Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

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cuteebony
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Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by cuteebony »

Hello all,

I have been let down by a local garage in Biggleswade and I seriously need help on how to resolve the issue. Without further ado, below are the details of my problem.

I have a 2009 Diesel 2.0 HDI 16V VTR+ Nav (140bhp) which I bought in February 2020 and has been running like clock since then. Even though it doesn't have any issue, I decided to service it for the first time since purchase just because it's the right thing to do. I took it to a local garage/dealer here in Biggleswade for the service.

Prior to this, I saw some few oil spots (not major) on the parking lot and I thought this is the best opportunity to check for any possible leakage. I took a picture of the spotting and I showed it to them at the garage, told them to check if there is any leakage somewhere. They told me they need to wash off all the sediments of oil before it can be trace and I said that's fine by me. I went to collect the car and I asked about the oil leakage. They told me it’s not included in the service, and it was not carried out (this is contrary to what I was told earlier. I was told they will check it out during the service). I let it slide and dropped the car off at the garage the next day for them to wash off the oil traces.

On picking the car up, I was welcomed with a check engine light and a beep with warning message "Anti-pollution system faulty" on the dashboard. I switch it off immediately and went back to the garage to complain about this. I was told that this is a normal thing when an engine has been jet washed. I was like really? Jet washed? He said yes, that the engine was jet washed, in order to trace the oil leakage; the underside of the engine bay was jet washed and water splashed in the engine, and they jet washed the whole engine! I have never had any light on the dashboard on this lovely car prior to taking it to this garage and they seem to have destroyed this flawless car :(

After a lot of argument, I was told it’s because the wire harness is still wet and that the message and the warning light will disappear when the engine is fully dried out. I was told to bring it back after one week if there is any light / warning left on the dashboard by then. I drove off and keeping my fingers crossed.

On the 4th day prior to the 1 week I was told to bring back the car to the garage, I was on my way to Luton and I dropped into a filling station for top-up. That was it. The car never started again. I cranked it for up to 70 times (total number of starting attempts made in about 90 minutes) but no luck. I eventually booked a car recovery to get me out of the middle of nowhere that I was. At the point of confirming the appointment with the recovery, I told myself that I will keep cranking it until the battery runs down, after all, I would be recovered. The car started after the second attempt and lucky me, the car recovered itself back home.

I drove straight to the garage and narrated everything that had happened. Without writing much about the conversations / raising of voice that went on, the garage did not take responsibility of these issues. They plugged their OBD diagnostic tool into the car and it returned the following codes:

1. P2148 - Permanent fault - Bank1 injector control voltage too high
2. P1351 - Intermittent - Pre-heating relay circuit Relay controlled and spark plugs not supplied
3. The check engine light is on the dashboard and the "Anti-pollution system faulty" message also comes up anytime the car ignition is on.

After a lengthy heated conversation, the garage still did not responsibility of what had happened and I eventually spoke with the manager. He told me that if I can show him evidence that it is the jet washing that caused the problem, he will reimburse me whatever it costs to fix the issue. They cleared the error codes but the check engine and anti-pollution message came straight back up before I left the garage. They cleared it again and it comes back immediately. I was told to bring the car back to the garage for injector cleaning. Really? I decided not to take it back there so that they don't create more non-existing faults and escalate the issue further.

Instead of going back to that garage, I booked an appointment with a mobile mechanic. He came yesterday and he was very disappointed at the fact that the engine was jet washed. He said the jet washing is definitely the cause of these issues but he said this is difficult to prove in terms of the evidence that the manager asked me for earlier. He found out that some parts of the wiring harness are still very wet. He dried it up a bit, cleared the codes and the car was starting up fine. 2 hours later, I went to the store and the car did not start when I was done shopping. I ringed the mobile mechanic again and he arrived at the store about 45 minutes later. He fired up the engine and it started once. Of course, the check engine light and the anti-pollution message still remain on the dashboard.

The mobile mechanic said this is a tricky situation because the engine doesn't start when warm. It starts fine when it has cooled down a bit and when it's cold. The mobile mechanic seems to know what he is doing but there is a problem. He wants to be swapping out different parts (like new injectors, new relays and worst case scenario, the ECU, all at my own cost) until the issue is resolved. However, I need someone that can help me diagnose the issue with the car without me having to buy a lot of part that are not faulty in the first place. Can someone recommend any diagnostic centre where this car can be fixed once and for all? Thanks for your patience and reading this to the end.

MGmike
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by MGmike »

Sorry to hear of your bad experience but sadly I'm not surprised by the dealers actions and response.

Take your car down the BL Auto's & Son as it's only a short hop down the A1 and I'm sure you'll be well looked after.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Biggl ... 891838!3e0

You can ignore the P1351 as that's related to a glow plug fault and will have no impact on the car in the UK. It's the P2148 that seems to be your main issue and that's probably a fault on injector 1 but it needs confirming before swapping parts for no good reason.

Good luck

cuteebony
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by cuteebony »

MGmike wrote:
07 Jun 2021, 09:26
Sorry to hear of your bad experience but sadly I'm not surprised by the dealers actions and response.

Take your car down the BL Auto's & Son as it's only a short hop down the A1 and I'm sure you'll be well looked after.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Biggl ... 891838!3e0

You can ignore the P1351 as that's related to a glow plug fault and will have no impact on the car in the UK. It's the P2148 that seems to be your main issue and that's probably a fault on injector 1 but it needs confirming before swapping parts for no good reason.

Good luck

Thanks a lot for the reply and the suggestion @MGmike. I will give the workshop a call and post updates about the issue on this thread. Many thanks

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by GiveMeABreak »

I'd be putting in a complaint - you should NEVER jet wash an engine - that's something a 2 year old would know and any decent garage should know this. With all the sensitive electronics, there's no telling where the water has gone - what damage it has done and whether it has shorted out a control unit or such like. Totally irresponsible.

As to your immediate P2148 fault:
Fault Code:P2148
Description of Fault: Injector bank 1: Voltage too high. Voltage on the bank of injectors too high for 2 engine revolutions. The engine warning message will be lit.
Conditions for Fault to clear: Ignition on
Downgrade Modes whilst Fault is active:
  • Deactivation of processing of the accelerometry
  • Torque limitation for traction control
  • Deactivation of the traction control (Traction control)
  • Deactivation of the speed limiter
  • Deactivation speed limiter until the next time the ignition is switched on
  • Deactivation of the cruise control
  • Deactivation cruise control until the next time the ignition is switched on
  • Deactivation of the accelerometry strategies
  • Deactivation of the detection of loop difference on the fuel flow rate regulator
  • Deactivation of this compensation strategy of the injectors postinjection to postinjection
  • Deactivation of the strategy of compensation of the down times of the injectors
  • The engine ECU limits the fuel flow
Symptoms:
  • Engine hesitating, cutting out
  • Starting problem
  • Lack of power
Suspect Areas:
  • Injector bank
  • Fuel injector
  • Electrical harness
  • Connectors
So I suspect it is electrical related - as a result of the water damage, either into the harness / wiring or connectors.

I'm not sure what your best course of action is (apart from suing the garage of course), but allowing enough time for the water to dry up may be what is needed - but certainly some checking of the connectors (disconnecting and checking for water ingress) and drying these up may help. The issue is if water has got into the wiring harness or looms, it can travel into the electrical connectors as the car is moving and can take a while to get rid of.

Peter.N.
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by Peter.N. »

I think it likely that if you take it on a long run (if you feel like risking it) that it will completely dry out and maybe OK. The electronics on modern cars are very complicated and most work at very low current which means that the voltages are easily disturbed by damp let alone a good soaking.

Peter

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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by Dormouse »

We had a similar but not so terminal issue with our new Dacia Sandero a while back. Despite requesting that they NOT wash our car after a service and the manager denying that a wash had been carried out, we took him out to the car park where the car was still dripping water! However, from a legal view point you would have to prove negligence on the part of the garage as you did request that the car be cleaned and inspected for oil leaks. In a nutshell, now that a second technician has worked on the vehicle your chances are subsiding. This is from my previous professional experience in this field. Personally, all I can say is - never use that garage again, ever!
This is going to sound daft but leave the car sitting with the bonnet open as long as possible in dry weather. It could help dry the under bonnet out quicker.

cuteebony
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by cuteebony »

Hello all,

Thanks for all the replies so far. I have thought of taking the legal route but to be honest, I don't know how to go about it and I don't know the cost implication of doing so either. I also don't know how to prove this even though it is obviously the cause of the problem. I just want to give a quick update about the issue. I will reply every question later (currently at work).

So yesterday, it was very sunny here in Biggleswade. I opened up the bonnet for hours, yanked off all the rubber cover in the engine bay as well as that of the fuse box, removed the battery and exposed a lot of the electrics/ wiring harness to the sun. I removed the connectors to the four injectors and sprayed contact cleaner on all the four. I put everything back when the sun went down and gave the car a 10 minutes run on A1. The car drives fine (as before) without any noticeable engine performance issues. I switched the engine off and started it again immediately. It started. I switched it on and off a couple of times and it started.

I went back after about 20 minutes to start it again. It started on the second crank. I gave it another 10 minutes run on A1. No noticeable performance issues. It started again immediately after the run. It usually won't start when warm prior to the sun dry. I don't know if this is only a coincidence though. However, the check engine light and the anti-pollution message is still on the dashboard. I will continue carrying out the sun drying anytime I am chanced and see if the issue eventually sorts itself out.

Meanwhile, I have sent a PM to a forum member with Lexia 3 (Chris570) and he has agreed to help me diagnose it. We are currently trying to work out a time for that.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, so ignore the P1351 - that is common to most HDi engines regarding the glow plugs. You have the fault code for the P2148 above, but of there is anything else you are getting, put the fault codes up - although at this stage it will be hard to rule out water as a cause until it has totally been dried out and any damage ruled out.

As far as complaints are concerned, check out the advice from Which here:

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights ... t%20online.

Dormouse
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by Dormouse »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
07 Jun 2021, 12:58
Ok, so ignore the P1351 - that is common to most HDi engines regarding the glow plugs. You have the fault code for the P2148 above, but of there is anything else you are getting, put the fault codes up - although at this stage it will be hard to rule out water as a cause until it has totally been dried out and any damage ruled out.

As far as complaints are concerned, check out the advice from Which here:

https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights ... t%20online.
This is correct and the way to go. Small Claims Court is not expensive and fairly simple. Get your second technician to produce an expanded written report on his findings and your instructions to him. Write down your instructions to the garage and their replies chronologically and add any information you can including the section in your handbook about pressure cleaning the engine bay. Follow the consumer advice steps and see where you get to.

cuteebony
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by cuteebony »

Hello all,
Some quick updates about this issue.

It seems the warm starting issue has finally disappeared ever since the first sun drying that I did. The car has been starting normally either cold, warm or hot. Apart from the check engine light and the warning about anti-pollution system on the dashboard, I haven't noticed any performance issue with the engine and other car electronics. I also sun dried it again for several hours on Monday and Tuesday respectively.

This morning, it started fine again, popped the check engine light/anti-pollution message as usual but I did something different. I ran it at 70mph on gear 3/6 for about 30 secs. The idea is to run the car at high rev in order to clear something out (I saw this on a post somewhere online where someone also complained about the anti-pollution system fault. Trying to dig out where I saw it online but no luck yet). When I parked, I gave the car a quick start and off up to 5 times and no check engine light/ anti-pollution message on the dashboard in all the 5 attempts. Should I be happy already? I will keep observing for the next couple of days and keep the thread updated. Wish me luck all :)

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Your anti-pollution message is probably a separate issue. If you do lots of short trips then giving it a good run can help clear out any rubbish (often referred to as an 'Italian Tune Up'). Always try and give the car a good run a few times a month.

MGmike
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by MGmike »

cuteebony wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 07:07
Hello all,
Some quick updates about this issue.

It seems the warm starting issue has finally disappeared ever since the first sun drying that I did. The car has been starting normally either cold, warm or hot. Apart from the check engine light and the warning about anti-pollution system on the dashboard, I haven't noticed any performance issue with the engine and other car electronics. I also sun dried it again for several hours on Monday and Tuesday respectively.

This morning, it started fine again, popped the check engine light/anti-pollution message as usual but I did something different. I ran it at 70mph on gear 3/6 for about 30 secs. The idea is to run the car at high rev in order to clear something out (I saw this on a post somewhere online where someone also complained about the anti-pollution system fault. Trying to dig out where I saw it online but no luck yet). When I parked, I gave the car a quick start and off up to 5 times and no check engine light/ anti-pollution message on the dashboard in all the 5 attempts. Should I be happy already? I will keep observing for the next couple of days and keep the thread updated. Wish me luck all :)
It sounds like you might have gotten away with the garage being totally incompetent!

If the fault has cleared it will no longer be reporting to the ECU and the anti-pollution will no longer appear. Some (temporary) engine management faults continue to put the MIL on even after a number of restarts. However, they do eventually clear!!! The error code will still be stored for the next time a diag session is carried out.

fingers crossed it's sorted....

cuteebony
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Re: Help please! - Fault code P2148 / P1351 / Anti-pollution system fault on Diesel 2009 Citroen C5

Post by cuteebony »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 09:27
Your anti-pollution message is probably a separate issue. If you do lots of short trips then giving it a good run can help clear out any rubbish (often referred to as an 'Italian Tune Up'). Always try and give the car a good run a few times a month.
Thanks Marc, good to know. Three hearty cheers to you for all your endless contributions to so many threads here =D>


MGmike wrote:
09 Jun 2021, 18:45
It sounds like you might have gotten away with the garage being totally incompetent!

If the fault has cleared it will no longer be reporting to the ECU and the anti-pollution will no longer appear. Some (temporary) engine management faults continue to put the MIL on even after a number of restarts. However, they do eventually clear!!! The error code will still be stored for the next time a diag session is carried out.

fingers crossed it's sorted....
Thanks mate. I am getting to understand the inner workings of car electronics the more. Kudos to you guys. Indeed, I think I got away with it :)