just heard on the news .....................

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Xaccers
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Post by Xaccers »

uhn113x wrote:Why have they had to actually remove the speed cams? Why not leave them as they are and say nowt?
If they are removing them it'll be due to the maintenance costs, even a dummy one costs £8K
I didn't think they were actually going to be removing them though, just switching them off.
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uhn113x
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Post by uhn113x »

Hmmm ... just leave them as they are, un-maintained!

I still think it would have been better just not to mention it to the media, as it'll be open season for the boy-racers (M & F!).
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myglaren
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Post by myglaren »

Xac wrote:
uhn113x wrote:Why have they had to actually remove the speed cams? Why not leave them as they are and say nowt?
If they are removing them it'll be due to the maintenance costs, even a dummy one costs £8K
I didn't think they were actually going to be removing them though, just switching them off.
How the hell can a dummy one cost that much?
I worked for a sign making company that would have been happy to make and erect them for £1,000.
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Xaccers
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Post by Xaccers »

myglaren wrote:
Xac wrote:
uhn113x wrote:Why have they had to actually remove the speed cams? Why not leave them as they are and say nowt?
If they are removing them it'll be due to the maintenance costs, even a dummy one costs £8K
I didn't think they were actually going to be removing them though, just switching them off.
How the hell can a dummy one cost that much?
I worked for a sign making company that would have been happy to make and erect them for £1,000.
Dummy ones cost that much because they're basically real ones without the actual camera/radar unit (which is another £8K)
Between Leighton Buzzard and Hemel Hempstead there were 4 gatsos, only 2 were ever real, and they'd move them around.
Likewise with the old gatsos on the M25 gantries, they only have one real per gantry, the others are dummies. Don't know if the live one can monitor more than one lane, or what the specs of the new cameras around Heathrow/Staines are.
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myglaren
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Post by myglaren »

No wonder the government overspends if they pay that sort of money - you can buy a car for less.
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Xaccers
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Post by Xaccers »

myglaren wrote:No wonder the government overspends if they pay that sort of money - you can buy a car for less.
When safety partnerships started they kept the fine money to cover costs and invest in safety measures.
I believe Gordo's dept started taking more of a cut meaning more cameras were needed to bring in more money, then Gordo started nabbing the lot. Partnerships had less cash to invest so rather than earning them money, they started costing, hence the need to shut them off.
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myglaren
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Post by myglaren »

All of which just underlines that safety was never the real priority.

The Gatso's are still horrendously overpriced. They'd get them for twenty five quid apiece from China.
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Post by CitroJim »

myglaren wrote: The Gatso's are still horrendously overpriced. They'd get them for twenty five quid apiece from China.
Don't tell them that Steve, otherwise they'll be popping up all over the place :twisted:

Truth is, a Gatso is a bit of engineering as it has to be built to a very demanding specification (e.g. capable of being run into and not making matters worse as per any other substantial street furniture) and not least, be pretty much tamper proof and stand wide climatic rigours.

The electronics are pretty demanding s well, needing to achieve rather a high accuracy of speed measurement and recording.

All in all, and considering the relatively small quantities in which they are produced, they are not really that expensive.

Now, if China mass-produced them, they'd cost about a tenner but would clock cyclists at 250MPH, fall over and kill pedestrians if the wind exceeds a gentle breeze and need replacing every 3 months because they are irrepairable.

Don't get the idea I'm a Gatso fan; I'm not but I do admire their engineering and technical features.

Personally, I'd like to see every Gatso (and TruVelo and SPECS) recycled into cheap Chinese spanners and replaced with speed display boards, preferably ones that smile under the limit and frown if you're speeding.

On my way to work I pass through two small villages on a busy B road. Both have 40 limits. Both have big light-up 40 signs that flash on if you're speeding. They work. If a driver flashes one on you immediately see brake lights as the perpetrator of the flash slows down. It's like it's a terrible embarrassment to make the sign flash so comparatively few do.

It works a perfect treat. Speed is controlled without the issuing of fines and points.

I should add that both villages in question need their speed control to guard a couple of potentially dangerous junctions. I'd love to know the accident statistics before and after the light-up 40 signs were installed.
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myglaren
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Post by myglaren »

I reckon the light up speed 'advisors' are probably more effective than Gats cameras.

I was meaning the Chinese would knock up Gatso-looking boxes without the electronics for a few quid - from plastic so you can run into them and hardly notice it :)
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Post by Xaccers »

Light up signs have been shown to reduce speeds even 3 years after installation, cameras can be a few months as people learn where they are and speed up once past them to "beat" the system.
So light up signs are more effective but don't bring in money hence why they aren't used much.
I'd bet they are only installed where there is enough public pressure for something to be done but not enough accidents to allow a gatso.
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Post by addo »

Interesting what a difference between cultures! Here the Your Speed xx advisories are ignored with nothing more than a disdainful glance - if that.

My theory is that speed cameras should photograph EVERY motorist, and at a legislated level of random selection, people under the limit get a "Thank you" letter and a one point credit against infringements in the future. The credit would expire at the same rate as infringement points.
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Post by myglaren »

One thing that I had forgotten was that there is the plan to have average speed cameras everywhere by the end of the decade and there are millions of the damned things already, that would make the Gatso a redundant item anyway.
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Post by MikeT »

Black boxes and video cams in every car is the future, IMO. It's happening in the states - at least with the cameras - and from the footage I've seen, it's a good thing TM.

Speed cameras only catch people driving over the limit, regardless of their capability or the surroundings.
There are so many other offences that I see daily (and they are on the increase as cars get "safer") yet no-one seems to want to tackle them.

ABS, Parking sensors, Lane sensors, armoured (impact-resistant or hunking great 4x4) vehicles all seem to encourage a lack of due care and attention including tailgating, failure to observe when reversing and drifting across lanes into other traffic.

And where the hell do all these non-indicating drivers get their licenses from? Even ADI's can't seem to agree on indication protocol. :roll:
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Post by myglaren »

Even ADI's can't seem to agree on indication protocol.
We just forget :(

Seriously, it really annoys me and the worst offenders are taxi drivers and the police.
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Post by uhn113x »

MikeT wrote:There are so many other offences that I see daily (and they are on the increase as cars get "safer") yet no-one seems to want to tackle them.

ABS, Parking sensors, Lane sensors, armoured (impact-resistant or hunking great 4x4) vehicles all seem to encourage a lack of due care and attention including tailgating, failure to observe when reversing and drifting across lanes into other traffic.
I agree completely with that; tailgating is far more dangerous than speeding, especially if the culprit is driving a 40 tonner and is half asleep.
And where the hell do all these non-indicating drivers get their licenses from? Even ADI's can't seem to agree on indication protocol. :roll:
It is cancelled (!) out by the ones who indicate 'right' as they leave a roundabout, indicate 'left' as they go on to a motorway slip road, or leave them turned on until the next turn a few miles away.
Self-cancelling indicators are the inventions of Satan!