Automatic gearbox mode is turned off, Engine Fault

[frer8833]

Hi,

When I start car the gearbox can shift up as normal but after 10 sec Engine Fault is displayed and Auto is turned off and becomes manual gearbox mode and shifting works with paddles. It can still shift down by itself when slowing down. It also has less acceleration power after the error beep but before the beep it has good power.

What is this caused by, is it too little gearbox oil because it has never been changed (lifetime fluid)? There is a little rough engagement sound when gearbox goes from neutral to d drive. But it shifts gears alright with paddles.

There is also since a few years another Engine Fault which is related to unspinning (no electricity due to loose or damaged fan cable ) Engine Cooling Fan but this fault has never turned off Automatic gear mode.

[GiveMeABreak]

This won't be an automatic gearbox.

You likely have a manual gearbox and clutch, that has hydraulic actuators to do the physical ger changes.

Therefore the 'oil' probably isn't directly relevant as this is just a manual gearbox and uses the same oil. Only the hydraulic Actuators use a special kind of oil for this part of the system.

There can be various reasons why the 'Auto' function does not work and that can be either a fault with the piloted system itself, or an engine system fault that is causing the Auto' function to become disabled, much like when cruise control is disabled when the engine ECU detects a fault.

So really you need to have it properly diagnosed with a Lexia system, then pop any codes you get hear along with the VIN.

It's also worth noting any warnings or flashing symbols or dashes in the instrument display when the fault happens.

[frer8833]

This won't be an automatic gearbox.

You likely have a manual gearbox and clutch, that has hydraulic actuators to do the physical ger changes.

Therefore the 'oil' probably isn't directly relevant as this is just a manual gearbox and uses the same oil. Only the hydraulic Actuators use a special kind of oil for this part of the system.

There can be various reasons why the 'Auto' function does not work and that can be either a fault with the piloted system itself, or an engine system fault that is causing the Auto' function to become disabled, much like when cruise control is disabled when the engine ECU detects a fault.

So really you need to have it properly diagnosed with a Lexia system, then pop any codes you get hear along with the VIN.

It's also worth noting any warnings or flashing symbols or dashes in the instrument display when the fault happens.

Maybe I caused the problem because I had sprayed 2 days earlier with silicone lubricant on outside and inside/backside of the wheels in the hopes of getting rid of squeaky sounds but I read today that silicone lubricants blocks electric contacts as they form silicone dioxide.

I sprayed brake cleaner and took it to the hand car washer and pressure sprayed soap and water on the places where I had sprayed silicone spray but it didnt help.

In another forum I read that people with faulty sensors on the wheels have to drive in manual mode their automatic cars,

https://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/show ... t-manually

https://www.gmtruckclub.com/threads/4l6 ... y.1480585/ .

I will try soon a deoxidizing spray to remove silicone oxides but automatic gear mode does work normally, car shifts up, during first 20 sec of start up so this indicates the sensors are already ok otherwise it would not even work in automatic for 20 sec.

The car feels good otherwise.

Ediag Obd2 scanner says The following systems are OK: 1.Gearbox 2.Anti-lock Brake System 3.Airbag 4.Power Steering Electric Pump Unit 5.Battery Charge Status Unit 6.Electric Secondary Brake 7.Control Panel 8.Air Conditioning ECU 9.Multifunction Display 10.Driver's Door Module 11.Seat Belts Not Fastened LED Unit 12.Multiplexed Control Panel 13.Supply Protection And Management Unit 14.Voltage Retaining Device

[GiveMeABreak]

Ok, so looking at that lot you have major problems - and not just with your gearbox going into manual mode!

All the 'U' codes are communications / data faults and all the 'B' faults are BSI faults.

You really need to get this to a dealer or other professional for a proper diagnostic. There are just too many here for us to deal with on a Forum. If it was the odd few faults, I would certainly help, but I really don't have the time to deal with over 43 faults, sorry!

[frer8833]

The Kingbolen scanner was showing fake "temporary" errors, for example that there is no turn signal or radio. Only "permanent" faults are the real faults. So there are no 48 faults, sorry for the confusion. BTW Gearbox and ABS is OK according to my obd2 scanner.

Should I try spraying contact deoxidizing cleaner on the wheel to maybe clean up the sensors or are the wheels unrelated to automatic mode? FYI updated the links in my previous comment.

Where is the problem located, is it caused by silicone spray on wheels?

[GiveMeABreak]

Well any issues with the wheel speed sensors will result in an ESP fault and will disable ESP and hill start functions, cruise control etc. A diagnostic will tell you which of the 4 wheel speed sensors there is an issue with - so unless you are getting a specific wheel speed sensor, then it will be something else I suspect and you should not have all those errors in any case.

You need to clear all the faults, go for a drive then re-scan the vehicle and see which ones are remaining.

[frer8833]

Well any issues with the wheel speed sensors will result in an ESP fault and will disable ESP and hill start functions, cruise control etc. A diagnostic will tell you which of the 4 wheel speed sensors there is an issue with - so unless you are getting a specific wheel speed sensor, then it will be something else I suspect and you should not have all those errors in any case.

You need to clear all the faults, go for a drive then re-scan the vehicle and see which ones are remaining.

This thread is about same problem but they have no answer, https://www.peugeotforums.com/threads/s ... al.364465/

All errors are cleared (Except SERVICE light which lights up when Auto stops working and Engine Fault -Repair Needed is shown on Radio display), there is no red Engine error light, no ESP light, no DPF light, etc. But Auto on display turns off after 5-10 seconds, during this time it does automatically upshift if I press gaspedal, but after that the Auto text is turned off and I can only shift with paddles behind steering wheel. Automatic downshift still works though. Earlier I used Ediag OBD2 scanner and only once it said low transmission fluid or pressure but why it never said that again I don't understand. It maybe means that "Lifetime transmission fluid" should be renewed after about 250 000 km?

In manual it says if Auto is flashing it means the transmission needs to be checked by technicians. It used to flash, now it just turns off the text immediately after 5 sec, it maybe means very low ATF fluid, which causes the gears to get sticky on each other.

This commenter might be on to something, "if you put too much transmission oil, error will flash. too less you'll hear a thud when changing gears. much less, you will loose automatic and would have to use the manual when driving. check the oil seal for the transmission, it might be leaking causing oil level to go down." https://www.peugeotforums.com/threads/p ... lem.11572/

[GiveMeABreak]

Unfortunately these piloted robotised manual gearbox & Clutch systems can be very difficult to diagnose and work on. It really needs a specialist to properly diagnose the issue as these can have multiple issues and errors.

My advice is to cut your losses and get it to a dealer to properly diagnose and repair if you don't have a specialist garage in these systems nearby (many won't touch them), or you could end up in a cycle of replacing unnecessary parts and expenditure.

[frer8833]

Unfortunately these piloted robotised manual gearbox & Clutch systems can be very difficult to diagnose and work on. It really needs a specialist to properly diagnose the issue as these can have multiple issues and errors.

My advice is to cut your losses and get it to a dealer to properly diagnose and repair if you don't have a specialist garage in these systems nearby (many won't touch them), or you could end up in a cycle of replacing unnecessary parts and expenditure.

I maybe just have top it up with about 400 ml, 20% deficiency, gearbox oil and see what happens? 75W80 PSA B71 2330.

When topping it up, is it ok filled when there is first sign of oil overflowing the brim of the filler hole? If not, how many millilitres (50-100ml?) I need to suck back out with a hosed pump or drain out for so called aeration space? Or I have to use a special dip-stick to measure C4 B7 1.6hdi gearbox oil level?

I asked a mechanic shop if they can top it up but he wrote back that he doesn't know how much oil is needed for topping it up and topping it up to the brim is not a good idea so he can therefor only change all of the oil for equivalent price of €190, which I think is not economic if there is a simple way to top it up.

I saw on Youtube that filler plug is on the engine housing floor besides car battery tray, is there a guide to access filler hole?

[GiveMeABreak]

Ok so if we are talking about the gearbox oil and nothing to do with the piloting actuators, then NO, do not top up the gearbox oil unless you know there has been a leak. You must either replace the oil with the same quantity as you have removed, or decide to drain the gearbox and replace the oil completely. You can damage it if you overfill it.

In order to advise you of the correct quantity after a drain, I'll need your VIN to determine the exact gearbox you have, as these are different. Please post your VIN in full without spaces - it will be automatically masked from public view after submitting your post & will only be visible to staff.

[RichardW]

You're confusing a 'proper' auto gearbox, and the semi auto manual that is fitted in this car.

Whilst the oil level in an proper auto can affect gear selection, this is not so on the semi auto box (*) - the oil in the box is just the same as a normal manual box. Low oil level will eventually destroy the box, but won't affect the shift quality / gear selection.

* the semi auto has a separate hydraulic oil supply which operates the clutch and the gear selection. Low oil level in this system will cause gear selection issues - however, since the box appears to operate normally in manual mode this seems a bit unlikely. The tank is low down on the outboard end of the box and is quite small, probably needs the wing liner taking out to see it. Note that the level in this tank is only correct when the system is depressured - however if there is oil in the tank, there's probably enough.

You need to get it on a decent scan tool to see what the engine and gearbox faults are, and then look at the live data to see how things are operating. It may well be that there is nothing wrong with the box but bad info from the engine ECU can upset it and cause the sort of issues you are seeing.

[GiveMeABreak]

@frer8833: Yes ^ 100% what Richard says: I've assumed you knew this was a piloted manual not an Automatic Gearbox.

[frer8833]

@Richard W @Marc:

Yes it is semiauto. Cruise Control works. The shifting is good, it can even jump smoothly from 2nd to 4th if I double tap the shift-paddle (I like paddles). I checked with Kingbolen Ediag all four ABS wheel speed sensors and they show live speed. Do you still think it can be low gearbox fluid level? Also even though automatic shifting works for 20 sec after I start car, it can also turn off even if car engine is not started and only key is on accessories ON position, this indicates electronic problem, not mechanical or it can be misalignment between clutch and actuator or low actuator hydraulic pressure? If I restart the car Auto mode is instantly working again, so this points to electric computer glitch?

Do you think the problem can resolve if positive and negative cable battery pole clammers is short circuited with each other for 5 minutes (with battery disconnected from circuit)?

Which checks specifically according to Citroen mechanics manual must be fulfilled when key is in accessories ON position for car to stay in automatic gear shifting mode or to at least not turn it off? Mechanically the car runs good with shift paddles so it doesn't seem to be a mechanical error when considering this automatic mode is also turned off after 20 sec in accessories key position. If I start the car during these initial 20 sec it can accelerate and autoshift up without problem.

I cleared all errors. The only errors which come instantly back and is coupled with Engine Fault Repair Needed is related to Eolys and its pump.
They are "P0EB0 Additive reservoire empty fault", "P1434 Multiplexed additive pump. Pump fault.", "P1445 Additive adding. The quantity of injected into the particle emission filter has exceeded the maximum threshold. The particulate emission filter must be changed.", "B1811 Fault on the diesel additive pump".

I think the pump works though and I had Eolys refilled 70% some years ago and it may not be empty because the car just assumes it is empty based on car's mileage or 'maximum injected threshold exceeded' error. Will filling it up solve the errors? I hope so because DPF seems ok. I drove recently 1000 km and DPF light was off, the car doesn't seem to have DPF problem or blockage. I also in a row injected through lambda/oxygen sensor hole two bottles of DPF cleaner spray (2x500ml ProMeister), it turned off DPF diode when it once was on (if there is limp mode it needs to be cleared with obd2 scanner first). I added to a nearly empty tank 500ML 2-Stroke Low Ash oil (low saps, Jaso FD, Api TC, Iso-l-egd) before filling up with 60L diesel for fuel and exhaust system cleaning effect and immediately the car was smoother and got more power. Promeister DPF regenerator for fuel tank 250ml I added to the tank a few years ago. In other words the DPF works.

The car was sometimes shifting erratically before the automatic mode stopped working but I remember I had sprayed oil on the wheels then too.

There is another error present, not always though, U1F1A "Top-of-column Transmission Failure on the LIN" (Local Interconnect Network) which was present also before automatic mode stopped working. Is it related to engine cooling fan's wire being shortcircuited somewhere, a global wiring harness problem? Or ECU/TCM needs recalibration or software update? Can short circuiting negative and positive battery cable reset BSI and solve the problem? Or there is some issue with turbo?

Stop/Start function started working after I cleaned the positive battery pole but I consider turning it off when going on long rides in order to help engine get warm and regenerate the DPF.

Is Automatic gearshifting mode turned off when P1445 error occurs? Is this why there is a "Service" text light on instrument panel display?

Or do you think the reason Automatic gearshifting mode is turned off is because of Eolys additive fluid pimp, is it really an 'engine Fault Repair Needed -turn off automatic shifting'-error or are there errors which Kingbolen Ediag is not detecting?

In Kingbolen throttle, brake etc response seems normal. Can you list something very specific I should look at in live data?

VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]

Update:

I asked Kingbolen if the reason that automatic gearshifting mode is turned off is because of empty-Eolys related errors or "Top-of-column Transmission Failure On The LIN" and they answered that it is probably the latter, which I think is too because sometimes when selecting D the car still was in Neutral or when having to start the car and putting gear lever in N from D the car still thought it was in D so I had to redo the move from D to N and then start the car.

"Dear Customer,

Thank you for reaching out to us with your detailed inquiry regarding the issue with your Citroen C4 B7 2013. We understand how frustrating this situation can be, and we’re here to help clarify the possible causes.

Based on the errors detected with your Kingbolen scanner, here’s our analysis:

?Eolys Related Error:
The Eolys system is related to the diesel particulate filter (DPF) additive. While this error can cause engine performance issues, it is ?unlikely to directly affect the automatic gearshifting? functionality.

?**"Top-of-column Transmission Failure On The LIN":
This error indicates a communication issue on the LIN bus or a fault in the ?column-mounted transmission module/sensor**. The LIN bus is a communication network that connects various components in your vehicle, including the gear selector and transmission control module (TCM).

If there is a LIN bus communication fault or a failure in the column-mounted module/sensor, it can ?prevent the gear selector from functioning properly, such as causing the P (Park) position to become stuck or disabling automatic gearshifting.
Since manual paddle shifting still works, this suggests that the issue is ?not related to the actuator fluid or gearbox fluid? but rather to the communication or control system.
Next Steps:
To pinpoint the exact cause, we recommend:

?Inspecting the LIN bus wiring and connections? for any damage or loose connections.
?Checking the column-mounted transmission module/sensor? for faults.
?Consulting a professional technician? with access to advanced diagnostic tools to further investigate the issue.
If you need further assistance or have additional questions, please don’t hesitate to contact us. We’re here to help!"

So my question to this forum is if there is a simple DIY way to fix this gear selector position sensor error?

But the downgrade and symptoms still differ from the P1718 code for gear selector sensor problem (no crawl, disabled start/stop, no orange PRND triangle), viewtopic.php?t=69318. My car does not even have P1718 error so what could be the real cause for automatic gear shifting mode being turned off.

[frer8833]

This thread is about a similar issue with A switching to M, http://c4owners.org/plugins/forum/forum ... php?159202

[frer8833]

I think I know why automatic gearshifting mode switches to manual.

My car, Citroen C4 II, B7, 2013, started to switch from A to M (automatic to manual) when starting car and accompanied by a beep and Engine Fault Repair Needed display text. RPM is limited to 3K. I think it is caused by the planned obsolescens error which is triggered by how many times I have fueled the car or opened the fuel cap, which is p1445 error code. It says DPF is old and need replacement even if DPF is actually good and it is in my case. It also turns off the eolys pump like a domino effect. Eolys level is also ok, no low eolys error code.

These are the error codes triggered by "DPF-is-old-bogus-error": "P0EB0 Additive reservoire empty fault", "P1434 Multiplexed additive pump. Pump fault.", "P1445 Additive adding. The quantity of injected into the particle emission filter has exceeded the maximum threshold. The particulate emission filter must be changed.", "B1811 Fault on the diesel additive pump". P0EB0 is fake error, Eolys is not empty.

I'm going to do what the guy does in this video to get my car out of lowkey limp mode and report back with results.

So with the scanner I will do DPF-replacement teach-in, this tells the ECU that the DPF is replaced because if P1445 is already triggered it is too late to use a DPF-reset to reset the 'P1445 timer', which tells the ECU that the ash-level counter is reset to 0%.

"Cars Programmed To Have Fault At Pre Set Mileage P1445 FAP/DPF Needs To Be Replaced. But Does it?" O'Riley's Autos