First ever Citroen - Invalid oil level

[xantia_v6]

I am not sure if you realise that the oil level sensor only gives 3 readings, low, normal and invalid. Any oil level higher than (its definition of) normal will return an invalid result. It seems that there was originally a misalignment between the dipstick markings and the sensor levels. Try removing 500 ml of oil and see what happens.

[GiveMeABreak]

There is a Technical Service Bulletin for this vehicle fitted with the DW10CTED4 engine.

The fault concerns:

• Engine oil level too high.
• Inaccuracy of the dipstick.

A diagnostic is first required to see if this remedial action is required or not.

The action should only be applied if one or more of the following fault codes are present: F159, B1818.

If these fault codes are not present, then the repair should not be undertaken (as corrective action may already have been taken at the factory and application of this action could create a problem).

Fault codes F159 and B1818 relate to an excessive level of oil. Do not replace parts.

Repair

"A" = 6 cm.
Remove the dipstick guide tube (1).
Cut the bottom of the dipstick guide tube (1) according to the dimension "A".
Refit the dipstick guide tube (1).
Correct the quantity of engine oil.
Erase the fault codes.

[Paul-R]

There is a Technical Service Bulletin for this vehicle fitted with the DW10CTED4 engine.

It's no good. I've already told him about that and he doesn't believe it works.

[nocturnal]

I never got those fault codes via my OBD scanner.

Dashboard read invalid with: zero oil, 4 litres, 4.5 litres, 4.75 litres, 5 litres, 5.25 litres, 5.5 (what it is supposed to contain)

But I'll try and suck 0.5 litres or more it out again and see what happens.

Err Paul-r I have more faith if 6cm is removed from the dipstick, this is new knowledge to me.

How did it get to 123k miles 10 years later and no mechanical damage? It runs sweet and even sounds sweet.

Will update when I find my sucker devices

[Paul-R]

Yes but have you contacted a dealer to see if the procedure has already been done? This surely has to be the very first item to tick off the list. If the tube has been shortened (not the dipstick!) then you know the problem lies elsewhere.

What are you using to scan for codes?

[nocturnal]

Today... Wasted 3 hours draining out 700-800ml of oil through the dipstick tube and I knew it wouldn't do the oil level reading any good, tested several times up to the most oil removed, as I said before it didn't work when filling it up weeks ago.

It must be the sensor so I've ordered a genuine part for £17.

Will report back once I fit it.

Was just using a cheapo OBDii scanner I bought years ago, I'm well aware of it's limitations.

[Paul-R]

Yes but have you contacted a dealer to see if the procedure has already been done? This surely has to be the very first item to tick off the list. If the tube has been shortened (not the dipstick!) then you know the problem lies elsewhere.

What are you using to scan for codes?

?? to both.

[nocturnal]

Today I changed the oil level sensor and no success, I plugged it in before I fitted it and same 'invalid' message and as I knew already had nothing to do with oil level or dipsticks.

Must be damaged wiring or something else.

Tip: If you are changing the oil level sensor you need a 24mm deep socket.

[nocturnal]

Also the photo of a sensor with a single wire I posted earlier in this thread is not the oil level sensor. The oil level sensor is on the other side of the dipstick almost pointing vertically down (which makes sense) and this sensor does have 2 pins and neither are grounded to the sensor metal body.

Looking at the sensor it does not look like a part which can fail easily, there are basically 2 electrodes (probably each pin connects to each electrode) running parallel inside a plastic protective case holding the electrodes in place and allowing the engine oil to flow between them through openings in the plastic case. The amount of resistance between the electrodes varies with oil contact and therefore oil level and the ECU should then read it and convey a yay or nay message on the dash but not mine.

[pedro88]

hi nocturnal, can you tell me if this fixed your issue.? ive just changed the oil in my 2012 citroen c5 2.0 hdi 163 exclusive and its reading incorrect oil level... top up oil level. its measuring full on the dipstick, but fault coming up on dash. many thanks.

[nocturnal]

Never ever got the oil level on dash working so gave up

[GiveMeABreak]

hi nocturnal, can you tell me if this fixed your issue.? ive just changed the oil in my 2012 citroen c5 2.0 hdi 163 exclusive and its reading incorrect oil level... top up oil level. its measuring full on the dipstick, but fault coming up on dash. many thanks.

This is a possible problem on 163 DW10CTED4 engines.

If you have an F40A fault recorded in the BSI, this can happen when the coolant temperature is higher than 40 °C where no oil level measurement check takes place. If the oil level has therefore not been measured, you will get an F40A fault logged. This will disappear when the oil is next measured - usually when the ignition is next switched on and when the coolant is lower than 40 °C.

So official recommendation is to use the dipstick to manually measure the oil.

[pedro88]

thanks for the help.

[nocturnal]

"So official recommendation is to use the dipstick to manually measure the oil."

That's what I just did, replacing the sensor didn't work but not sure if a new sensor needs reprogrammed or something.

Anyways engine seems healthy, uses very little oil at at nearly 140k miles.

Barely got it through MOT with power steering leak, just power hosed it off the suspension before test. I've put less than 1 litre LDS fluid into it in 3+ years so it's not too bad and multiple stop leak fluid attempts. Same with coolant leak on rear or engine, just keep topping it and putting stopper into it also.

Next car is a C1 1.0 not the 1.2 PureCrap belt belt version. 1.0 seems bullet proof, seen some for sale with 175k miles!!! On a 998cc engine and it has timing chain.

[renel]

Hi, I read all your posts about your current problems. I do not have the same engine as you have, but as a 10+ models over 20+ years I have a few comments. First , good your window now works, I lean to the comment on lubricating the window rails, since when the window is stopped by anything (fingers;-)(pinch mode) then the system senses that, and goes back for safety (dry rails also gives resistance so system thinks I go to pinch mode. You keep saying 6l of oil "to minimum" can not be correct, then the max would perhaps be 8l??, dont you meen 6l to max? that would even be high!, I now have a petrol, but my old 1.6hdi did only 4.25l to max which I think is not much, but hey thats in the OM, I traded it in at 275000km. I also have a yellow tipped dipstick, difficult to see when oil is clean. Then, "engine oil level sensor" with 1 wire, yes, because it is an "oil PRESSURE sensor"! Do not know whether you at all have a level sensor on yours, on my 2015 petrol I have that and there are 3 wires on that. So I have 2 sensors, maybe you have that as well. The pressure sensor is a small short thing, normalli situated somewher sideways into the block, where the level sensor (on mine) is 160mm down into the sump, pointing upwards from the lower part of the block. Hope you are happy with your car, far from perfect but I love it;-)