one, Regards
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Peter.N.</i>

It seems unlikely that you would lose all compression due to head gasket failure. Even if the cam belt is intact it could have slipped. Take the rocker cover off and see if the camshaft is in one piece.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 22 Jun 2005, 00:54

yes citroenxm it is posible but not usul regards malcolm

fastandfurryous · Unread post by **fastandfurryous** » 22 Jun 2005, 02:24

If the cylinder head has been really really badly overheated, then the differentail thermal expansion between the head and the head bolts means that the head will actually stretch and permanently deform the bolts. When the head cools down again, the bolts are effectively loose, and there is absolutely naff-all compression available.
I've seen this happen on 2 different engines now. One was a Ford 16v petrol engine, and the other a ZX 1.9TD. Very clear in both cases was the obvious lack of compression on cranking the engine. Neither engine would even think about starting: all they managed to do was pump coolant out of the expansion tank!
If this is what has happened to this engine, then it will undoubtedly need a new set of bolts (best to fit them anyway). Any decent machine shop will be able to tell you if the surface can be machined, or if it's too badly gone. Re-grind the valves, set the clearances and you should be away.

citronut · Unread post by **citronut** » 22 Jun 2005, 03:40

you have to cut valve seats not just grind valves because after having head skimed valves are to close to head face and they will cotact pistons regards malcolm

Unread post by **Peter.N.** » 22 Jun 2005, 04:10

Not if you use a thicker gasket.