C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

This is the Forum for all your Citroen Technical Questions, Problems or Advice.

Moderator: RichardW

Post Reply
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Hi,
I recently fitted some refurbished diesel injectors to my 2.2 HDI in my C5.
The engine started and ticked over nicely, but, when I took it for a drive, as soon as I pressed the accelerator pedal to move off there was a bang followed by a loud ticking/banging noise and lots of white smoke (I assume unburned fuel).

I've taken the 'new' injectors out and removed the inlet manifold. All the rockers look ok.

Of the 4 injectors 3 were dry and the 2nd from left was very wet.

Does anyone have any experience of this or any ideas what might be the problem?
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36990
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Apart from the specific injector issue you mentioned, were these the correct injectors and were they coded to the engine ECU?
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Hi,
Yes, they were carefully selected and are definately the correct injectors.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
User avatar
Paul-R
Donor 2023
Posts: 6916
Joined: 07 May 2009, 16:24
Location: Wirral, NW England; Vaucluse 84, France
Lexia Available: Yes
My Cars: 2015 1.6 Blue HDi 120 Peugeot 308 Active SW
2013 2.0 HDi 163 C5 Exclusive Tourer
2003 2.0 HDi 110 C5 Exclusive Estate (Gone)
2001 2.0 HDi 90 Xsara Estate (Gone)
x 1369

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by Paul-R »

Were they coded in to the engine?
As I get older I think a lot about the hereafter - I go into a room and then wonder what I'm here after.

Inside every old person is a young person wondering what the hell happened.

"Trying is the first step towards failure" ~ Homer J Simpson​
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Hi,
The injectors don't need to be coded on this engine.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

The engine is a 2002 4HX(DW12TED4) with a BOSCH injection system (apart from a Siemens fuel filter).
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
User avatar
GiveMeABreak
Forum Admin Team
Posts: 36990
Joined: 15 Sep 2015, 19:38
Location: West Wales
My Cars: C3 Aircross SUV HDi Flair Peperoncino Red (The Chili Hornet)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi Exclusive Mativoire Beige (The Golden Hornet)
C3 1.6 HDi Exclusive Aluminium Grey (The Silver Hornet)
C5 MK II 2.0 HDi Exclusive Obsidian Black
C5 MK I 2.0 HDi SX Wicked Red
Xantia S2 2.0 HDi SX Hermes Red
C15 Romahome White
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Emerald Green Pearlescent
XM 2.0 Turbo Prestige Polar White
XM 2.0 SX Polar White
CX 20 Polar White
GS 1220 Geranium Red
CX 2.4 Prestige C-Matic Nevada Beige
GS 1000 Cedreat Yellow
x 5644

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by GiveMeABreak »

No, but the injector mileage counter may need resetting in the injection ECU depending on the mileage if 3-4 injectors have been replaced. From 0 to 37.5k miles the counter needs setting to 0 KMs. From 37.5K to 50k miles the counter needs resetting to 80k Kilometers If the mileage is greater than 50k miles, then take no action on this front. Ditto for the MAF.

If the Engine ECU is changed then the Injector class must be checked.
Please Don't PM Me For Technical Help

Marc
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Hi, and thanks for the replies so far. It's great to know there's lot's of knowledge and experience amongst the guys on this forum.

The engine has done just over 170,000 miles and all 4 injectors were replaced.

A friend of mine used to be a mechanic and, when I told him what had happened he immediately said he'd seen something like this before and in that case it turned out to be a miss placed seal in the top of one of the injectors. This blocked the fuel return to the 'leak off' pipes and resulted in the injector overfuelling into the cylinder. In his example, Rockers were broken on the affected cylinder.

So, I've checked my rockers and they all look good.

I'm next planning to remove the sump to see if there's damage to the big ends etc.

The banging when it happened was loud and sounded just like when I was a boy with my grandad when a big end bearing went on his mark 1 Cortina estate ( in about 1968).
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Hi, I've looked at some Youtube videos of Injector Knock or Diesel Knock and I'm suspecting this is the problem I have.

I've not had chance to do any more to my C5 yet. So, in the previous reply when you say Injector Mileage Counter do you mean how many miles an injector has been used for or how many miles the car has done.

The mileage for the car is 170,000 miles, but, the newly refurb'd injectors won't have done any miles yet. So do I reset the counter to zero?

I have a Lexia 3 so can access the required parameters.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

I got a second hand injector off ebay and fitted it in cylinder 3, where the wet injector was found. The engine started and ticked over smoothly, so, no engine damage.

Looks like my fear that some terrible damage had been caused is not the case. It was a case of diesel knock.

I'm going to return the 'wet' injector for a replacement.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Does anyone know if my 2.2 Hdi has a knock sensor?
It's a 2002 engine.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
wheeler
Posts: 6847
Joined: 21 Sep 2002, 19:07
Location: United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 717

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by wheeler »

Cant think ive ever seen one on this DW12 engine.
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by Peter.N. »

Slightly off the subject. I had a Commer 15 cwt van in the '60s with a Perkins 4/99 engine, it was only a couple of years old, one of the newest vehicles I have had. One day it started knocking as though a big end had failed, my heart sank until I changed the injectors, noise gone, one injector was stuck partially open.

Peter
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

I got a replacement injector from the ebay seller and fitted it, but, when I took my C5 for a run it started to bang again as i accelerated.
So, I'm still not up and running and I'm fishing around for what to do next.

Looking in Lexia, there's a need to tell the ECU what injector class it has. The options are 1, 2 or 3.
It's set to 2. But, what are the chances that the rebuilt injectors correspond with class 2.
I'm wondering if I need to change this value to class 3.. or maybe 1.
Is anyone familiar with this classification system
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
KevMayer
Posts: 1051
Joined: 12 Sep 2003, 22:01
Location: Staffordshire, United Kingdom
My Cars:
x 2

Re: C5 2.2 Hdi - fault after fitting new Injectors

Post by KevMayer »

Now fixed.

The banging was pre-ignition because my EGR had been blanked. When I removed the EGR blank the pre-ignition (banging) went away.

Once I could drive without the severe banging noises, I was getting a lot of thick white smoke once the engine began to warm up. This was due to an air flow problem. One of the vacuum-controlled butterfly valves had gone faulty and as the two valves changed over I ended up with both valves closed and no air flow (2 vacuum butterflies - intercooled air inlet or heated air inlet).

I disabled the faulty vacuum valve to default as permanently open and now the engine runs well.
Cheers, Kev

02 plate C5 2.2 Hdi Exclusive SE (now 170k miles 03/21).

Used to have:- Xantia 1.9 TurboD SX. 1996 Blue & 1998 Silver Activa. + 1992 BX TZD Turbo.
Post Reply