Hi all,
I'm new to Peugeots, having just switched from my trusty old BMW 3 series, and was hoping for some advice regarding the timing/cam belt.
The Pug in question is a 1991 205 GT with a meagre 28000 miles on the clock. It's had a good life and regular servicing but I don't think the timing belt has been changed yet.
My question is this - would a change be recommended given the age of the car, despite the mileage? And if so, is it a job that can be DIY'd? I'm quite handy with cars but am not the sort to take engines out etc. I just wondered how complicated it was, and how reliable the belts are on 205s of this ilk.
If it's really tricky, does anyone have a ball-park figure as to how much a garage would charge for the job (not an authorised Pug dealership, mind - if their prices are anything like BMWs I'd need a second mortgage).
Any advice gratefully received,
Josh M
Timing belt advice (205)
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JohnD
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Thirteen years is a long time to run a cambelt, even if it has just done 30K miles. I would get it changed ASAP. All my experience has been on various Pug and Cit diesel engines, but I don't think your engine has a spring loaded pulley, so care has to be taken in getting the tension correct. I guess a small garage would charge around £130.
Hi
I belive the TU series engine uses a cam type tensioner pulley and not a spring loaded one so a bit of car does need to be taken when tensioning the belt up.
Basicly what I've always done is if you can get the tension so you can twist the long section of belt between the cam and crank pulley (not the tensioner and water pump side) by about 90deg your not far off. although there may be some more knowledgable people that could give you a more accurate way of doing it.
If you do it yourself and find once you've got it together that it seems to whirr a bit then chances are it's a bit to tight and it wants backing off a touch before it can do any damage to the bearings.
don't know wether this helps you or not but it really isn't as hard as it may sound...
I must have done about 6-8 of them now on various pugs and the first 2 I did get a friend mechanic to check them and he said they were spot on so my method can't be that far off.......
I belive the TU series engine uses a cam type tensioner pulley and not a spring loaded one so a bit of car does need to be taken when tensioning the belt up.
Basicly what I've always done is if you can get the tension so you can twist the long section of belt between the cam and crank pulley (not the tensioner and water pump side) by about 90deg your not far off. although there may be some more knowledgable people that could give you a more accurate way of doing it.
If you do it yourself and find once you've got it together that it seems to whirr a bit then chances are it's a bit to tight and it wants backing off a touch before it can do any damage to the bearings.
don't know wether this helps you or not but it really isn't as hard as it may sound...
I must have done about 6-8 of them now on various pugs and the first 2 I did get a friend mechanic to check them and he said they were spot on so my method can't be that far off.......
Great, thanks Dan. I took a look at the Haynes manual yesterday and it doesn't look like a prticularly big job, you're right.
I'm wondering if you could help me with another question (I'm a bit of a beginner with cam belts since my old car had a chain - so much easier!).
Should I be looking to replace anything else whilst I'm at it, e.g. water pump, tensioner pulley? The car's only done 28K but the parts aren't expensive so perhaps you would recommend I did as much down there as possible in one go? Additionally, are there any bolts or fixings that commonly break when working down there?
Thanks again, Josh
I'm wondering if you could help me with another question (I'm a bit of a beginner with cam belts since my old car had a chain - so much easier!).
Should I be looking to replace anything else whilst I'm at it, e.g. water pump, tensioner pulley? The car's only done 28K but the parts aren't expensive so perhaps you would recommend I did as much down there as possible in one go? Additionally, are there any bolts or fixings that commonly break when working down there?
Thanks again, Josh
I have refurbished the head on my 205xs, so have had the belt on and off several times!
It is fairly straightforward to do.
You need to remove all 3 timing belt covers; the top and middle ones are easy, just 5 10mm bolts, unclip a wire carrier and off they come.
The bottom one can only be accessed after removing the alternator belt belt pulley. This in turn can only be accessed under the offside front wheel arch after removing a panel from behind the wheel. These screws can be rusted and difficult to remove.
So, once the pulley and all 3 covers are off, you need to lock the crankshaft and camshaft timing. First you need to rotate the engine, either by rocking the car back forth with it in 4th gear or using a 22mm socket on the CRANKSHAFT pulley (NEVER be tempted to use the Camshaft for this job) so that the hole on the camshaft pulley lines up with the hole in the head, stick a 10mm bolt into this hole to lock the camshaft. Then you should be able to stick a screw into the flywheel to lock that. The hole for this is at the front of the block, to to the right of the exhaust manifold.
Once the engine is locked, you can undo the tensioner using a 13mm spanner and push it free. The belt can be removed and replaced. To tighten the tensioner you need a square ended spanner, I use a multi-headed tool that is designed for removing sump bolts.
As mentioned above, tighten it so that the longest free length, which will be at the front, can just be twisted through 90 degrees. Pug recommend some sort of special tool, but we aren't talking Ferraris here!
Once you are happy with the tension, remove the locking bolts and rotate the engine by hand a couple fo turns, just to make sure it goes round. It should, but you never know. Put it all back together and Bob's you uncle!
If there is anything I have missed out or you are unsure of, just shout and I will see if I can help.
Cheers,
Antony
It is fairly straightforward to do.
You need to remove all 3 timing belt covers; the top and middle ones are easy, just 5 10mm bolts, unclip a wire carrier and off they come.
The bottom one can only be accessed after removing the alternator belt belt pulley. This in turn can only be accessed under the offside front wheel arch after removing a panel from behind the wheel. These screws can be rusted and difficult to remove.
So, once the pulley and all 3 covers are off, you need to lock the crankshaft and camshaft timing. First you need to rotate the engine, either by rocking the car back forth with it in 4th gear or using a 22mm socket on the CRANKSHAFT pulley (NEVER be tempted to use the Camshaft for this job) so that the hole on the camshaft pulley lines up with the hole in the head, stick a 10mm bolt into this hole to lock the camshaft. Then you should be able to stick a screw into the flywheel to lock that. The hole for this is at the front of the block, to to the right of the exhaust manifold.
Once the engine is locked, you can undo the tensioner using a 13mm spanner and push it free. The belt can be removed and replaced. To tighten the tensioner you need a square ended spanner, I use a multi-headed tool that is designed for removing sump bolts.
As mentioned above, tighten it so that the longest free length, which will be at the front, can just be twisted through 90 degrees. Pug recommend some sort of special tool, but we aren't talking Ferraris here!
Once you are happy with the tension, remove the locking bolts and rotate the engine by hand a couple fo turns, just to make sure it goes round. It should, but you never know. Put it all back together and Bob's you uncle!
If there is anything I have missed out or you are unsure of, just shout and I will see if I can help.
Cheers,
Antony
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JohnD
- (Donor 2022)
- Posts: 2632
- Joined: 14 Mar 2001, 23:41
- Location: Epsom, Surrey
- My Cars: 2010 Citroen C5-X7 tourer
1998 Citroen Saxo 1.5D
2018 Citroen C4-B7
1998 Peugeot 306. 1.9D
2011 Citroen C1 - x 72
- Contact:
Before refitting the belt give the tensioner pulley a spin and check for smooth running. Also examine around the water pump for any signs of leaking. It's worth considering rounding off the job with a new auxillary belt.
Crankshaft bolts can be b*****ds to get undone. Have the engine hot before attempting it.
Crankshaft bolts can be b*****ds to get undone. Have the engine hot before attempting it.
You don't have to remove the crankshaft bolt to get the belt off, just the auxiliary belt pulley.
But as JohnD says, the pulley bolts can be tight, if they are, don't ever be tempted to use the locking pins as something to pull against with a spanner. Best thing to do is; remove the locking pins, get someone to sit in the car with it in gear and foot hard on the brakes to hold the crankshaft tight.It is good advice to check the tensioner pulley and water pump. When I removed my timing belt, the water pump began to leak, but luckily it was only the rubber seal and not the pump itself - £1.
If you do ever need to remove the crankshaft bolt or if the auxiliary pulley bolts are super-tight and you have no assistant to stand on the brakes, you could do as I did and get an impact wrench from Argos. It was £15 and one the most useful tools I have.
But as JohnD says, the pulley bolts can be tight, if they are, don't ever be tempted to use the locking pins as something to pull against with a spanner. Best thing to do is; remove the locking pins, get someone to sit in the car with it in gear and foot hard on the brakes to hold the crankshaft tight.It is good advice to check the tensioner pulley and water pump. When I removed my timing belt, the water pump began to leak, but luckily it was only the rubber seal and not the pump itself - £1.
If you do ever need to remove the crankshaft bolt or if the auxiliary pulley bolts are super-tight and you have no assistant to stand on the brakes, you could do as I did and get an impact wrench from Argos. It was £15 and one the most useful tools I have.
Hi again all,
Firstly, thanks again for all advice so far. There was a delay in acquiring the car but I have now got it.
I took the top cover off yesterday and again today to check the state of the belt, and am wondering if it really needs doing yet. I would really appreciate it if someone could offer their opinion on the state of the belt. I have a (not incredibly clear) JPEG (about 50KB) of it here: http://www.zen19266.zen.co.uk . Obviously I'll get round to it at some point but there don't seem to be any signs of serious wear or damage.
Cheers, Josh
Firstly, thanks again for all advice so far. There was a delay in acquiring the car but I have now got it.
I took the top cover off yesterday and again today to check the state of the belt, and am wondering if it really needs doing yet. I would really appreciate it if someone could offer their opinion on the state of the belt. I have a (not incredibly clear) JPEG (about 50KB) of it here: http://www.zen19266.zen.co.uk . Obviously I'll get round to it at some point but there don't seem to be any signs of serious wear or damage.
Cheers, Josh
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philhoward
Yowza! It's done - many thanks to all the kind souls out there who helped me with this. It took quite a while to do since I didn't know where anything was under the bonnet, and I did a poor job of tensioning the belt first time (fortunatley I tested it by pushing the car before firing up the engine!). It also took me ages to find the hole used to lock the flywheel - but that's because I was looking at Haynes manual and not reading macaroni's reply!!.
Josh
Josh