Peugeot 207 1.4 - suspected seized engine

[Ady2021]

Our Peugeot 207 with the 1.4 8v TU3A KFV engine appears to have reached the end of its life.

The problems are:
1. Major excessive oil consumption (1 litre per 100 miles) and lots of exhaust smoke
2. Engine is barely running now - no surprise when burning this much oil!
3. Loud squealing noise when the engine is put under load

I was going to change the piston rings on it but I am concerned that the squealing noise is the main bearings which are seizing up. Can anyone confirm what bad main bearings sound like please. I have already tried removing the serpentine belt and the noise is still there so it is the engine.

[jsp]

how about buying another used engine and swap it?

[Ady2021]

Yes I was thinking about getting another used engine but was worried if these TU3A engines are generally troublesome and would be wasting my time and money?

[ozvtr]

Biggest problem with the TU3 engine is that they are not very powerful! Actually the biggest problem is the stock cylinder head gaskets. They have a fault and leak oil.
Worn main bearings and "big ends" will "knock". A sort of "clacking" sound.
If you've got squealing, check oil pressure. Could also be a blocked oil gallery. Squealing is not normal. Having said that, I had a squealing sound coming from the exhaust mount under the engine. Sounded like it was the engine. The weld had split and the two sides were rubbing.
IMHO the TU3 is quite reliable...nice and simple. Not much to break! The engines can be rebuilt very easily...but not economically! They are not worth rebuilding, not when they are so prevalent in breaker yards and they are put into (no offence) cheap cars. If you include the Citroen variants, these were put in a lot of cars over the years.
You have not said how many miles your engine has done? You should get at least 200K miles before oil consumption begins to become a problem. I have a C3 that has done about 100K miles and it consumes less than 1 litre in 6K miles (the oil change interval).
HOWEVER all of this depends on how well the engine was looked after. Being a small engine people tend to "flog" them to get a bit of performance out of them! Also, typically being installed in a um...er...ladies car, they don't get the attention they might require (again IMHO).
So over all the engines are reliable...it's the owners that aren't!

[Ady2021]

Yes, I have already done the head gasket - due to the famous oil leak.
You are correct that it is a cheap ladies car - it is what the wife uses and she is in a very bad mood that it is kaput and she is having to use my car.

I am happy to whip the head and sump off and put some new piston rings in but if the squealing sound is a main bearing which is in the early stage of seizing up then there is no point. Have you ever known a bearing squeal? There is little else inside that engine as they are so basic. The oil pressure light goes off as soon as you start the car so that must be ok and it never came on when all the trouble started.

It has done 127k miles and was burning more oil than an Iraqi oil field.

[CitroJim]

Last time I had a TU displaying all those symptoms I found it had holed pistons from severe detonation!

I wrote it off and got another from a scrap vehicle. I think this is the best course of action here...

[Ady2021]

That is interesting, I never thought that the pistons could be holed! That would be another probable cause of the noise - air being forced through holes in the pistons!

I have been phoning around some scrappies but am not having much luck. The best I have found so far is an un-tested engine for £180 which can not be started to test it and I have to even remove myself! I am therefore thinking about trying to rebuild my own engine. The only thing stopping me is if the main bearings are bad as it looks a lot of work to get to them on this engine. What are the tell tale signs of main bearings that are going bad? I have had to do big end bearings a few times before so I am familiar with their knock but I have never come across bad main bearings before.

When the car broke down and gave up, my wife said the oil pressure light never came on and even if I let it tick over now, the oil pressure light is not on.

[CitroJim]

Bad main bearings tend to make a graunchy rumbling noise...

[Rp0thejester]

Can you explain the bad main bearing noise in more detail please Jim? As it is your description sounds like my grandad sleeping.

[Ady2021]

I would love to know a bit more too.
Is the rumbling noise for well developed wear and could they make other noises in early stages of wear?

The noise I am experiencing is like 'drivebelt squeal' but it is not as the drivebelt has been removed and gets much worse as the RPM increases. I though it could be main bearings if they are on the verge of seizing.

[Rp0thejester]

To check the belts, I would spray silicon spray on them. If still got noise's then it's something else

[Gibbo2286]

I would love to know a bit more too.
Is the rumbling noise for well developed wear and could they make other noises in early stages of wear?

The noise I am experiencing is like 'drivebelt squeal' but it is not as the drivebelt has been removed and gets much worse as the RPM increases. I though it could be main bearings if they are on the verge of seizing.

Main bearings tend to 'rumble' but you will rarely find main bearings worn out before the big end bearings so if the big ends are not knocking I'd discount that, holes blown through detonation are generally in the centre of the piston top and result in a complete lack of compression on that cylinder, so should be easy to diagnose, the squealing belt can be identified by pouring water over it, wouldn't recommend silicone.

[Ady2021]

It is not the serpentine belt as I have tried running the engine with that removed and the noise is still there.

I have had the same experience with bottom ends and have done loads of big end bearings but have so far never done any main bearings.

The compression tester gave results that were a bit too high but I know it is burning a lot of oil so the results are probably equivalent to a wet compression test. The results were, 16, 16, 16, 15 bar and were on the high side of the green zone on the compression gauge at 230 psi. This does give me hope there is some life left in that engine as long as the rest of it is ok.

[Ady2021]

I have managed to capture and audio clip of the noise if any of you have heard this before. The serpentine belt has been removed and so it is not that.

Sorry, I had to zip the mp3 file as the site will not allow me to upload it otherwise.

[Paul-R]

You really need to narrow down where that noise is located. A device like a doctor's stethoscope is needed really.