following my poorly ZX's visit to the mechanic today for a check to see what the problem is ( http://www.andyspares.com/discussionfor ... IC_ID=6227 ) he reckons it is something major, and probably a crack in the cylinder head. [:(]
how would that have happened? one minute it was fine, the next minute it was f**ked
how much is that going to set me back to repair then? is it worth it? I'm skint as it is.
I need my car!
bloody citroen
Moderator: RichardW
-
- Posts: 1246
- Joined: 26 Oct 2003, 16:08
- Location: United Kingdom
- My Cars:
-
- Posts: 114
- Joined: 02 Mar 2001, 17:41
- Location: United Kingdom
- My Cars:
I wonder how many of these garage check cylinder heads properly before condemning them to "skimming", probably making them less flat than they were!
After a failure my ZX TD head was properly measured (NOT by a garage) and found to be well within as-new flatness spec- at 148k miles! IMO the head gaskets fail, they have a life - maybe its a corrosion issue, but whatever the failure mechanism, I bet that 9 times out of 10 a new gasket, bolts etc would work.
Simon Canfer
After a failure my ZX TD head was properly measured (NOT by a garage) and found to be well within as-new flatness spec- at 148k miles! IMO the head gaskets fail, they have a life - maybe its a corrosion issue, but whatever the failure mechanism, I bet that 9 times out of 10 a new gasket, bolts etc would work.
Simon Canfer
Well these alloy heads are always the weakest link when they are on top of a cast iron block, and can warp!! Simon is quite correct in his post re head flatness, very often there is no need for skimming and you will get away with a decent h/gasket, and new bolts. Put it this way, I've never had to skim one.
The problem with the XUD9TE head is that it can crack internally, and there is nothing that can be done to repair this, indeed the crack is never visible to the eye. Despite flat tests, head gasket and bolts plus new rad and oil cooler I had a ZX TD that continually leaked coolant into the oil. In the end I bit the bullet and put a brand new head on it, plus of course gasket and bolts. That fixed that one.
If the thing has simply overheated, i'd try head gasket plus bolts first, plus of course check that some other section of the cooling system is not to blame so that it does not occur again.
The problem with the XUD9TE head is that it can crack internally, and there is nothing that can be done to repair this, indeed the crack is never visible to the eye. Despite flat tests, head gasket and bolts plus new rad and oil cooler I had a ZX TD that continually leaked coolant into the oil. In the end I bit the bullet and put a brand new head on it, plus of course gasket and bolts. That fixed that one.
If the thing has simply overheated, i'd try head gasket plus bolts first, plus of course check that some other section of the cooling system is not to blame so that it does not occur again.
that's the thing though, it hasn't overheated and caused this problem, it is overheating as a result of it, and on a 3 mile journey. As far as I'm aware the level was pretty low but there was still enough water in there.
Plus I didn't let the guage get to the top and carry on driving, I stopped straight away and didn't let it cook! Seemed like something just suddenly went one day. Bit of a mystery really, one I can't really afford to get into, yet I gave him the go-ahead to take the head off and have a better look next week.
The coolant is like a raging sea of bubbles!
Plus I didn't let the guage get to the top and carry on driving, I stopped straight away and didn't let it cook! Seemed like something just suddenly went one day. Bit of a mystery really, one I can't really afford to get into, yet I gave him the go-ahead to take the head off and have a better look next week.
The coolant is like a raging sea of bubbles!
-
- Posts: 1801
- Joined: 19 Dec 2002, 14:46
- Location: United Kingdom
- My Cars:
That the coolant is like a sea of bubbles means that combustion gases are (unfortunately ) getting into the coolant. These heads have been known to be porous and to crack for the fun of it. If the level went low, the gauge sender tells lies, The engine cooks anyway. You will have to get the top off. Have it pressure tested before you have it skimmed, to see if it is viable and if it is, then heed the advice abour new bolts before you refit the gasket. It is vitally important to clean out the tapped holes in the block thoroughly before fitting the new bolts.
Good luck!
Good luck!
-
- Posts: 1246
- Joined: 26 Oct 2003, 16:08
- Location: United Kingdom
- My Cars:
When they do crack its usually invisible to the eye, inside the pre combustion chamber or into a port, I usually get them skimmed, if they arent bad then the engineering works doesnt take much off, just about every head I have refitted has had coolant that looks like drinking chocolate in the engine and shows visual signs of the gasket having failed due to what looks like corrosion. replacing the gasket works for me nine times out of nine, perhaps i am lucky?
Stewart
Stewart
When my Diesel started taking on water, I stripped off the head and was charged £50 for a pressure test to confirm the head was cracked. In hindsight I should have just assumed it was and put the money to better use...but being a gambling man[:)]
Sorry to hear the bad news TomH...try a local scrappy for a newer head....you could have three reasonable secondhand heads for the cost of one new one!! If your specialist won't guarantee the work using secondhand parts...do it yourself. It's not entirely impossible and you've always got the forum to help. As for costings :
£80 - £100 S/H Head If its a good one no need for skimming!! Mine wasn't skimmed and my missus commutes 120 miles a day in it.
The rest all available from GSF at more than reasonable rates.
Oil change, coolant, all the gaskets, timing belt...do the water pump while you're there. £200 max. And a long weekend should cover it.
If the head comes off any other car ie. peugeot ..check all the little coolant pipes and connectors by comparing to the old...don't assume, check. I didn't....took me a while to put the small coolant bracket on..the one behind the diesel pump. The peugeot head didn't have it!![:I]
Sorry to hear the bad news TomH...try a local scrappy for a newer head....you could have three reasonable secondhand heads for the cost of one new one!! If your specialist won't guarantee the work using secondhand parts...do it yourself. It's not entirely impossible and you've always got the forum to help. As for costings :
£80 - £100 S/H Head If its a good one no need for skimming!! Mine wasn't skimmed and my missus commutes 120 miles a day in it.
The rest all available from GSF at more than reasonable rates.
Oil change, coolant, all the gaskets, timing belt...do the water pump while you're there. £200 max. And a long weekend should cover it.
If the head comes off any other car ie. peugeot ..check all the little coolant pipes and connectors by comparing to the old...don't assume, check. I didn't....took me a while to put the small coolant bracket on..the one behind the diesel pump. The peugeot head didn't have it!![:I]
Tom, the person who fitted the head gasket should have seen it was faulty, so make sure you ask for compensation for any-all expenses incurred because of their negligence. [:(!]
Re skimming the head.. Its essential that the company that do it know their business! Beware cowboys!! [:0]
When I was in engineering it was fairly common practice to "let the lad" do it, but-- (1) uless the machine bed is %100 clean before you start that can cause problems (2) when they lay the head on the bed it should be shimmed to keep it from distorting when they lock it down onto the machine bed, failure to do this can result in the head being cracked during skimming or reverting to its former distorsion state (or worse) on being taken off the bed again! [:(]
Re skimming the head.. Its essential that the company that do it know their business! Beware cowboys!! [:0]
When I was in engineering it was fairly common practice to "let the lad" do it, but-- (1) uless the machine bed is %100 clean before you start that can cause problems (2) when they lay the head on the bed it should be shimmed to keep it from distorting when they lock it down onto the machine bed, failure to do this can result in the head being cracked during skimming or reverting to its former distorsion state (or worse) on being taken off the bed again! [:(]