2008 Berlingo stuck glow plug electrode

[Ian_99]

Hi all!

I tried to replace my glow plugs on my 1.6HDi Berlingo (2008) (3/4 were not working anymore, checked resistance through the relay port) and what I thought would be an easy job turned into a small nightmare, first 2 of them came out except for (part of) their electrode tip
I stopped right there, not wanting to destroy the other 2.

My question is should I ask a professional (and spend close to €800 and wait 2 weeks) or is this a doable job (kit is €80)? Youtube videos make it seem very easy, like this one for the kit I would buy from amazon: youtu.be/g9mH5fdAeqU
Only thing I'm scared of if I do this myself is accidentally drilling into the engine block or pushing the electrode into the head.

Another solution I read is just running the engine and letting it "shoot" out from the pressure. But I assume there's a chance it could also be sucked into the head when starting?

Thanks for any tips/feedback! Yes I know I should have just skipped it as they're not necessary for the car (at least in this climate), but now I got no car so I at least want to get these 2 sorted.

[shtu]

It's basically impossible for us to answer - only you know if you are confident\skilled enough to take the job on. Can you drill straight? Can you tap a thread? Can you judge when to stop heaving on something before it snaps? OK, we know that last one.

For that kit, I'd prefer to see a less-shiny-and-perfect demonstration.

If the plug has snapped at the seat, there's usually a small taper to the electrode part beyond that, so it shouldn't go into the engine. You can try running the engine to blow the electrode out. I wouldn't hold out much hope, but it's nothing to lose territory. If you do try it, get as much load on the engine as possible - steep hill, lots of rpm and boost.

One tip worth repeating - when removing glowplugs, get the engine absolutely smokin' hot. Even if you have to take it out and give it a thrashing after loosening (and retightening) each plug, getting the engine really hot gives the best chance of removing them.


For entertainment - This bloke is an absolute OG at glowplug removal, though Merc diesels are more his thing,

[Paul-R]

"Tits on Tarzan". Huh-huh, huh-huh.

Great video showing the pitfalls and recovery though.

[Ian_99]

It's basically impossible for us to answer - only you know if you are confident\skilled enough to take the job on. Can you drill straight? Can you tap a thread? Can you judge when to stop heaving on something before it snaps? OK, we know that last one.

For that kit, I'd prefer to see a less-shiny-and-perfect demonstration.

If the plug has snapped at the seat, there's usually a small taper to the electrode part beyond that, so it shouldn't go into the engine. You can try running the engine to blow the electrode out. I wouldn't hold out much hope, but it's nothing to lose territory. If you do try it, get as much load on the engine as possible - steep hill, lots of rpm and boost.

One tip worth repeating - when removing glowplugs, get the engine absolutely smokin' hot. Even if you have to take it out and give it a thrashing after loosening (and retightening) each plug, getting the engine really hot gives the best chance of removing them.


For entertainment - This bloke is an absolute OG at glowplug removal, though Merc diesels are more his thing,

Thanks for the reply, I did order the kit to have a hand on look and then judge if I see myself capable of doing it. I'm past the grieving phase so if that tool has a decent drill guide (I don't trust myself drilling straight with such tiny margins without a decent guide rod). It has 30 day free returns anyway so if I don't use it it's no money wasted.
The second glowplug is still somewhat attached, feels like a metal wire, so I might give my patience a test and dump it with penetrating oil and maybe some EGR cleaner for a while to loosen the carbon, then try to very slowly pull on it and hope it won't snap off. Would these hurt the engine? As I would expect some of the oil to get into the head.

[shtu]

Stuff like egr cleaner will mostly evaporate, and I spray penetrating oil into the cylinders of any engine I'm storing for an extended period, never done any harm.

The "wire" you mention is probably the "tungsten" that the bloke in that video mentions. That's a bit of a snag if you cant get it out, as it's going to prevent you from drilling out the tip.

[Ian_99]

Stuff like egr cleaner will mostly evaporate, and I spray penetrating oil into the cylinders of any engine I'm storing for an extended period, never done any harm.

The "wire" you mention is probably the "tungsten" that the bloke in that video mentions. That's a bit of a snag if you cant get it out, as it's going to prevent you from drilling out the tip.

I'll stick to penetrating oil then. But wouldn't that piece of tungsten sticking out be a good thing if I can grip on to it with some pliers? The whole glow plug body is already out so either I'll pull the whole tip out (hopefully) or just the tungsten bit. One way I'm really glad the thread itself came out clean, drilling that out would be a huge pain in the butt.
Here's a picture of this glow plug:


Edit:
Took some measurements and the other plug electrode (the one that snapped off completely) has moved about 27mm up, so maybe turning the engine and letting it shoot out isn't that unreasonable...
As for the other one, currently letting it soak penetrating oil, going to use some heat and pray it will move, a 2kW hair dryer is the best I got besides a blow torch.

[MattBLancs]

Been there, done that!

I went a different way - rather than drilling out, I took the engine out and head off, then tapped out the glow plug remnants from the inside. As said it'll not get pulled into the engine. Not sure if the combustion pressures are high enough to pop it out (but worth a try I guess)

I took engine out as was rectifying a dying turbo (and so VERY significant clean out off all the crud in the engine is needed. Taking engine out makes that easier. Taking head off makes that easier too!)

So it is doable on the driveway by the above methods (if you go for it like I did! Jump in with both feet! )

[shtu]

But wouldn't that piece of tungsten sticking out be a good thing if I can grip on to it with some pliers? The whole glow plug body is already out so either I'll pull the whole tip out (hopefully) or just the tungsten bit.

It's "give it a shot" territory. I'd be using mole grips and maybe trying to get a lever underneath them. Pliers, you'll never grip tight enough.

2kW hair dryer is the best I got besides a blow torch.

Don't waste your electricity. That won't get it hot enough to make any difference, aluminium is really effective at dissipating heat. It's one reason that welding onto broken bolts is so effective - several hundred degrees of heat straight into the seized part.

If the bits really have moved that much, put it back together and give it a thrashing.

[Ian_99]

So it is doable on the driveway by the above methods (if you go for it like I did! Jump in with both feet! )

I don't trust myself dismantling nearly the entire engine... If I I didn't spend nearly 1000 to rebuild the AC (I suppose I paid for the learning experience as well ) I'd be tempted. But right now any risk of destroying the engine is something I'd rather avoid. It's already a painful puzzle with 3/4 working cars for our family, shooting myself in one foot is good enough!

Don't waste your electricity. That won't get it hot enough to make any difference, aluminium is really effective at dissipating heat. It's one reason that welding onto broken bolts is so effective - several hundred degrees of heat straight into the seized part.

If the bits really have moved that much, put it back together and give it a thrashing.

Of course! Somehow I didn't think that a giant block of aluminum is also a giant heat sink, a bad one but still good at conducing heat...
I'll first try to get the one that's still attached out by pulling the glow plug itself after letting it soak in penetrating oil overnight, if it snaps and I can't reach it... Then it's time to cross my fingers and take it for a drive.

[Paul-R]

Just an afterthought about the video.

The chap used engine oil on the new glowplugs before screwing them in. I would have thought that oil might be liable to carbonise with the heat and actually make the next time they had to be removed more difficult. My instinct would be to use copper grease or the modern white high temperature grease before screwing them in. Opinions?

[shtu]

Literally anything is better than nothing, and the temperatures in the head aren't all that high so I doubt engine oil would carbonise. The carbon comes from blow-by. Fitted with a dmaged or dirty seat, etc.

As I have a Lifetime Supply Size can of it, I use a smear of copper anti-seize on the seat, body and threads. There are non-copper anti-seize compounds if you're going to lose sleep about the possibility of galvanic corrsion between copper and aluminium.

[myglaren]

What about graphite?
Not graphited grease, just graphite as a 'dry lubricant' that shouldn't be turned into glue by the heat.

[mickthemaverick]

Teflon?

[myglaren]

Teflon?

Will it withstand the heat?

[mickthemaverick]

Works in a frying pan!!