Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

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rmunns
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Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by rmunns »

A recap: Hydractive III+ failed MoT......'4 corner spheres need replacing'. This has led to an involved search for the truth. Various things: the car definitely 'wallows' and choosing 'sport' makes no difference. People have said that these spheres very rarely fail, yet I seem to have 4 fail between MoTs, only 12 000 miles driven in that period. Surely problem is something wrong that affects the whole system. Regulating valve? One or more of the central spheres? Pump pressure? Worn-out LDS fluid? Two garages - including main Citroen dealer - just went along with the MoT failure slip without doing any thorough tests.

Also does someone know whether or not the reservoir cap should allow air to enter or leave? After a run, if I take off the cap there is a rush of air coming out of the tank. Even if I wait an hour before taking off the cap, there is still pressure in there.

What would you recommend I get done? Obviously I don't want to have all 4 spheres replaced (£600 quoted) if that still doesn't solve it. I have 2 weeks to get this sorted out (French Mot failures 'critique' have to be sorted out within 2 months).

rmunns
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by rmunns »

Please?

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Sloppysod
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by Sloppysod »

Weired, X7 spheres are supposed to be more robust than any other sphere citroën have made.
How did the mot man test them? The bounce test?during my last mot after looking at the steering linkages and putting the wheels back on the ground the suspension took time to recover and did not lift for a few minutes. If fact the guy is so aware of the X7 suspension set up he thought revving the engine would make this happen quicker!
As for tank pressure, my X7 keeps the pressure for a long while so I don't think you have a problem there, to me, with knowing you mileage and vehicle condition, suggests it could possibly be education.
Good luck.

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xantia_v6
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by xantia_v6 »

I would recommend that you assume that the tester has through ignorance or error made a wrong diagnosis and there is nothing wrong with your car.

You then need to work out how to deal with that, which may be by getting the car tested at another CT station or by following whatever appeal mechanism operates in France.

I know of a similar case in the UK where the owner spent several hundred pounds with an independent specialist after a similar MOT failure before the original tester admitted that he had made up his own (inappropriate) test procedure.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Agreed - go somewhere else - obviously doesn't know the system as well as he thought. And if you do go somewhere else - don't make the mistake of telling them the reason why or what happened at the last place - go in from a 'normal' perspective and don't mention the previous hassle.

My X7 is approaching 10 years and the spheres are perfect.

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Sloppysod
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by Sloppysod »

GiveMeABreak wrote:
07 May 2019, 11:20
................................ don't make the mistake of telling them the reason why or what happened at the last place - go in from a 'normal' perspective and don't mention the previous hassle...................


Providing that the system is not the same as it is in the UK, where all records, accepts & rejects are accessible to all stations........ don't lie just don't mention it untill asked!!

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

But at least over here you can challenge them and get a second opinion - which they don't like - but is at least an option. I can't see what their problem is - if the suspension was rock hard and bouncing all over the shop, fair enough, but Roger's seems to be quite normal. The X7 setup is firmer and rarely bounces like the old Hydropneumatic system where you could bounce the corners really easily - it is not so easy on an X7. So what would they do if you brought a GSA in which bounced pretty easily - how could they fail that?

I think the tester has had a bit too much Château Fonbadet.

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petef
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by petef »

I would agree that the spheres rarely fail on an C5. I had the two front ones changed on my 2009 x7 when the ride seemed a bit hard. The main problem was the ride height was set too high after the steering rack had been replaced. Seems that x7's are sensitive to the ride height/suspension suppleness balance. The garage reported that the spheres were a 'bit weak', apparently about 25% down on pressure.
The only time the ride became definitely wallowy was when the LDS fluid level dropped right down as the rack leaked it out. I eventually realised there was something very wrong when I saw the puddles underneath, the 'boing' warning came up not to drive at more than 55mph because of a suspension fault and the pump was running just about permanently. I presume the LDS level has been checked?
Also worth running a Diagbox/Lexia check on the suspension if not already done. I could help with this if you can wait. We will be in the Dordogne for the summer season from late June and my Lexia always travels with me.
Peter

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xf1ref
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by xf1ref »

A friend which have a C5 III from 2009 has recently charged the spheres with nitrogen. Before charging, the front spheres were measured and the pressure was 30 and 35 bars, the nominal pressure when the spheres are new is 55 bars. The discharging rate of original spheres is almost 50% over a period of 10 years.

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GiveMeABreak
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Re: Still unsure about 2009 C5 excl. suspension problem - help, please?

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The Front corners are 50 Bar new and 45 for the DW12BTED4 Saloons and Tourers
The Rear corners are 40 for the Saloon and 50 for the Tourer
Front Stiffness Regulators are 70 for all models, but 75 for the DW12BTED4.
The Rear Stiffness Regulators are 44 each for the Saloon and 52 for the Tourer.

Each axle must have the same Spheres

Officially these cannot be recharged with Nitrogen unlike the older ones, but I suppose there will always be those that will do their own thing.