Expert 2.0 blue HDI starting issues 2020

[Peter Palmer]

Hi, I'm having a slight issue starting my van sometimes, occasionally it takes quite a few turns to start, say 3 or 4 seconds, then usually fires up normally, or it tries to start and stalls. But most of the time, probably 90% it fires up almost instantly. I've also noticed that occasionally as well it drives a bit lumpy a slow speeds for the first half a mile or so but is then normal, but again most of the time it drives fine and goes all over the country without incident.

I think the speed of the starter is ok but it alsways says economy mode active when you first turn the key.

Van is a 2.0 Hdi blue Peugot expert 120hp 2020 reg. 124k

Edit : Just to add the battery voltage is 12.4V, about 14V when running

[cit-rotti]

Please check the battery voltage while the starter motor is running. This voltage should ideally be above 10.5V during the starting process.
Voltages between 10 and 10.5V are still acceptable.
Below 9.5 V, the battery is usually the weak point or the starter motor should be replaced or repaired because it is nearing the end of its life and is drawing too much current.
If the problem only occurs sporadically and the battery is OK, this indicates a weak starter motor. Depending on the battery voltage before starting, it may work well or worse.
Greetings Wolfgang

[Peter Palmer]

Thanks, do you think I can unplug the injectors to stop it starting when cranking without it throwing a hissy fit.

I have done a scan today and cleared all the fault codes out of the BSI and engine ECU etc. There was one fault code there that said cam position sensor fault but that could have been from ages ago before I bought it for all I know. I will do another scan next time it doesn't start properly and see what has come back.

[Peter Palmer]

Didn't start properly again yesterday evening so I've done a scan again today. 2 faults in the engine ECU but when you access them several different modules come up so I had to click them and then read the codes.





No lights on the dash though.

[Peter Palmer]

Still having issues with this, I've changed the camshaft sensor and the crank sensor but diagbox is still reporting faults, namely the P0341 64 fault as above. Also in the live data, in miscalaneous of all places the camshaft/crankshaft sync reports "invalid value", but with the engine off it says "NO"



I've also probed the cam shaft sensor connections and I'm getting 5V on the two outer connections and the middle connection is connected to ground fine, this is with the sensor unplugged though.

I'm not sure if the cambelt has been changed or not though and the van is on 124k now so it could have stretched slightly, but wouldn't that report that the sync was out whilst running? And it looks to me that the cam sensor is pointing at the pulley with the belt on so would it even know if the chain was stretched? It also starts without the cam sensor plugged in.

Slightly off topic but why are there so many different modules to choose from after you go into the engine ECU fault finding, not all of them work but the others just report the same fault in different ways.

[LedZep]

In my opinion you may check the timing of the engine especially if you don't know the history of it.Other reasons are stretched timing belt and bad installation of it (if it is ever been changed and the sprocket is not in the sweet" spot) or weak tensioner.

[Peter Palmer]

In my opinion you may check the timing of the engine especially if you don't know the history of it.Other reasons are stretched timing belt and bad installation of it (if it is ever been changed and the sprocket is not in the sweet" spot) or weak tensioner.

Yes, think its the next stage. I've ordered a cam belt kit and water pump, they look quite easy to do on these engines providing I can get the bottom bolt undone.

[Peter Palmer]

Made a bit of progress, I've timed it up by locking the crank and the cam pully is ever so slightly out, cant get the pin in anyway.



would this be enough to cause problems though? Doesn't look like its had a belt or pump recently either although there is a white mark on the pulley and cover, which doesn't line up.

[Peter Palmer]

I'm begining to think whoever has "worked" on this doesn't even know what an engine is, let alone fix one. firstly the reluctor ring.

WTF


Looks like the pully has been gunned back on without the keyway being lined up first. Crazy.

Secondly the crank sprocket is all to cock.


Looks like they have managed to snap the pin off in the hole, nothing will fit in there more than a mm or so, not even a bradawl.

I just don't get it, the cma belt looks old and it actually has a nick in it, its a INA one, not sure if they are original but the water pump is continental and date stamped 24, would anyone really put theoriginal belt back on after changing the water pump? nuts.

[Peter Palmer]

Seems to have missed the worst bit off my post, yes it gets worse.



Seems like mr Magoo has managed to snap the pin off in the timing hole for the cam shaft, nothing will go in there more than a mm or so, not even a bradawl.

[LedZep]

WTF!? Sad but true.At least you know what the problem is.It looks like they tried to fired up the engine to check if it was ok before install all the bits and forgot the 8mm lock pin. Check also and the cam chain and tensioner if it is stretched.

[Peter Palmer]

Crank pulley had the same dint in it as well so after a bit of hammering and filing I got them both to go back on perfectly as they should do, new belt/tensioner/water pump etc and now the white marks line up again with it all pinned up, crank sprocket is also sitting in the middle now like it should. So despite someone marking the cam sprocket up with tippex it looks like they still managed to get it one tooth out.

So I cleard the codes, it fired up first time and the codes haven't as yet come back, need to take it for a run now and see what its like.

[LedZep]

Crank pulley had the same dint in it as well so after a bit of hammering and filing I got them both to go back on perfectly as they should do, new belt/tensioner/water pump etc and now the white marks line up again with it all pinned up, crank sprocket is also sitting in the middle now like it should. So despite someone marking the cam sprocket up with tippex it looks like they still managed to get it one tooth out.

So I cleard the codes, it fired up first time and the codes haven't as yet come back, need to take it for a run now and see what its like.

Perfect.I noticed the tippex 1 tooth out but i assumed that it was from stressing the cambelt from sprocket when it fired up. I suppose that you manage to set right the sprocket to be in the middle of keyway. My suspicious is that they changed the water pump which is OEM INA with the plastic impeller known to fail and they used the same cambelt (if it has the Peugeot Citroen brand on it). Of course they managed ?? ?? ?????? ?@#@##?? in my language.

[perfidus]

Glad you manage to fix it, as it seems. For the correct ECU type you could search for the label on the ECU itself, although I don't know exactly where you should find it in Expert vans. Mine is above and to the back of the air filter, driver side (left), near engine fuse box. The 2.0Blue HDI Jumper have Delphi DCM6.2C.