Parking Tales and hassles

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NewcastleFalcon
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Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

I presume we all like motoring for social domestic and pleasure purposes, maybe even some for business to, but at various points the old jalopy has to be parked. This thread is to mop up your parking tales and hassles.

Here's a starter from me
Steve's unwanted scam penalty charge was reminiscent for a similar thing which landed on my doormat a few weeks ago.

It wasnt a Council thing or a Police thing but a private car parking management company. There was a penalty charge of £100 and a cut-off picture of the Nissan Leaf showing the numberplate and not much more.

The location of the "offence" was decribed in a two-word street name. No number/no postcode/no town. The picture could have been taken anywhere, and the offence.....

"leaving the premises"

The scam-like pay within x days and the fine will be reduced to £60 was also part of information.

To cut a long story short, I discovered that it was a private car park of a coffee shop we have used for years which had been having trouble with customers of the wine bar next door using their car park so they had employed a car parking management company to enforce their "customers only" rules in the car park.

The parking company waived the charge on my appeal backed up by the owner of the coffee shop. Rather than sitting in the car on a hot day, while my wife was getting the takeaway coffees and cake, I had got out the car wandered about a bit and had been caught on camera exiting the car park.

Notices are posted all around the walls noting the terms and conditions you supposedly agree to for parking in the private car park. The most obvious and one with which I would wholeheartedly agree is customers only. However, one of the conditions, (which I found out later), was "Drivers must remain on the premises at all times". Hands up anyone apart from me now, who reads the notices in full, or at all when parking in similar circumstances.

If anyone could be bothered to escalate the hassle and take a bit legal advice, I am fairly sure that restriction of a driver's civil liberties would be an unfair term and condition of any sort of contract entered into to park on the private land, and because there is no charge for the parking, and therefore no contract anyway, any sort of penalty clause or fine would be invalid and not recoverable.

Thankfully this litte saga had the Enid Blyton "Alls well that ends well" conclusion.
Regards Neil

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by Gibbo2286 »

I never had a parking charge problem until my friends got too old and got themselves blue badges for their disabilities.

The first was I took them to Abergavenny for a ride and wander through the market, Frank set the time and popped his badge up near the windscreen, we got a ticket because he'd put it upside down and it couldn't be read, I got that one forgiven upon explaining.

The second, not a parking but a driving through a bus lane, I'd taken Frank to an appointment at Gloucester hospital he wanted to go to the lavvy on the way back through the city which put me off my normal route, the road I should have taken was closed for roadworks so I went through the Quay shopping centre, across the canal bridge and on home, got a ticket for driving in a bus lane (the canal bridge), wondered why so had a close look and could see there were signs there but they were lost in a forest of other signage, had to pay that one.
A report in the press said that Gloucester council had taken £300,000 in penalties on that bus lane in three months, surely they must have known there was something wrong in the place.

The next was again the blue badge, Frank's appointment at Gloucester hospital is changed to Cheltenham for he convenience of the specialist, Frank's now on his last legs, I drive into the carpark and help him into the hospital, he's there for a half hour, on return to the car we've got a ticket, Frank's too ill for me to take the time to challenge it on the spot so I query it on the phone next morning, I'm told it's for parking in a bay not dedicated for disabled badge holders, the private company managing the park on behalf of the hospital tells me all the rules are on a board at the entry to the park, I tell them my passenger was too ill for me to stop and read a long list of small print before entering. Their reply, "Tough, pay up." After much discussion I resort to taking it up with Mark Harper our MP, he manages to get it dropped 'As a goodwill gesture.'
Frank had in the meantime died.
So now I'm taking care of Frank's widow's transport needs, she too has a blue badge after falling on her face on a concrete footpath and breaking bones, you can see the latest episode, which is still to be resolved, in my "Don't go to Gloucester" post. viewtopic.php?t=65954

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myglaren
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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by myglaren »

I think in part at least it is done maliciously, with signage being deliberately poorly place and/or confusing.

What would you do if all disabled parking bays were filled? Short sighted or deliberate.

Nothing more than daylight robbery.

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

With your experiences Gibbo, particularly re the hospital visits is not as if you could vote with your feet and vow not to go there again (like presumably Gloucester). In any City across the country it is a nightmare for the visiting driver, and even for the driver who is more local. I would never knowingly choose to visit Newcastle City Centre and park the car. The likelyhood of being caught on camera, innocently or inadvertently transgressing some traffic management or parking rules are pretty high.

There a number of notorious "hot spots" for motorists trying to negotiate cities the length and breath of the country.

I was caught a few years ago by the Notorious John Dobson Street Bus lane camera in Newcastle, had to stump up the £60 or whatever it was. Newcastle City now have been forced to refund all of those fines, due to "misleading and wrong" signs.

Whenever a camera is described as "Lucrative" and 73,000 drivers have been caught "offending" clearly there is something wrong!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-tyne-53810808

Another case was Lendal Bridge in York.
https://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/111173 ... ys-ruling/

Regards Neil

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myglaren
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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by myglaren »

I was expecting a parking nightmare when I last had to visit the civic centre in Newcastle.
Turned out to be far simpler than expected considering construction work going on there and half the car park fenced off for plant.

I did bugger up my exit though. Fortunately never received a fine for it.

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

Is it already here or is it coming?
Is it already here or is it coming?
Regards Neil

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myglaren
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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by myglaren »

That is complete crap!
I am surely not alone in having a phone that is incapable of that.

I have an aversion to 'apps' at the best of times as it is such a stupid name.

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

myglaren wrote:
15 Sep 2020, 13:20
That is complete crap!
I am surely not alone in having a phone that is incapable of that.

I have an aversion to 'apps' at the best of times as it is such a stupid name.
Its not real Steve, just my imagination! But oddly believable the way things are going.

Sort of thing to pitch to Dragons Den.....you heard it here first! So efficient in collection of charges too, bank details harvested when you download and register, and the spy in your pocket the smart phone to track and trace rule breaking, and getting fellow "Park App" users to dob you in if you are a milimeter over the white line for some reward points!

I'm pleased you didnt like my daft name for it :-D

Regards Neil
Last edited by NewcastleFalcon on 15 Sep 2020, 13:44, edited 1 time in total.

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myglaren
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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by myglaren »

Only a matter of time I'm sure.

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by RichardW »

In Scotland (currently) these private parking charges are not enforceable, as they can only pursue the driver. So you can just ignore their (increasingly hysterical) letters. Last one we had they gave up after 4🤣

Transport bill may bring in provision to pursue the reg keeper, but it's not passed yet.

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CitroJim
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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by CitroJim »

I'm now used to parking by 'app' and find it both easy and convenient... No faffing around with real money, no needing to hope your credit card might work (or be scammed/cloned) and it's easy to extend if you are at risk of overstaying...

And no bit of paper to litter the car, leave stains on the windscreen or blow away or end up upside-down so that some jobsworth can have a bit of excitement and pleasure at your displeasure...

I'm a fan!

I last used an app. controlled parking area when I ran a marathon the other weekend. I initially put on enough to cover my expected completion time but ran happy in the knowledge I could extend wherever I was on the course and a nice little text message would remind me if I was in danger of running out of parking time :D

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by Gibbo2286 »

But first you have to buy the damned smartphone Jim :) I've managed all my life without one and have no desire to own one now, I have a very basic mobile on which I spend less than a tenner a year.

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by CitroJim »

Gibbo2286 wrote:
15 Sep 2020, 18:10
But first you have to buy the damned smartphone Jim :)
That's true Gibbo... I'm like a teenager with my smartphone - couldn't live without one now... The only thing I don't use a smartphone for is this forum... It's hard work on a small screen so the laptop is the first choice... But then again, if I'm away from home the smartphone gets used for that too :)

In fact I'm so dependant ( addicted to?) upon them I have two... One specifically for use when running...

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

CitroJim wrote:
15 Sep 2020, 18:04
I'm now used to parking by 'app' and find it both easy and convenient... No faffing around with real money, no needing to hope your credit card might work (or be scammed/cloned) and it's easy to extend if you are at risk of overstaying...

And no bit of paper to litter the car, leave stains on the windscreen or blow away or end up upside-down so that some jobsworth can have a bit of excitement and pleasure at your displeasure...

I'm a fan!

I last used an app. controlled parking area when I ran a marathon the other weekend. I initially put on enough to cover my expected completion time but ran happy in the knowledge I could extend wherever I was on the course and a nice little text message would remind me if I was in danger of running out of parking time :D
Jim, I thought my fake notice would just be science fiction....but it is here already and youngsters like yourself are embracing it. :-D Although I cant stand such things myself it is refreshing to get a different point of view :-D

REgards Neil

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Re: Parking Tales and hassles

Post by NewcastleFalcon »

You wouldn't really believe that the Supreme Court of the United Kingdom should waste its time on a parking case.

Unbelievably it did and caused a precedent in case law largely in favour of parking management companies. Chip Shop owner Barry Beavis lost his appeal against an £85 parking fine for overstaying a 2-hour limit by almost 1 hour.

Beavis v ParkingEye hinged on whether the fine charged by parking management company ParkingEye is classed as a penalty, which would make it unlawful as penalties need to bear a relation to an actual loss incurred. In this case the company does not incur any loss from an overstay.

The Supreme Court ruled that the fine was not a penalty as the charge authorises the company to control access to the car park in the interest of customers and the wider public, and dismissed Mr Beavis' appeal.

https://www.lawgazette.co.uk/law/suprem ... 87.article

Regards Neil