If it goes to court there....it will here soon !

[Stickyfinger]

Watch out re-mappers ! having a Government after you is not nice but the Greens will be tougher on you

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2013/01/ep ... ilter.html

[Northern_Mike]

Watch out re-mappers ! having a Government after you is not nice but the Greens will be tougher on you

http://news.pickuptrucks.com/2013/01/ep ... ilter.html

I love reading the moronic comments from people who just don't get that the DPFs are there for a good reason, and think it's their god-given American right to do what the hell they want, however it affects others!

[citroenxm]

Ive been Telling people for months now NOT to take them off.... we have a resident member who beleves its fine to remove them too!!

I wont, and dont want to either!

[qprdude]

Yep, crazy comments from the American public who believe their constitution allows them to do as they please. Some of the ill informed comments seem to come from single brain cell specimens.

The comment about pollution problems in China is so true. Having worked in two metal foundries and a production facility over there, I have seen the problem at first hand. OK, DPF's are not perfect, but they are a work in progress. Many Americans seem to think that anything less than a V8 lump is under-powered. There have been massive steps forward in the power of smaller, more efficient engines but as it often does, these advances seem to be lost on many of the super-charged , muscle car loving Americans. When I was last in Houston, every third vehicle on the Expressway seemed to be a massive 4 x 4 truck.

[vborovic]

That's also one of the reasons I'd rather go for a chip tuning solution than a remap ... I never investigated, but what happens in case you have a engine mishap (or any other fault on the car), and want to have the car inspected (to get the insurance money - not sure about the exact term, but that one when you're partly or full covered when it is not actually your fault), you did a remap modification which probably wasn't road approved (by central vehicle testing institutions in a country), and you lose the money (my theory) ... if you have a chip, you pop it out, and voila ... let them investigate all they want, they won't find that as a custom modification to the insured vehicle on paper ...

[Northern_Mike]

Ive been Telling people for months now NOT to take them off.... we have a resident member who beleves its fine to remove them too!!

I wont, and dont want to either!

They're there for a reason. I've been converted from being one of the "do as you please and take them off" brigade, to one who believes they should be in place and working. The Berlingo doesn't have one, but if it did, I wouldn't be removing it.

As for remapping for more power, I have no problem with it as long as the DPF/EGR are left alone. I don't really believe they cause as many car problems as they are blamed for - surely poor maintenance/not reading the owners manual and treating the car properly has something to do with this? In many cases with remapping for more power, I don't understand why the car owner didn't just buy a more powerful car in the first place. Obviously, with some cars like a S1 C5 or Berlingo HDi, you don't have that choice, but with so many others you can simply buy a more powerful version of the same car.

After the Berlingo and C5 are sold, I'll not be having any diesel cars or any Citroens for a long time, if ever!

[Northern_Mike]

That's also one of the reasons I'd rather go for a chip tuning solution than a remap ... I never investigated, but what happens in case you have a engine mishap (or any other fault on the car), and want to have the car inspected (to get the insurance money - not sure about the exact term, but that one when you're partly or full covered when it is not actually your fault), you did a remap modification which probably wasn't road approved (by central vehicle testing institutions in a country), and you lose the money (my theory) ... if you have a chip, you pop it out, and voila ... let them investigate all they want, they won't find that as a custom modification to the insured vehicle on paper ...

The issue with your theory is that if your car is recovered from being upside down in a ditch, and you're in hospital unable to remove the chip before they inspect it.....

[citroenxm]

Ive been Telling people for months now NOT to take them off.... we have a resident member who beleves its fine to remove them too!!

I wont, and dont want to either!

They're there for a reason. I've been converted from being one of the "do as you please and take them off" brigade, to one who believes they should be in place and working. The Berlingo doesn't have one, but if it did, I wouldn't be removing it.

As for remapping for more power, I have no problem with it as long as the DPF/EGR are left alone. I don't really believe they cause as many car problems as they are blamed for - surely poor maintenance/not reading the owners manual and treating the car properly has something to do with this? In many cases with remapping for more power, I don't understand why the car owner didn't just buy a more powerful car in the first place. Obviously, with some cars like a S1 C5 or Berlingo HDi, you don't have that choice, but with so many others you can simply buy a more powerful version of the same car.

After the Berlingo and C5 are sold, I'll not be having any diesel cars or any Citroëns for a long time, if ever!

Couldn't agree more with you mike!!

[vborovic]

That's also one of the reasons I'd rather go for a chip tuning solution than a remap ... I never investigated, but what happens in case you have a engine mishap (or any other fault on the car), and want to have the car inspected (to get the insurance money - not sure about the exact term, but that one when you're partly or full covered when it is not actually your fault), you did a remap modification which probably wasn't road approved (by central vehicle testing institutions in a country), and you lose the money (my theory) ... if you have a chip, you pop it out, and voila ... let them investigate all they want, they won't find that as a custom modification to the insured vehicle on paper ...

The issue with your theory is that if your car is recovered from being upside down in a ditch, and you're in hospital unable to remove the chip before they inspect it.....

I agree on that, in which case of course I'd be more worried about my life than that of the car ... ...but what I meant was, situations that could prevent you from getting the payout because someone from the insurance company figures out some modifications are made to the car (which aren't documented and/or approved), which you can't easily revert (remap) ...

[dei9]

I was talking to Paul (citroenxm) only yesterday about it (messing with the EGR valve), and he was like whats the point, and i was like yea, and i drove off home, and thought, yea whats the point, the car is fine as it is, and it's to spec. I've always been one get cars up to standard spec, but then again i've also removed the cat from a 2.1td before, the difference wasn't worth the naughty feeling of having one over the government (even if it is legal), and as paul mentioned to me, the legislation changes so often it's best not to bother.

Here in europe we have squeezed so much power from small units whilst the Americans still have small displacement V8's, that produce less than 200bhp, and V6's that produce less than 150bhp, I think it's pretty cool that my mate has a Ford Focus 1.6tdci with the same engine and bhp as mine yet mind is a 2.0 (still a PSA/other brand joint venture). The only cool thing to come from America in terms of a green car is the Tesla, and I just hope long terms Elon Musk has calculated if the cost of producing the car and maintaining the battery is more economical than me keeping a Xantia 2.0 Hdi on the road.

[qprdude]

Pity than the vast majority of Americans have no knowledge or experience of anything beyond their own borders, and quite often their State borders. Had to have a laugh at the guy who complained that the Prius is the most polluting car ever. His reasoning was mostly because of the ships that bring the Prius to America are hugely polluting!!
I wonder if he thinks the BMW's, Mercs, Honda's etc arrive at their golden shores courtesy of a magic fairy?
Another one reckons it's his money, his choice and he will do as he damn well pleases! Yeah, planet earth calling mate.

[Stickyfinger]

BMW's, Mercs, Honda's etc .....they are made in Mexico and driven up.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive ... present.29" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

In defense of the US choice of the Pick-up.

Try going Hunting every season with anything less, remember your towing a massive speed boat or Trailer
Try attaching anything large...(all things are large in the USA)
Try getting around in winter with 3 feet of snow
Pick-Ups need to carry 2 tonne to be considered really useful...and this is correct for the use they put them to.
Highly tuned high power engines are a no go in many many areas as the population is so low, easy powerful local thumpers are the tradition and the need.

All the above IF applied to a town driver makes them just stupid, but go any big City to see stupid.

[Hell Razor5543]

Pity than the vast majority of Americans have no knowledge or experience of anything beyond their own borders, and quite often their State borders. Had to have a laugh at the guy who complained that the Prius is the most polluting car ever. His reasoning was mostly because of the ships that bring the Prius to America are hugely polluting!!
I wonder if he thinks the BMW's, Mercs, Honda's etc arrive at their golden shores courtesy of a magic fairy?
Another one reckons it's his money, his choice and he will do as he damn well pleases! Yeah, planet earth calling mate.

The Prius is not as clean as the un-informed think. Think about the manufacturing processes, and the recyclability of it (such as the batteries). It also depends on how it is driven. I recall a Top Gear program where they had a few high speed laps with a Prius versus a BMW M5, and at the speeds they were travelling the BMW had a much better MPG.

[qprdude]

I wouldn't say top gear is a scientific programme, but in any case, I thought the post was about pollution rather than MPG.

[Northern_Mike]

I wouldn't say top gear is a scientific programme, but in any case, I thought the post was about pollution rather than MPG.

The Argonne National Laboratory ran a side-by-side comparison of hybrid and conventional vehicles over their entire life cycle, which includes vehicle production, vehicle operation and the energy required to produce fuel for both cars. If you assume that both vehicles travel 160,000 miles (257,495 kilometers) over their lifetime, the conventional vehicle requires 6,500 Btu of energy per mile compared to 4,200 Btu per mile for a hybrid. That higher energy input results in far greater lifetime greenhouse gas emissions for conventional vehicles compared to hybrids, more than 1.1 pounds (500 grams) per mile compared to 0.75 pounds (340 grams) per mile [source: Burnham et al]

So, hybrids, though duller, are better for the planet even taking into account the production emissions.