Xantia 1.9TD cooling fans not working - HELP!!!!
Moderator: RichardW
Xantia 1.9TD cooling fans not working - HELP!!!!
Hi,
Yes another cry for help, I have just bought my first Citroen Xantia, a 1.9TD 1996, but I have 1 small problem, the cooling fans don't seem to work.
The car has Aircon but this doesnt work (pipe broke going into the condensor)will this affect the fans?
The other day i was stuck in a traffic jam and the car overheated, the orange light and the red stop light came on, so i promptly pulled over to check, the fans were not working, once cooled down i was able to continue.
The car drives fine normally as the fans turn from the air against them whilst driving.
Please help me, is it the thermostat? the Bitron? or is it the fans? or is it the relays on the fans?
Yours frustratedly
Dave
Yes another cry for help, I have just bought my first Citroen Xantia, a 1.9TD 1996, but I have 1 small problem, the cooling fans don't seem to work.
The car has Aircon but this doesnt work (pipe broke going into the condensor)will this affect the fans?
The other day i was stuck in a traffic jam and the car overheated, the orange light and the red stop light came on, so i promptly pulled over to check, the fans were not working, once cooled down i was able to continue.
The car drives fine normally as the fans turn from the air against them whilst driving.
Please help me, is it the thermostat? the Bitron? or is it the fans? or is it the relays on the fans?
Yours frustratedly
Dave
First things first - you need to establish if the fans are capable of working. As both are failing to work, the odds are this is NOT the problem, but it wouldn't do any harm to find out. If fans are triggered by a standard Radiator-mounted thermoswitch, it should be possible to test fan operation by bridging the appropriate contacts.
If this works it's a case of inappropriate inputs - or none at all.
Check that the thermostat is opening in response to increasing coolant temperature, and allowing flow via the top hose to the radiator as the engine warms up. If the radiator and thus the fan sensors don't get any hot coolant, they can't do their job.
Check that the radiator is heating up both top and bottom. If it only heats up at the top, then it may have silted up and need flushing/replacement. This can also give a "delayed" reaction to overheating, as the coolant isn't circulating fast enough to give an accurate indication of temperature by the time it's reaching the thermoswitch. The temp sensors for the warnings are probably at the the hotter end of the radiator.
In any case, I'd also be suspicious if you can't confirm when the coolant was last changed,or if it was changed by someone unfamiliar with the procedure for bleeding PSA engine coolant systems.
Good luck - a bitron-experienced Xantia owner should be along shortly with more specific information ..... Bitron may have some input from the aircon, but should be overridden by overall coolant temperature.
If this works it's a case of inappropriate inputs - or none at all.
Check that the thermostat is opening in response to increasing coolant temperature, and allowing flow via the top hose to the radiator as the engine warms up. If the radiator and thus the fan sensors don't get any hot coolant, they can't do their job.
Check that the radiator is heating up both top and bottom. If it only heats up at the top, then it may have silted up and need flushing/replacement. This can also give a "delayed" reaction to overheating, as the coolant isn't circulating fast enough to give an accurate indication of temperature by the time it's reaching the thermoswitch. The temp sensors for the warnings are probably at the the hotter end of the radiator.
In any case, I'd also be suspicious if you can't confirm when the coolant was last changed,or if it was changed by someone unfamiliar with the procedure for bleeding PSA engine coolant systems.
Good luck - a bitron-experienced Xantia owner should be along shortly with more specific information ..... Bitron may have some input from the aircon, but should be overridden by overall coolant temperature.
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You've been 'Bitroned'!!
On cars with A/C, the bitron controller controls the fans, and the red over temp light (I believe the gauge is fed from a separate sender). Only problem is, how do you trouble shoot it - answer I don't really know! I think the Bitron is supposed to 'fail safe' eg if it sees open circuit from the temperature sender it whacks the fans on full - you could try pulling the wire off to see what happens (need to look in Haynes to see which sender it is on the 'stat housing). Failing that you might be able to get to the back of the fans through the grille and see if they run if you put 12v direct across them. There is a fuse / relay I think somewher, but where / which one I don't know - might be worth finding this and pulling it out before you stick your hand behind the grille, as the fans can run at any time, and you might just jolt them into life when your fingers are in the wrong place.... I think that the fans are supposed to come on when you switch the air-con on - however, there is a low pressure cut out in the system which stops the compressor from running if there is no gas - but I don't know if this will inhibit the fan operation also.
Whilst the 2 speed relay set up on non A/C is complicated, at least I would be able to understand it....!!!
On cars with A/C, the bitron controller controls the fans, and the red over temp light (I believe the gauge is fed from a separate sender). Only problem is, how do you trouble shoot it - answer I don't really know! I think the Bitron is supposed to 'fail safe' eg if it sees open circuit from the temperature sender it whacks the fans on full - you could try pulling the wire off to see what happens (need to look in Haynes to see which sender it is on the 'stat housing). Failing that you might be able to get to the back of the fans through the grille and see if they run if you put 12v direct across them. There is a fuse / relay I think somewher, but where / which one I don't know - might be worth finding this and pulling it out before you stick your hand behind the grille, as the fans can run at any time, and you might just jolt them into life when your fingers are in the wrong place.... I think that the fans are supposed to come on when you switch the air-con on - however, there is a low pressure cut out in the system which stops the compressor from running if there is no gas - but I don't know if this will inhibit the fan operation also.
Whilst the 2 speed relay set up on non A/C is complicated, at least I would be able to understand it....!!!
I have tried removing the sensors and this makes no difference, i have also found the Bitron under the n/s headlamp and sprayed the contacts with WD40 but to no avail. The radiator doesn't have a mounted thermostat swith as the car has Aircon, the only thing i have left to try is putting a wire direct to the fans.
Has anyone else got any ideas, PLEASE.
Dave
Has anyone else got any ideas, PLEASE.
Dave
Hi Gents,
Thnaks for all the advice, victory, i tested both fans and neither worked, i have now replaced both fans with secondhand ones, blead the system and hey presto they work, it was both fans along. If anyone else has a similar problem take it from me it is definately easier to remove the radiators to get to the fans rather than the bumper, infact don't even contemplate removing the bumper, the bolts inside the foglight housings are impossible unless you have triple jointed arms.
A little tip for anyone who does take the rad of, take the silly spring clip off the bottom hose and throw it away and replace it with a 2" jubilee clip its a lot easier and you can access it from inside the wheel arch/bottom trim.
Triumphantly
Dave[:D]
Thnaks for all the advice, victory, i tested both fans and neither worked, i have now replaced both fans with secondhand ones, blead the system and hey presto they work, it was both fans along. If anyone else has a similar problem take it from me it is definately easier to remove the radiators to get to the fans rather than the bumper, infact don't even contemplate removing the bumper, the bolts inside the foglight housings are impossible unless you have triple jointed arms.
A little tip for anyone who does take the rad of, take the silly spring clip off the bottom hose and throw it away and replace it with a 2" jubilee clip its a lot easier and you can access it from inside the wheel arch/bottom trim.
Triumphantly
Dave[:D]
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- Panjandrum
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AAARGGH.
I had nearside fan replaced last year at dealer after there were problems with slow fan not coming on - just the jet plane, car lurching, fast speed effect coming on when the temperature got high enough. All went well for 11 months.
Then the same thing happened again so back it went - under parts warranty. Fixed, apparently, by some fixing of bad connections. Ten days later, only one fan coming on at high speed at low engine temperatures. I left it back again, again this morning. Now I've found this litany of woe about Xantia cooling fans!
I had nearside fan replaced last year at dealer after there were problems with slow fan not coming on - just the jet plane, car lurching, fast speed effect coming on when the temperature got high enough. All went well for 11 months.
Then the same thing happened again so back it went - under parts warranty. Fixed, apparently, by some fixing of bad connections. Ten days later, only one fan coming on at high speed at low engine temperatures. I left it back again, again this morning. Now I've found this litany of woe about Xantia cooling fans!
- Panjandrum
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Have had the same problem, but I have replaced two relays which controls the fans. You have to take of the grill mask to do that. However I think that regardless that your ac is not working the car thinks it does. So when you start the car fans come on in first gear in order for ac to work, and only when the temperature grows the theromostat takes over and they change to second gear. Try the ac swithc in on dashboard.