1.4hdi running on 3

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xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
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Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
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Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Hello to all.

Our trusty 1.4hdi xsara has developed a fault.

We drove it to work at 3h30 on Friday, stopped it for about 5 minutes and when we restarted it had no power and felt like it was running on 3 cylinders.

Brought it home on the trailer and removed the air-filter box - started the car and one by one removed the electrical injector connections.

Working from the gearbox end , when we removed no3 connection it made absolutely no difference.

We swapped out the injector (terrible job on this engine as you have to remove the rocker cover and half the timing cover to get at the injectors).

We put number 2 injector into no 3 cylinder and a replacement injector into no 2 - that way we could figure if it was mechanical or electrical - or so we thought.

All back together and started it up - still running on 3 and now showing anti-pollution fault.

Still when you remove the connection to no3 the engine note does not change - all the others cause a stall or a difference.

What sort of resistance should we get across the injection connector ?

Help
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Peter.N.
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Location: Charmouth,Dorset
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C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
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In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Peter.N. »

I would suspect that you have a wiring fault in the loom that feeds No 3 injector. Compare the resistance with the other three, or if you cant measure the resistance measure the voltage.

Peter
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Hi Peter and thank you for the reply.

Just checked resistance on connections back to ECU plug - same for all 4 injectors on both the pink and black wires.

Suppose a compression test is next..............
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Peter.N. »

It would need to have a mighty loss of compression to stop it firing, probably a major failure of some sort. I will be interested in the outcome. You don't have a valve stuck open?

I would try checking the running voltage as well - with the injector connected, in case you have an ECU fault.

Peter
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Hello again , if a valve was stuck surely the piston would clack it ?

Any , academic for the moment as we unscrewed the glow-plug on number 3 and out it came, leaving the tip still in the head :( :oops: :oops:
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Peter.N. »

Of course it would :oops: brain only firing on 3 cylinders. Glow plugs are best left alone on modern diesels, most will start fine without them - unless you live in Siberia!. Can't help you with that, never had it happen, I'm sure someone will though.

Peter
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Its a put it in the shed and visit it later. Some time when we have time - which is never.

Then its head off , get glow-plug tip out, re-assemble and then find it still runs on 3.
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Peter.N. »

Did you actually check the voltage on each injector when it was running - anyway, for another time.

Peter
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Apologies to Peter - problem discovered.

Our lovely little 16v engine (1.4hdi) has dropped a valve and we can see the rocker tossed aside.

Why the hell did it do that ?????
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Hell Razor5543
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Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Hell Razor5543 »

Because it is French!
James
ex BX 1.9
ex Xantia 2.0HDi SX
ex Xantia 2.0HDi LX
Ex C5 2.0HDi VTR
Ex C5 2.0HDi VTR

C5 2.2HDi VTX+
Yes, I am paranoid, but am I paranoid ENOUGH?
Out amongst the stars, looking for a world of my own!
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

On closer inspection it might be that it has not dropped a valve, but the rocker has fallen away. Therefore both valves remain closed. Not sure as we have not stripped it down yet.

This makes more sense , as it just runs on 3 cylinders and does not clatter atall
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
Peter.N.
Moderating Team
Posts: 11563
Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
Location: Charmouth,Dorset
My Cars: Currently:

C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red

In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars.
x 1199

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by Peter.N. »

That sounds more like it.

Peter
doctle
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x 235

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by doctle »

Just curious, I have a misfire at idle on my 1.4 HDi I was told to never remove the connections on the injectors as this could cause major damage. I did 2 leakoff tests all are within a few ml of each other. Car drives well no increase in fuel consumption but that miss is very annoying. What injectors are in your car? Mine are Bosch I'm tempted to disconnect each injector in turn to see if I find the problem
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/aic3jc85sui4 ... fsi3a?dl=0
Oh buggle
xsaras4ever
(Donor 2016)
Posts: 391
Joined: 07 Aug 2013, 13:43
Location: Bretagne,France
My Cars: Peugeot 205 TD
Citroen Jumper 2.5D
Peugeot 406 Estate 2.0 Hdi
Citroen Saxo Ph2 1.1
Audi A3 1.9D
Pembleton 3 Wheeler
1959 Kelsey GT
1957 Fordson Power Major Tractor
1964 Nuffield 4/60 Tractor
1967 Nuffield 10/60 Tractor
1963 Allis Chalmers ED40 Tractor
1984 JCB 3CX
x 39

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by xsaras4ever »

Hello , our injectors are BOSCH
Jumper 2.5d
406 Phase 2 Estate, Hdi
Fiat 500 (2009)
1997 Audi A3 tdi
Peugeot 205 td
Fordson Major Tractor
Nuffield 460 tractor
JCB 3cx
doctle
Posts: 947
Joined: 16 Oct 2014, 12:17
Location: Meath Ireland
My Cars: 2008 Laguna 1.5 DCi
x 235

Re: 1.4hdi running on 3

Post by doctle »

Thank you! The injectors are a pig on the 307 last time I changed a seal I cracked the windscreen it was designed by a man that never worked on a car I think
Oh buggle
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