C4 Dash warning lights- none

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31mev
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C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Hi, New member first posting. Short story to give some context to problem

Just before Christmas my Daughter had a problem with her 2007 C4 1.6 HDI cutting out and not restarting. No big problem, stick it into her usual Citroen indy to fix. Long story short, the car was stuck there over Christmas and just afterwards they contacted her with a four figure+ bill and said they could not fix it. Dad to the rescue. I have never had a common rail diesel. Have deliberately avoided them. So got a lexia and got Son in Law to put it on an old laptop. Plugged it in and started floundering about. I fairly quickly noticed that the rail pressure was 298 bar without the engine running. Strange! Ordered a brand new secondhand rail pressure sensor off of ebay, fixed.
BUT, and here we get to the meat of my question. Since arriving from the garage, all of the warning lights on the centre pod are absent. I turn on the ignition and the speedo and temp and fuel appear in the led centre part of the pod but the two end sections where all the warning lights are is blank. I have pulled the pod from the dash and the plug is secure. For all the light to vanish at once suggests to me some cenral point has gone down. A powered module has lost power? All plugs are as they should be in both fuse board and bsi all fuses are good but a couple are unpowered with ingnition on.
I have ordered another pod £15 for an easy fix, but my gut says this is is not it. I suspect bsi, but have a chronic knowledge deficit in this area. My learning curve has got so steep I am loosing grip. Please enlighten (sorry) me
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The first thing you need to do is use your Lexia to run a Global Test. Record all the fault codes and list them back here. Then read and clear the faults, and run another Global Test. Then let us know which ones are remaining.

This will let us know what has been the issue historically, and what it is still not happy about.

Before swapping parts you really need to do this because of the complexity of modern multiplexed vehicles. An issue in one ECU may not be the cause of the underlying problem, but as a result of other components.

Common failures can be bad connections, cracked wiring inside the harnesses, a faulty engine fuse box, but without a proper diagnostic you are stabbing in the dark.

That's the trouble with some independent garages - whether they have the competence and specific training to work on certain vehicles and whether they keep their training current on the latest vehicles, technological advances and whether they have access to the latest technical bulletins.

Booking a vehicle in for pads and brakes is one thing, but electronic diagnostics and fault finding on a modern vehicle without understanding the underlying issues that may, or may not be presenting is another thing. It's why the dealers charge more as they have to pay for keeping their technicians training current.

Post up your faults with your VIN and we'll see what's showing.
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Hi Marc

I did a rather long winded reply which I sent and has disappeared into the ether. Probably for the best as i had started to ramble


Vin VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]

Since getting vehicle restarted with the new pressure sensor, there are no faults showing in BSI or ECU. I do occasionally get a code for glowplugs or heater which I assume to be glowplugs. I will try and find the code it is not there at present. There is also a power steering code. When I do a global test it shows "no communication" with the instrument ecu. The original fault code when the vehicle was dead was Depollution coupled and P1586

I am yet to road test the car after getting it running. I am waiting for an egr clamp. I ran it briefly on the road today to ensure the speedo was working, it was. However when I returned depollution briefly flashed on the central dash display this was then replaced with a symbol that looked like a lolipop or road sign followed by two dashes a car symbol and some more dashes. beneath was 9999KM. strange.

Apologies if this is rather disjointed. I am an old mechanical diesel guy, pressed into service and trying to learn fast. I appreciate your assistance.
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Ok, I've got the VIN, so you have the 1.6 HDi 92 DV6ATED4 engine.

Now I know that Citroen DO NOT sell the fuel rail sensors separately, as you can see on the diagram. In fact, I do know several members that have bought the sensor aftermarket and had problems - only resolved when they replaced the rail itself - that comes with the sensor incorporated. The official technical information actually states NOT to separate the sensor.

So I'm not sure if this is what is giving you other fuelling problems as a depollution fault can be emissions related - but can also be air and fuel related. You don't have a particle filter so can ignore that, but EGR is another possibility if the vacuum solenoid is playing up.
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C4 Fuel Rail.PNG
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Hi Marc

I am sorry, I feel I may have misled you. It was not my intention. I mentioned all the running probs to give some context to my overall story. You then asked for more info re codes. i am hoping the running issues are fairly well sorted. If not they will be revealed when I start to road test.

My concern per my original entry is about the missing dash lights. The car is a dead man walking to coin a phrase if I cannot get the dash lights back. The car is usable without them but the MOT tester will not be amused.

I appreciate what you say about the rail. The sensor is obtained is a genuine part, tested and guaranteed. I was gambling on it at the time. PSA would never sell it separately given the pressures involved.

So, do you have any ideas why all the dash lights (warning lights) should fail at once. I have found the actuators for them in the BSI section on digibox. run the tests, but do not really understand what I am testing. They all test fine. Given the proximity of the BSI to the dash there appears to be no other modules to consider. At the moment my hopes are pinned on a new dash unit but it is a bit too coincidental that it failed at the same time as the car had running problems.

Thanks Andy
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

This is the instrument display - where is the 'lollipop'?
C4 Intrument A.PNG
ReferenceKey
bFuel level indicator
cTrip odometer
dSpeedometer
eMaintenance indicator
fCoolant temperature indicator
gOil level gauge
hCruise control and speed limiter functions
iFuel range indicator

The instrument panel is equipped with an autodiagnostic function which is active from the time the ignition is switched on. The autodiagnostic function consists of the warning lamp test and of the checking of information which is not available.

The warning lamps and indicators checked are the following:
  • EOBD
  • Airbags fault
  • Passenger’s airbag deactivation
  • ABS fault
  • ESP fault
  • Brake fault
  • Low fuel level
  • Service
  • Stop warning lamp
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Hi Marc

Forget the lollipop. I think I have solved that. I think its the mpg indicator on the other (multiplex screen the one that shows the radio) The car has been idling a lot and yesterday was the first time it moved. I think it has sent the mpg indicator into a bit of a spasm. This car has so many screens I do not know the correct name for each.
Right. The screen you are showing all appears to work. The speedo tested yesterday, fuel level and temp ok so I am assuming this screen all good. What is definitively not working are the two small screens either side of the display you have shown above. Both are totally blank/black at all times. From memory should have oil press, handbrake, check engine etc to the left and open door and seatbelt to the right.
Thanks again

Andy
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

These don’t light up constantly, only at ignition start for systems check or when there is a fault.
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Mine are dead, all the time totally. The fact that it is all of them makes me think a complete module has failed, or a plug is disconnected. But that is just a guess. They seem to be controlled by the BSI. What is involved in changing it other than swapping it over physically?

Thanks Andy
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The BSI can't be replaced with a second hand one without also replacing the engine ECU and the transponders in the keys from the same donor and they must be compatible with the vehicle. They are a matched set.

The dashboard has an ECU - and that has fault codes. Are you absolutely sure that your Lexia is communicating with the ECU? It should say if it cannot. or should list a fault next to the BSI or other ECU after the Global Test.
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

Marc you are a very patient man Thank you

Thanks for the bsi info

There was mention of No communication with one of the panels but I assumed that as the centre panel was working it was OK. I will check again. What are the most likely causes of lack of comms.

On a side note I am using diagbox not lexia. lexia would not play ball.

Andy
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

The significance of your last post has just sunk in. This is not a case of dash working or not working. this is a case of the ecu in the dash working some bits and not others. I will be back with more info

Thanks
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

The dashboard has one ECU. Diagbox is fine - it contains Lexia which is automatically launched depending on age of vehicle circa 2007 and earlier. The version of Diagbos you are using might be helpful as it will tell me what firmware the VCI is using. If it is too late a version, it can affect the ability of the VCI to communicate with some ECUs. Downgrading the software will downgrade the firmware to a more appropriate version for the year. Let me know.
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by 31mev »

I will get you the info you require in the morning. The car is 2007
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Re: C4 Dash warning lights- none

Post by GiveMeABreak »

Yes, I have all that from your VIN :wink:

Once I have the codes, hopefully we’ll have some further pointers.
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