Picasso II 2015 (B78) Adblue fault after refill

[WillyR]

Good Day all, and may your 2024 be blessed with minimal motoring problems.

Yesterday, on my way down the M20, I received an ADBLUE fault message "Refill emissions addiive: Starting prevented in 1500 mi" - the message disappeared after about 10 seconds, but the UREA warning light stayed on. I completed my journey, stopping at my locl Halfords and picking uo 5 5-litre pouches of Adblue, which I filled the Adblue tank with when I got home. I left the car standing for about 20 minutes after filling (not far from full), then started it. Sadly, something is not right because the alarm reappeared on starting, and has done so every time the engine has been started since, disappearing after about 10 seconds (UREA warning is permanent when the ignition is on).

Checking the car with my TOPDON diag box (I know, I should have bought a Lexia but I thought I might one day desert PSA, so universal diagnostics facilities sounded good at the time), there is no ADBLUE fault shown in the TOPDON scans and health checks, but the cut-off countdown at 1500 miles shows at every engine start-up, and the Orange Urea alarm on the dash display is on at all times the ignition is ON. I have checked many posts saying that early 2015 Euro 6 MkII Picassos were liable to internal problems with the Adblue systems, and many tanks were replaced with varying Citroen assistance, as well as tank caps with breathers. My tank cap definitely does not breathe (I nearly burst my cheeks trying to blow through it).

Any suggestions welcome. On top of the adblue problem, because because I have been scolded - reasonably gently - for not using a Lexia diag box in my past problems, I have decided to break down and conform. Sourcing advice requested please, Sirs / Mesdames. If sourcing advice could be called advertising in some way, please stay out of trouble and message me, if that is allowed.

Lets hope I don't have to add another 4-figure sum to Citroen's coffers, replacing my adblue tank.

[RichardW]

Can you read live data with your scanner? What does it say about AdBlue level?

At the moment you can't get a Diagbox interface as all the clones have sold apparently and a new device is pending.

[WillyR]

Thanks for the super speedy response @Richard.

I have to own up to not having tried the live DATa yet, so it is number one on my list in the morning (get me out of cleaning the fireplace).
As far as a new Lexia is concerned, I thought I had found a complete unit this afternoon. If OK with you, I will message you with the web details. It seems to be a complete unit. If not, I guess I'll be waiting a while, and staying below the 1500 mile limit if the problem is real.

Will

[WillyR]

Can you read live data with your scanner? What does it say about AdBlue level?

At the moment you can't get a Diagbox interface as all the clones have sold apparently and a new device is pending.

*******************

I spent ages today trying to find the Adblue control and monitoring on my TOPDON Diag Box - very clever machine if one can understand the diabolical "Chinglish" in it. It spends more time commenting on the Multiplexed DPF control than Adblue... strange, because my car does not use Eolys fluid. It definitely does, however, use Adblue.

I tried to find a live stream from the Adblue system, and the only thing that happened was that I got trapped in the Adblue "reset" procedure which turned out to be a way to reset the alarms in a very similar way to that described in my handbook, except the timings in my TOPDON are WAY LONGER than in the handbook. The upshot is that I no longer have the jangling alarm every time I start the engine, and the Orange UREA indicator on the dash no longer glows. Short of going to a Citroen dealer to have the system hooked up on their computers (inviting all kind of "you must fix this or that") - my regular dealer, Barretts in Canterbury closed very abruptly a month after the car had its annual Service in July last year - I'm a bit nervous that the Adblue system may not be working correctly.

The "Multiplexed Diesel Additive Pump" said it had less than 1.5 litres in it but it also said that in the beginning it only held 3 litres, whereas we know the adblue tank holds 17 litres. There was no specific mention of EOLYS, but the pump and reservoir that should be just inboard of the left rear wheel (as my C5 had) is definitely not there.

After today, I am definitely going to buy a Lexia 3, but in the meanwhile, can you point me in the direction of anyone in Kent who owns a Lexia and may be willing to look at my system while I wait for my own device to arrive. Thanks again for steering me towards the live data, even though I didn't actually find it. Everything seems OK at the moment.

Thanks again
Will

[RichardW]

Post up the VIN, and we can have a look, but I would expect a 2015 car to have both Eolys and AdBlue.

Link to the thread with list of Lexia / Diagbox owners https://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/ ... hp?t=56452

[wheeler]

Unless someone has deleted the system it will also have eolys.
Its not something that has been designed to be user refillable & may not need re filling till 80k miles so you may not be aware it has it.

[WillyR]

Post up the VIN, and we can have a look, but I would expect a 2015 car to have both Eolys and AdBlue.

Link to the thread with list of Lexia / Diagbox owners https://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/ ... hp?t=56452

1. VIN VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff] - I will double check under the car as soon as it is dry enough... my assumption that it has no Eolys system was partly based on the assertion by the two dealers I have used that it does not use Eolys - Thames Ford Maidstone, where I bought the car new - no longer Citroen agent, and Barretts Citroen Canterbury - closed down Aug/Sept 202, and merely tells me to activate a regeneration by appropriate driving if the Srvice light comes on at any time. Checking my Handbook, there is (coded) reference to the Eolys system (P316/317), but it is not mentioned by name, and there is no alaem indicator on the dash display other than the General SERVICE indicator, although the handbook mentions a displayed eolys system fault message.

2. Thanks. I have found one in my home town, and will message him/her after this chat.

I tried to PM you last night but after SUBMITting, my message has vanished. I sent a PM, as I was not sure if mentioning a Lexia systems source by name / web address would be allowed. I also asked if the displayed Item in the link was everything required following your informtion regarding the clone device no longer being available. Should I PM you again, or is it OK to mention the supplier and link in public?

Will

[GiveMeABreak]

You do have a DPF with additive system, shown at (16):

Eolys additive system is entirely separate with different functions from the SCR system:

DPF and Eolys additive to trap & burn off particulate matter via regeneration,
SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) system to further treat NOx emissions.

I think it's only some specific later vehicles that have a DPF without the Eolys additive system. My Aircross has a DPF but uses no additive system. It does have separately the SCR system with Adblue as well.

[WillyR]

Unless someone has deleted the system it will also have eolys.
Its not something that has been designed to be user refillable & may not need re filling till 80k miles so you may not be aware it has it.

I'm not sure who the "someone" who could have deleted the system might be. I didn't and I bought the car New. My 2001 C5 2.2 HDi had Eolys, and refill was mentioned at every service, in contrast to no mention in any service invoice in 8 years with my GPicasso II... I wonder if someone was taking a bit of "the mick..?" I refilled it (the C5) several times after 90,000 miles, as the garage price of Eolys was exhorbitant in the extreme, and I eventually gave the car away to an enthusiast in The Medway after 220,000 very happy miles.

I will be crawling under the car as soon as it is dry enough to do so.

Thanks for your info
Will

[WillyR]

You do have a DPF with additive system, shown at (16):



Eolys additive system is entirely separate with different functions from the SCR system:

DPF and Eolys additive to trap & burn off particulate matter via regeneration,
SCR (Selective Catalytic Reduction) system to further treat NOx emissions.

I think it's only some specific later vehicles that have a DPF without the Eolys additive system. My Aircross has a DPF but uses no additive system. It does have separately the SCR system with Adblue as well.

Thanks Marc.
Thanks for the explanation, which I already knew after 9 years with my C5, but a handy reminder never goes miss, especially when in doubt about the existence of the item. That is also obviously why I didnt find it in my earlier (half-hearted) search for a separate eolys tank, as it is not under the left rear wheel arch Where my C5's tank was, and a post that I read somewhere suggested it was on my Picasso. Am I correct that the picture you have shown is the fuel tank and pump assembly with Eolys tank & pump at 16? Makes sense to have them together like that.

Do you know if the newer models without Eolys system have suffered in any way, particulrly DPF clogging? I ask because I'm looking for a 2021/22 model to see my driving years out

Regards
Will

[GiveMeABreak]

Yes, the above is the fuel tank shown with the additive reservoir next to it at (16).

My own vehicle is a 2020 and has the 1.5 HDi engine and this particular variant has no additive system for the DPF. I cant advise of models with and without the additive reservoir without knowing the VIN for a check, but I suspect that it will not be 2.0-engined versions.

[WillyR]

Yes, the above is the fuel tank shown with the additive reservoir next to it at (16).

My own vehicle is a 2020 and has the 1.5 HDi engine and this particular variant has no additive system for the DPF. I cant advise of models with and without the additive reservoir without knowing the VIN for a check, but I suspect that it will not be 2.0-engined versions.

Thanks for confirming the tank drawing. That little 1.5 engine is a cracker, although I can't get my ears to like the 3-cylinder sound, but as I note from previous investigation that it is a cleaner engine than my 2.0 150hp engine is, I wont mind losing a couple of Neddies if I can find the right car... and that EAT8 gearbox is WAAY better than the EAT6 in my C4 G Picasso

Cheers
Will

[GiveMeABreak]

3 Cylinders? The 1.5 HDi has 4 cylinders Willy. Only the 1.2 Petrol EB2 engines have 3 cylinders, so you must be thinking of those.

[WillyR]

3 Cylinders? The 1.5 HDi has 4 cylinders Willy. Only the 1.2 Petrol EB2 engines have 3 cylinders, so you must be thinking of those.

Oops... I've never been in the diesel babies, and assumed (NEVER ASSUME, BOY. It can be bad for your health!) the diesel was also 3-cyl. I had a petrol 308 1.2 with EAT8 for a couple of weeks in France about 3 years ago, and it was magic, but Oh, that sound.... at least it was almost inaudible except under acceleration.

I'm even more happy to try and find a 1.5 FOUR-cyl Picasso now

Thanks for that
Willy (strange hearing that. I was born and brought up in Africa, leaving in 1988, and VERY FEW people here call me Willy (don't stop, please).