C4 Diesel Adblue Tank

[Phi2022]

So we are having a similar problem to many of you. Our 2015 reg Citroen grand c4 picasso (bought from a Citroen dealership in dec 2020) has come up with urea warning, and emissions failure.
That was a couple of weeks ago, took it to our local garage, got it serviced and adblue added, and all service and urea lights went off.
Just to add the car has only done 46000 miles and of that has only been 7000 by us since we got it, (as don't drive it out much since covid and job changes)
Roll on to today and the urea light has come back on, and the emissions failure warning. Then around half an hour later on our return journey, got a engine light come up, with engine failure and take to garage to be fixed come up. With then another warning of 700 miles before car won't start.
The local garage that did our service is getting us in first thing tomorrow to see what the warning codes are saying.
Can anyone advise if I should be contacting Citroen to sort this (do you think my local garage will be able to help).
Our big issue is we are due to drive up to London (175 miles from home ) on Thursday to fly out on holiday for a month (with our car being left at a meet and greet).
With the issue, is it super dangerous to drive the car, especially that far? Just no way of getting it fixed if it is the full tank needing replaced before we go away.
Our car has also never given any warning or reminders to top up the adblue since we got it, so not sure if that is how it should be or, if that is another issue with the car.
Totally stressed out and wondering how we will get to the airport and back if we don't have our car.
Then add on top of that the potential £000,s it will most likely be costing us.
Any advice welcomed. Thank you

[GiveMeABreak]

Unfortunately I don't think there's much you can do before Thursday to be honest. If it's a tank issue, it will need ordering in. As for warranty your car is 7 years old now, so may be out of scope for any Citroen warranty on the tank.

Until you know exactly what the fault codes are and given that you have now had the Adblue topped up, it will need further looking at. It could be a tank / pump issue or Urea injector / urea harness etc., so does need looking at. Unfortunately, if the Urea injection is deemed not to be working based on the NOx sensor readings, then it's going to throw a wobbly. Whether this means you can make it to the Airport and back is something anyone's guess. If the countdown from 700 is decreasing then of course you engine starting will be prohibited once it reaches zero. Of course we can't say whether you will have any related problems too like engine speed power being reduced as a consequence (emissions regs).

See what your garage says, but in either case, it won't be something quick because of the investigation that needs doing before hand to track the specific issue.

[Paul-R]

When the tank went on our 308 we were half way through France on our way home. I did a quick mental calculation and figured that we could get to Calais well within the 700 mile countdown. Once on the other side my reasoning was that providing I drove all the way home without stopping the engine we would be OK. It's only restarting that's going to be prohibited, the car won't come to a juddering halt.

In the end I didn't need to put the theory to the test as every so often the fault would clear for a short while and then when it came back the counter had been reset. The resetting didn't last very long but it was enough to get us back home without worry.

So, we were able to drive 700 odd miles with a faulty Adblue tank. I suffered no power restrictions during that time as, when you think about it, the Adblue is only there to reduce NOx emissions and this all takes place outside of the engine, For the same reason the engine won't be harmed by the fault. In fact, apart from the constant error messages popping up over the maps, the only inconvenience was a definite strange smell coming from the exhaust.

Once home I was able to order a replacement tank and arrange for it to be fitted and the software update implemented. The biggest inconvenience was the dent in wallet as a result of all this! I can post a link to the thread I opened up here about this at the time if you want.

[MVentura]

Still, armed with the knowledge you have all supplied, which I will print off, plus other information I've just found on a site called cactusforums.co.uk, I think that I should be able to convince them that there is a real problem they need to acknowledge.

If that does not work you could always try contacting Citroen UK Head Office, to see if they can help. If THEY don't know about the Ad Blue tank problem...!

Hello. I'm new to this forum and having the same issue wit the Adblue tank...needs to be replaced.

I would like to ask if it was possible to share the mentioned "armed with the knowledge you have all supplied, which I will print off, plus other information I've just found" in just one document, to use it to press Citroen to replace my car's Adblue tank without charging me for that...

Thanks.

Kind regards

[GiveMeABreak]

@ MVentura:

There is no 'document' as such, only what the poster has accumulated from the Forum contributors. No two vehicles have the same circumstances, so what assistance you may or may not get from Citroen will be down to the age, mileage and servicing history of your vehicle.

[Uncle Tom Cobley]

Sorry new member here and first post and a bit late to the party on this one but came across this site and thread during an internet search.

I own a 2016 Picasso C4 Grand and have owned her from new , she has done just over 73000 miles and has full service history ( first three years Citroen main dealers then afterwards independents ) but well out of warranty.

About three weeks ago the engine management light came on… Engine fault : Have the vehicle repaired … With the urea and service lights also illuminated.
I stopped the car turned the engine off , waited a few minutes re started and the EML came back on but the urea and service lights had gone out.
I noticed that there was fluid rapidly dripping out from underneath the car and the exhaust had blue smoke which smelt very strongly of ammonia ( ad blue ).
I took the car to a long time friend of mine who plugged it into his diagnostics module and it came up with fault code P20F6 : Reductant injection valve stuck open bank 1 unit 1. And P20E8 Reductant pressure too low.

On the ramp you could see ad blue pouring out of the injector unit that goes into the exhaust.
I went to my local Citroen dealer ( Yeomans Torquay ) and picked up a new injector and got my friend to fit it, he warned me though that his diagnostic equipment could not initiate any repair or re calibrate the system although it could put out the fault lights.

Duly fitted the car ran fine for ten days whilst burning off the large volume of ad blue that had been pumped into the exhaust, like I say ten days then bang ! All the lights came back on and once again ad blue was rapidly pouring out of the new injector. This time the urea light was flashing and the 700 mile restart warning was coming on continually.

So this time I rang Yeomans Citroen main dealers in Exeter ( where I purchased the car ) and explained the situation and they asked if the system had been re initiated? Of course the answer was no.
So with a heavy heart I took it to them and it cost £132 to put it on their diagnostic equipment for just an hour and a half.

The problem turned out to be the tank, the urea pressure was too low ( P20E8 )
The cost of a replacement tank as you all know is hideous ( btw you could hear the pump continually running ) the total cost of the repair was just shy of fifteen hundred quid !! I nearly fell backwards ! BUT….Citroen were prepared to cover a big chunk of the cost , the entire price for a brand new tank, plus labour, ad blue and to re initiate the system ,plus the £132 diagnostics on the day came to £530, I couldn’t believe it and I didn’t even have to ask for any kind of good will gesture.

Now that’s still a lot of money but far better than the £1630 it would have cost.
What I am saying here is don’t be hesitant on taking it to the main dealer obviously not BSM as a previous poster did, I would certainly be taking legal advice on that as It is plainly obvious that there is a known problem with the ad blue system on these French cars and that is further amplified by the fact that my dealer have over a dozen on back order from Citroen.

[GiveMeABreak]

The Adblue tanks would appear to be warranted for at least 5 years, so you may of just been on the upper limit...., but thanks for posting, I'm sure it will assist others.

[Uncle Tom Cobley]

The Adblue tanks would appear to be warranted for at least 5 years, so you may of just been on the upper limit...., but thanks for posting, I'm sure it will assist others.

Thanks Marc,
Purchased in May 2016 ? New tank ( not yet fitted ) is warranted for 12 months though ?

[GiveMeABreak]

Yes, that's correct, as early tanks may of had production issues and may also have been revised and updated since then, so once you have had a replacement FOC or at a reduced cost, you will get the standard 12 months warranty going forward - unless of course you have a dealership extended warranty in force.

[Uncle Tom Cobley]

Here’s a strange thing ?
When I took my car to the main dealer on Wednesday they put 7 litres of ad blue in and reset the urea countdown timer from 700 miles back to 1500 miles for me.

Coming home the lights came back on EML/UREA/SERVICE and then closer to home the countdown timer came back on ( emissions fault / urea .. Starting prevented in 700 miles ) by Friday this was down to 650 miles.

But yesterday zilch ! Not the countdown but I mean no lights on at all and no pump continually going through its thing the fault disappeared completely ? ( I know its bound to be still there so wouldn’t take a chance in going any distance) but I’m off today for a couple of weeks so car won’t be used and I was meant to be driving it to Germany on Saturday ( a trip I have done many times) the whole thing really has scuppered our plans and have now booked flights.

Just wondering if it could be a computer fault but they also updated the ECU on Wednesday?
Strange indeed….

[Paul-R]

... and reset the urea countdown timer from 700 miles back to 1500 miles for me.

I don't understand this. The countdown is either at 700 miles counting down (or some figure on the way) or no countdown at all. There is no 1500 miles countdown to prevent starting on the urea system to my knowledge.

You're not confusing it with the servicing information message as you approach the regular service time/distance are you?

[GiveMeABreak]

I'm not sure what you are referring to Paul, but yes there is a starting prevention system in place if the remaining Adblue mileage counter reaches zero.

1500 is the standard UREA counter starting mileage, and will remain at this figure (even when the tank is full) until the Adblue drops to approximately the quantity that provides a range of 1500 miles, then this counter will start counting down the miles to engine starting prohibition with multiple warnings and reminders to top up.

Normally after a topping up, the counter will reset itself and revert back to the 1500 after some time driving. It may of just needed some time to settle in your case.

I top mine up about every couple of months / when I remember, as personally I don't want to allow it to get too low for several reasons.

[Uncle Tom Cobley]

... and reset the urea countdown timer from 700 miles back to 1500 miles for me.

I don't understand this. The countdown is either at 700 miles counting down (or some figure on the way) or no countdown at all. There is no 1500 miles countdown to prevent starting on the urea system to my knowledge.

You're not confusing it with the servicing information message as you approach the regular service time/distance are you?

Hi Paul,
No my 2016 C4 Picasso Grand it’s definitely 1500 miles .
When the Urea light comes on it says starting prevented in 1500 miles and always has done and starts its countdown.
With the fault it never came on then suddenly it started coming on warning 700 miles left before starting would be disabled.
Also the main dealer set it back to the 1500 miles.
Incidentally I just took my dog to the kennels ( 20 mile round trip ) and still no lights ?
Beginning to think faulty sensor ?

[Paul-R]

I'm not sure what you are referring to Paul, but yes there is a starting prevention system in place if the remaining Adblue mileage counter reaches zero.

1500 is the standard UREA counter starting mileage, and will remain at this figure (even when the tank is full) until the Adblue drops to approximately the quantity that provides a range of 1500 miles, then this counter will start counting down the miles to engine starting prohibition with multiple warnings and reminders to top up.

Of course I'm aware of the starting prevention countdown but my experience of this on the 308 (and there have been far too many of them) is that the starting point is 700 miles not 1500 miles. I was wondering whether this 1500 miles might be the gentle alert you get from the system when you're approaching regular servicing time.

If there is a different starting mileage for some vehicles this is the first time I've heard of it.

[GiveMeABreak]

No it's not that. The 1500 countdown is the same on mine and on many later vehicles.