Rant about the youths of today!!!

This is the place for posts that don't fit into any other category.

Moderator: RichardW

Hell Razor5543
Donor 2021
Posts: 12488
Joined: 01 Apr 2012, 09:47
x 1674

Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

This is (as per the title) a rant about youth of today. My reasons will follow. Moderators, if you feel that this needs to be deleted or locked I will NOT be offended.

I have a godson in his mid teens. He has been unable to go out unaccompanied for several months now. This is not because he is a nuisance but because creditable threats have been made on his life. He has not been able to attend school for a while (at first the school was paying for private transport, but this has now been withdrawn, and the family would have to pay £100 per week for this. The family cannot reliably take him to and from school, as his mother cannot drive and his father, being a field service engineer, cannot be certain of when he is available).

The reason the threats have been made is this. There is a large gang of teenagers (10 - 20) in the area who have been causing problems. Apparently there have been over 30 assaults on other teenagers in the area since Christmas. In the relevant assault my godson saw a friend being badly beaten up (I believe he was hospitalised), and my godson was able to identify the perpetrators. Since then his life has been in danger (countless threats of beatings, stabbings, and murder have been made against him). Before anybody says he will be ok, and they are blowing hot air, the 16 year old ringleader is currently in custody for allegedly raping a 14 year old at knifepoint.

I have a couple of personal beliefs that are not necessarily that of this forum.

The first belief is that the NSPCC is, in part, responsible for the state of the youth today. Do not get me wrong; the NSPCC do a lot of good towards protection children. However, I feel that they have overstepped their remit where discipline is concerned. They feel that physical punishment causes harm to children today, and has managed to get smacking a child made an offence (as well as getting our culture to feel the same). As a result it is no longer possible to use physical discipline on the youth of today. When I was a child, if I did something seriously wrong, a responsible adult was allowed to administer physical punishment if they felt it was necessary. I did not, do not, and will not consider I was abused; I was given clear indication that what I had done was wrong. Today smacking is no longer permitted, and society is suffering for it.

If you look at all creatures that nurture their young they have been using the carrot and stick method for countless millennia. Watch (for example) a lioness with her cubs, and if one misbehaves it gets clouted, and if the cub does something nice it gets a fuss made of it. This method works better than anything mankind has come up with.

My second belief is that children are born as animals BUT with the potential to become human. So long as they learn the concepts of right and wrong (as society defines them) they will join the human race, but if they cannot do so they remain animals, and are to be pitied (and, in some instances such as this one, to be feared).
Last edited by Hell Razor5543 on 08 Nov 2017, 16:35, edited 3 times in total.
User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 43890
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
x 1789

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by CitroJim »

James, I'm so sorry to hear about your godson :( That is tragic and awful beyond words :evil:

As parents we'll all agree with your final two paragraphs and it's our duty as parents to bring our offspring up properly...
MikeT
Posts: 4809
Joined: 11 Jun 2007, 16:17
x 188

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by MikeT »

Sorry to read this about your godson, James. I hope he comes to no physical harm at least, though he's obviously already suffering in other ways just for being a witness.
User avatar
Michel
(Donor 2020)
Posts: 1872
Joined: 29 May 2017, 13:50
x 403

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Michel »

CitroJim wrote:
08 Nov 2017, 13:20
As parents we'll all agree with your final two paragraphs and it's our duty as parents to bring our offspring up properly...


I won't I'm afraid. All smacking children does is teach them that smacking and violence is ok. Next time those who think I'm wrong do something bad, I'll come up and give them a slap. I presume you'll not be reporting me for assault, which it is...

I'll guarantee every single one of those vile youths have been smacked and yelled at, which is why they behave the way they do. It becomes the norm. It's also not helped by the levels of hatred, sexism and xenophobia fuelled by various events (Brexit, Trump)

Is there anything more confusing to a child than a parent yelling "don't shout at me?" at it?

Any adult who can't outwit a child and explain why something is wrong to them without resorting to physical violence really should be ashamed of themselves.

Who taught you it's ok to smack? Your parents... how?... by smacking you. That doesn't mean it's acceptable.
User avatar
CitroJim
A very naughty boy
Posts: 43890
Joined: 30 Apr 2005, 23:33
x 1789

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by CitroJim »

Who said anything about smacking Mike? But yes, I fully and totally agree with you on that score. Good discipline and teaching can be instilled without resort to any kind of violence, including verbal.

James, in his second to last paragraph, was using a metaphor I feel as a metaphorical clout can be very effective.

I never smacked or used any sort of physical contact discipline on my kids at all... My parents never did with me. We all grew up to know right from wrong and how to behave properly. Metaphorical clouts were used sparingly and only when absolutely necessary.

Sadly, I cannot say the same about a number of my teachers... Some, looking back, were border-line psychopaths and one certainly was... Some positively delighted in dishing out physical discipline :evil:
User avatar
Michel
(Donor 2020)
Posts: 1872
Joined: 29 May 2017, 13:50
x 403

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Michel »

CitroJim wrote:
08 Nov 2017, 15:19
Who said anything about smacking Mike? But yes, I fully and totally agree with you on that score. Good discipline and teaching can be instilled without resort to any kind of violence, including verbal.


It was more a metaphorical "you" directed at all those people who agree that the country is going downhill because we don't smack kids Jim, not at you, mainly in response to this...

"When I was a child, if I did something seriously wrong, a responsible adult was allowed to administer physical punishment if they felt it was necessary. I did not, do not, and will not consider I was abused; I was given clear indication that what I had done was wrong. *Today smacking is no longer permitted, and society is suffering for it*.
Hell Razor5543
Donor 2021
Posts: 12488
Joined: 01 Apr 2012, 09:47
x 1674

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

I will accept that there are children who can be taught the difference between right and wrong without having to administer physical punishment. I have met children like this (although I wish there were a LOT more!). Unfortunately this is not always the case. I wish it was not necessary to administer physical punishment, and I definitely agree that parents (and I am not one) have a duty of care to teach their young what is right and wrong as society understands it.

I have just been shopping in a supermarket. At the checkouts there was a small child screaming her head off as she wanted a sweetie, and her parents would not give her a sweetie. Her parents seemed to think it was funny. I can assure you that everybody else at the checkouts was finding this sproghorn extremely wearing (judging by the looks that were being cast in their general direction). I wonder how this child will turn out when they become a teenager, and if her parents are going to find it as funny as they did an hour or so ago.

EDIT; I accept that reporting technology has revealed much more in the news, and there appears to be more reports of crime perpetrated by teenagers than 20 years ago (as more people actually report incidents). However, I believe that this is also down to the fact that some (NOT all, but some) children will not accept the lesser forms of discipline that schools are allowed to administer (they will not do the 'punishment' activities they are told to do, and treat suspension or expulsion as a holiday), and if there is any threat of physical punishment (such as a rap across the knuckles or, in extreme cases, a caning) it will have the child screaming of abuse.

I also accept that there have been 'teachers' who delighted in administering physical punishment. People like this should never be allowed contact with children (and should be dealt with by the law). I have never encountered such a person when I was at school. I had, on a couple of occasion, earned a rap across the knuckles, and I fully accept that what I did was wrong, I deserved the punishment, and (I hope) I have learnt my lesson, moved on, and become (by my definition) an acceptable member of the Human race.

I believe that somebody once said something like "Violence is the first resort of fools, and the last resort of intelligent people". I would not (if I were looking after a child) initially smack a child if they misbehaved, but I would explain why I felt they had done wrong. I have (when baby sitting) only once ever had cause to smack a child (if it is necessary to explain why I will do so), but their parents not only understood why I had to do so, they backed me up (and continued to ask me to baby sit). Now these children knew what limits I was allowed to set, they never tried stepping over them again (if I said "Isn't it getting close to your bedtimes" they would look at the clock. If it was nowhere near, they knew I had warned them, and would back off). On one occasion when I had a bad headache (but I had promised) I explained to the children that I was not feeling well, so please be good. They were absolutely wonderful (even asking me every so often if I wanted a cup of tea). Next time I baby sat for them I took round my games console for them to play on. They thought that was brilliant (and they had deserved this reward for being so good).

My Great Aunt (may she rest in peace) had a piece of calligraphy in her living room. It read "Nowhere in the history of Man has a Child be brought up right". Our family interpretation of this is that, no matter what you do to bring up your children in the best way you can, somebody will always say that you had done something wrong. Parenthood does not come with an instruction manual but with a lot of critics.
User avatar
Michel
(Donor 2020)
Posts: 1872
Joined: 29 May 2017, 13:50
x 403

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Michel »

Hell Razor5543 wrote:
08 Nov 2017, 15:31
I have just been shopping in a supermarket. At the checkouts there was a small child screaming her head off as she wanted a sweetie, and her parents would not give her a sweetie. Her parents seemed to think it was funny. I can assure you that everybody else at the checkouts was finding this sproghorn extremely wearing (judging by the looks that were being cast in their general direction). I wonder how this child will turn out when they become a teenager, and if her parents are going to find it as funny as they did an hour or so ago.


These parents are behaving in exactly the right way. The child will soon learn that behaving like this gets no positive reaction or attention if it's laughed at and ignored. If the child is fussed over or shouted at, it's got exactly what it wants, which is a reaction.

Those who look on disapprovingly can GFT. Many of them have conveniently forgot they were a) once children and b) If they are a parent , they've likely been in the same situation. It's called hypocrisy.
Hell Razor5543
Donor 2021
Posts: 12488
Joined: 01 Apr 2012, 09:47
x 1674

Re: Rant about the youths of today!!!

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

It appears that one of the girls in the gang that has been threatening my godson has caused a bit of mayhem in Reading today;

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-41934297

There has been footage seen on social media, and he recognised the attacker from the initial incident.