Xantia heater blower saga - more help please !!

Nigel Darwell · Post by **Nigel Darwell** » 27 Jan 2004, 23:00

Have decided my 99 xantia must have a relay between the heater fan and the ignition switch, but where, even the Dealer is unsure !!!
symptoms: Poor feed at motor (4v)
No temp control via the climate control
No heated rear screen
Changed ignition switch - no difference.
Help

davey · Post by **davey** » 28 Jan 2004, 01:52

Ref your blower motor; is a simple 2 power wire feed or does it have 2 pwr wires + about 3 thinner wires suppling the blower assy?
Some blower motor assys on aircon later models have an electronic motor controller built into the blower housing rather than a external 'resistor' pack - let me know and i can advise further if its electronic ctrl.

AndersDK · Post by **AndersDK** » 28 Jan 2004, 03:18

<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Nigel Darwell
...
symptoms: Poor feed at motor (4v)
No temp control via the climate control
No heated rear screen
...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">
Nigel - this is a clear indication of an ignition switch failure.
- but since the ignition switch was replaced - then the problem must be ahead to the ignition switch in the feed circuit.
Only alternative is an overload of the circuit - pulling down the voltage - but that should blow the fuse - if it's correct rate.
I'd suspect the +12V feed distributor boxes for a dodgy connection or cable.

Nigel Darwell · Post by **Nigel Darwell** » 28 Jan 2004, 15:33

Davey
Yes its the type with two main power feeds, an onboard motor controller, and three (?) thin wires from the climate control control.
I agree it sound like the classic ignition switch burn out, but not in this case, other posts report post 98 models have a relay to protect the switch, and indeed on the dealers computer a 45a relay is shown, but they don't know where it might be. My Xantia seems to have relays both below the internal fusebox, and near the underbonnet fuses.
Also since the inital fault which effected only the blower, an intermitant fault with the heated rear screen has become a permanent failure and also the temp control is permanently cold, presumably all fed from the same source.
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by Nigel Darwell

Have decided my 99 xantia must have a relay between the heater fan and the ignition switch, but where, even the Dealer is unsure !!!
symptoms: Poor feed at motor (4v)
No temp control via the climate control
No heated rear screen
Changed ignition switch - no difference.
Help
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

davey · Post by **davey** » 29 Jan 2004, 02:34

Nigel .... where to start!
dont overlook the obvious - fuses, wiring connections etc. as Mr anders points out....it save you a lot of heartache.
I believe the blower system and heated rearwindow/mirrors are on different fuses so it is unlikely the problem is common (however.. prior to fuse box there is commonality)
Heated window cct also supplies heated mirrors, do they work? if so you've got 12v being supplied to heated window cct (check foil and foil conns). Measure volts(V) at wiring conns on rear window also measure each conn with respect to chassis (wrtc) - you may have bad ground in tailgate. if no v there move back to relay and finally back to stalk switch taking v meas, the haynes manual will save you a lot of time tying to ident the appropriate wires!.
Assuming!!! you are sure u are getting pwr to the system...
Blower system; i take it you have climate ctrl with an 'auto' posn on temp slider? if you take it off auto do you still get heat coming into the car (you should get some heat without blower on)?
Blower housing has 2 pwr wires (+ & gnd) and 3 thin ctrl wires from fasia panel (these ctrl motor speed) there may also be seperate red & black wires coming out from the housing to connect back to the motor conns on the housing - is it these u are meas the 4v? Disconn main 5 pin conn and meas v on 2 pwr wires, is this 12v?
Let me know - there are many possibilities...
Dave

Nigel Darwell · Post by **Nigel Darwell** » 29 Jan 2004, 17:49

Davey
The low voltage reading was at main blower feed wires not the control wires from the climate control.
I understand from a helpful cit dealer there is an engine on relay which is between the ignition switch and the fusebox, only allowing the blower to come on when the engine is running, its the lower right hand one under the fuse box behind the carpet. I'm going to check this asap.
For info the blower was the first to stop, although temp control on the climate worked ok, when the HRS stopped working so did the temp control, assuming the engine on relay provides power to these also ??
I'll let you know what I find
<blockquote id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by davey

Nigel .... where to start!
dont overlook the obvious - fuses, wiring connections etc. as Mr anders points out....it save you a lot of heartache.
I believe the blower system and heated rearwindow/mirrors are on different fuses so it is unlikely the problem is common (however.. prior to fuse box there is commonality)
Heated window cct also supplies heated mirrors, do they work? if so you've got 12v being supplied to heated window cct (check foil and foil conns). Measure volts(V) at wiring conns on rear window also measure each conn with respect to chassis (wrtc) - you may have bad ground in tailgate. if no v there move back to relay and finally back to stalk switch taking v meas, the haynes manual will save you a lot of time tying to ident the appropriate wires!.
Assuming!!! you are sure u are getting pwr to the system...
Blower system; i take it you have climate ctrl with an 'auto' posn on temp slider? if you take it off auto do you still get heat coming into the car (you should get some heat without blower on)?
Blower housing has 2 pwr wires (+ & gnd) and 3 thin ctrl wires from fasia panel (these ctrl motor speed) there may also be seperate red & black wires coming out from the housing to connect back to the motor conns on the housing - is it these u are meas the 4v? Disconn main 5 pin conn and meas v on 2 pwr wires, is this 12v?
Let me know - there are many possibilities...
Dave
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alexx · Post by **alexx** » 29 Jan 2004, 18:56

Nigel, why don't you try to measure the resistance between the ignition switch (or corresponding fuse) and blower main feed, with the ignition off? This will probably reveal if there's a relay in between (infinite reading).
According to Haynes, there is a blower motor relay on Xantia MkII, but that schema is obviously for the car without A/C. This circuit seems to be much more complex with A/C. Anyway, on that schema, relay trigger is connected to fuse 5 (it's between ignition switch and relay), while relay main feed is connected to fuse 21.

davey · Post by **davey** » 29 Jan 2004, 22:39

Another thought nigel,
with blower and hrs on but connectors removed from housing and hrs - meas v at both blower and hrs - if its the same then fault likely to be pre fuse box.
Wouldnt life be too easy without these problems!!
enjoy your weekend!

davey · Post by **davey** » 29 Jan 2004, 22:53

Nigel,
double check this... it looks like fuse #5 (only live with engine running)on you fuse box supplies the blower pwr relay it also supplies the low pwr feed for the timer side of the hrs cct.
Ultimately if f5 blown or problems in that area then it will directly affect hrs and blower...

PeterMann · Post by **PeterMann** » 30 Jan 2004, 18:06

My heater blower has worked faultlessly ever since I cleaned the earthing points under and behind the battery. With relay fitted to the blower fan, I consider the ignition switch to be a most unlikely candidate . . . if it were to fail, it would take ignition, radio, all sorts of stuff down instead of only the heater fan.
Recently had to replace the battery in my 1994 Xantia. And while we were swapping old for new, I noticed several earthing points under the battery. So after returning home, I pulled out the battery to clean the newly-discovered suspects in the quest for reliable heater/aircon operation. There are 3 earth points concealed under the battery (the worst possible place in terms of corrosion), and removing the battery allows access to a further 7 earth points immediately behind the battery.
Loosened each of these, inserted some gearbox oil onto the bolt thread and the electrical termination, and tightened up. Heater blower has worked reliably since then.
In retrospect, cleaning these earthing points would be my first move in trying to sort out any electrical malfunction on the Xantia.

Nigel Darwell · Post by **Nigel Darwell** » 30 Jan 2004, 19:35

Thanks for that I did see your original post on this, and did indeed check the earth points, on the 99 xantia these are by the side of the battery, don't seem to be any underneath the battery, although I did remove it to check.