BX TD starter motor

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Rob Marshall
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BX TD starter motor

Post by Rob Marshall »

Should have known, as soon as the weather turns nasty, problem arrive.
The J reg TD has suffered from a dickky starter motor; anyway, I have just found out that Halfords are selling remanufactured motors (made by BOSCH!) for £25 exchange. Get down there quick!
Took old motor out, refitted new one: and guess what: Nothing!!!! Howwer, if a lead is taken from the solenoid to the + terminal of the battery, the engine churns and fires, but from the key; nothing.
So the starter's OK (well it is new), so the problem must be with the solenoid circuit. The lead goes to a mulitplug under the battery, which has now been disconnected and WD40'eed
But still, when I turn the ignition key to "start", all dashlights go out, relay in fusebox still clicks (have swapped relays as well, no difference!); so now the only way I can start the damn thing is by connecting a wire from the + terminal to the solenoid.
Any ideas?? please!!
Rob
beezer
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Post by beezer »

Does your car have a control unit for the positive supply? In Peugeots it is usually a blue gubbins close to the battery. If this is faulty it can cause such symptoms. The starter switch is usually fused (Peugeots is same fuse as glowplugs).
Rob Marshall
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Post by Rob Marshall »

No theres none of that blue gubbins! There is a box bolted to the inner wing, but as far as I know, that contains the glowplug gubbins.
Your idea of the circuit being fused is a good one: I will consult the handbook, but to be honest, I doubt it. The glowplugs work fine, as does everything else
alan s
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Post by alan s »

I've got a similar problem with my 16V that has got worse over time but as yet hasn't totally died.
Grab a multi meter and check the voltage supply on that lead that goes to the solenoid; it eventually reached the stage that it was only supplying < 9 volts on my car so we had to cut part of the wire and replace it. It's still not 100% as I think there's still wire within the harness that has internal deterioration. The problem that it creates however is that due to the copper plate inside the solenoid "falling" in rather than "snapping" when making contact, it gets splattered and therefore messes up the contact surfaces which means the solenoid may have to be replaced if it can't be got apart and reversed on its mount.
My solenoid improved greatly once it had the wire replaced and I have heard of owners both replacing this wire (yellow in colour) and adding a relay to the solenoid circuit.
Alan S
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Post by vanny »

do you any sort of alarm/imoboliser? sounds like the ignition feed might have been disconnected to fit an alarm or imoboliser. I got so annoyed with mine i ripped it out and Duck Taped the wires back together, worked much better then! Also, check that there is a decent earth from the engine! If there is a poor earth then the voltage across the starter will be much lower.
Adding a relay is also a good plan but you may have to replace it semiregular!
On another note, dont replace the BX diesel starter with another BX starter, to be honest there hopeless! Get a ZX diesel starter, about the same price, half the weight and much more powerfull! I've got two of them!
alan s
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Post by alan s »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by vanny</i>

a ZX diesel starter, about the same price, half the weight and much more powerfull! I've got two of them!
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
<b>Please don't tell me you run both at the same time though!!</b>[;)][:D][:D][:D]
Alan S [:o)]
Rob Marshall
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Post by Rob Marshall »

Well, the starter motor is brand new; and it worked 100% when the solenoid is connected up to a + supply.
Regarding the wire leadinf to the soleniod: I have run another wire from the junction box to the soleniod, and still no go.
Does the circuit run independantly of the fusebox??
Thanks again!
Rob
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Post by oilyspanner »

Ignition switsch
vanny
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Post by vanny »

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by alans</i>
<b>Please don't tell me you run both at the same time though!!</b>[;)][:D][:D][:D]
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Well, ones in the engine bay, the other is in the spare parts bay (ie the boot, or trunk!), and you never know maybe one day i'll actually fit the spare and get the original reconned!
Originally i dont think there is either a fuse nor a relay in the circuit, its a direct connection from the ingition 'switsch'
alan s
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Post by alan s »

I wonder if you may have a dodgy contact in the switch?
I do believe that this may have been a suspicion on my car at one stage as I have a spring loaded switch under my steering column that is connected directly to the starter solenoid & allows me to spin the starter without the switch being turned on.
Alan S
BTW, I have a relay in my starter circuit that is part of the immobiliser circuit and it's been a bugger to find on the two occasions mine has totally died as it's hidden in the region of the battery and is also prone to corrosion because of it..
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Post by prm »

Rob
If you remove steering column trim. Turn ignition to crank and try pushing and moving wires as they enter main ignition switch -- 4 red 4 white ?? to see if it cranks. The switch could be faulty/intermittent. Rather than replace complete lock set for a single car key, you can repair.
If you remove complete switch.-- 7mm headed bolt, key turned to first line on casing and depress anti theft plunger To dismantle the rear switch/wire casing from the main body -- one very small Torx bit. Engage and extend steering lock mechanism with the key and tap locking bar, this will dislodge connecting pin enabling you to remove switch casing. Ease out the plastic tags holding contact cover, Inside you should find four sets of contacts -- 3 rotary -- and 1 circular -- this is the crank circuit. Just requires clean, any pitting removed and the b----y miniature springs extended.The cables with there contacts can also be removed. Found contact grease helps to keep these in place when reassembling. Circuit test the four cable pairs before refitting.
Hope this may help.
To save you searching the kitchen floor for those - - springs Try using a white tea towel to work on !! Also before you remove switch casing, remove key, remove contact mechanism and make a note or mark the central spindle position for refitting, as this is non latching , just friction contact.
Vanny
I've never found a relay. You would have thought so.-- Another mod to do !!
B/R
Peter
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Post by mikeg »

Just a suggestion, see if you can get a complete switch unit from your local dismantler, then before you disturb your steering wheel gubbins, disconnect the two multi plugs (I think there are two) located in the pass r/h side You can gain accsess by removing the fastenings and peeling the trim back towards the gear lever. If you fish around inside the cavity, you can locate the multi plugs. Just fiddle them out (with care) then swap the plugs over, turn the key and see what happens. this might save you a lot of messing about for nothing, like I did. Make sure your not in gear, having been working in the cockpit.
Best of luck,
Mike
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Post by beezer »

Looks like you have a lot to check out! I had an immobiliser on my 205. A tiny switch hidden in the right hand parcel shelf. It was accidentally switched when boarding a ferry and the car would not start when the time came to disembark. Got towed off by a tanker and parked up then it dawned on me - switched it back and away I went. As the glowplugs were on the same fuse the warning lamp did not light up so this was an indication. Your car is obviously different. If you can not track down the fault you could always get a nice big red push button switch from Maplin and place it discretely in the car but within easy reach and rig it up as a starter button. This would be a security measure too as you would need to have the ignition on and press the button before you could start the engine. Neds would not immediately figure this out.
Rob Marshall
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Post by Rob Marshall »

I think the next stage is to remove the centre console and have a look at those multiplugs located under the dash.
I took the ignition lock out last night. No signs of burning etc round that area. I think the ignition switch works OK, because when you turn it to the START position, all the ash lights go out etc at normal.
The other thing is that I rigged the solenoid on the motor to the - side of my multimeter, then the + side to the battery, and I got a reading. Is this normal, as it indicates the + on the soleniod is earthed?
Rob
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Post by tomsheppard »

Sounds to me like the familiar busted ignition switch. All the lights go out because contact is broken to other circuits when solenoid is switched in but if the contact to the solenoid doesn't make, then it won't go. I'd substitute another switch and just plug it into the existing wiring. If I'm right, it will start.
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