Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

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2cy
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Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by 2cy »

The subject heading says it all " Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ? "

With tyres ; it's said that old tyres 'properly stored' are fine (properly meaning cool dry and in the dark and wrapped in waxed paper !) ...but what about camshaft drive belts ???

I ask because I've just bought a 1974 Ami super, with the 1015cc OHC GS motor. The car's has low mileage on the clock - just 30,500 miles (...but of course I don't know whether that is correct). It's been sitting in the back of a dry windowless garage for some 16 or 17 years and although the rubber of the window seals and driveshaft gaiters feel surprising supple, I am concerned about those cam-belts.

Bearing in mind the consequences should either fail.., it seems prudent to replace these immediately - not least because the existing - may possibly be the 40-year-old originals.!? So my question is regarding replacement rubber parts for an engine that's not been made in decades.?

For example : QH were decent quality, but if I don't even know if that company still exists. If not, and I were to buy NOS then is that any better than the rubber already on the car, hidden in the back of a cool, dark, and dry garage.?

I am reluctant buy parts off a company I've never heard of, with the strong possibility that those parts are of Chinese quality.?

Did manufacturers like QH date stamp their merchandise, way back when back in the 1970's ?

Is there a better brand that I should use for these critical components ?

I'd appreciate your thoughts.
Thanks, Peter
Introductions : 'hello From Suffolk'
Last edited by 2cy on 10 Dec 2015, 22:05, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by myglaren »

Quinton Hazell are certainly still trading.
I certainly wouldn't be tempted to use the existing belts, despite the storage conditions.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by myglaren »

Correction to the above - it seems they went into administration in 2013 :(

Gates belts seem to be quite reliable if they have suitable ones for your Ami.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by hattershaun »

Rob Moss at Chevronics in Hitchin, Hertfordhsire stocks GS parts and is a GS specialist.
Www.chevronics.co.uk
I buy my parts from him.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by dnsey »

General consensus is that tyres over six years old should be used with caution, if at all. This is particularly so if they are unused, as regular use distributes the 'preservatives'.
Whether the same principle applies to belts, I don't know.
Try ringing Gates' enquiry number - I had reason to do so a few years ago and spoke to helpful technical rep.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by chinkostu »

dnsey wrote:General consensus is that tyres over six years old should be used with caution, if at all. This is particularly so if they are unused, as regular use distributes the 'preservatives'.
Whether the same principle applies to belts, I don't know.
Try ringing Gates' enquiry number - I had reason to do so a few years ago and spoke to helpful technical rep.
Running a 1994 tyre (the original spare) on mine briefly. Have done a few long trips and seems fine but I wouldn't depend on it. Then again theres no tread seperation or perishing unlike the tyres the car came with, so maybe its been stored well.


When it comes to belts, who knows how long a shop keeps them on a shelf for before they sell??
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by sandybx »

Dear Peter,
Another vote for Rob Moss :) :wink:
I wouldn,t risk running the engine at all Peter :!:
I would recommend renewing the cambelt tensioners when you are renewng both of the cambelts Peter :) :wink:
You have to mark the timing marks on the old cambelts on the crank sprocket and both cam timing marks ( tipex will do ) prior to removing the old belts Peter, and you have to very carefully count the teeth from the crank sprocket all the way to both timing marks on both cam sprockets and write down the number of teeth counted. Then you have to transfer you pant marks from your old cambelt over onto your new cambelt :) :wink:
To remove the cooling fan you need a 42 mm socket :idea:
I hope this helps Peter :) :) :) :wink:
Vince, :wink:
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by sandybx »

Dear Peter :-D
My bedtime now,
Any questions just ask away Peter :) :) I will be back tomorrow evening so don,t panic :lol: I have done loads of cambelts on GS and GSA,s .
speak to you tomorrow :wink:
Vince,
1992 Citroen BX TX i 1.6 auto with air con in White with 47,000 miles.
1988 SAAB classic 900 i with 3 spoke Ronals in rose quartz with 69,000 miles.
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by 2cy »

Thanks each,

I am rather anxious not to pick up the car and drive across Europe (from Slovenia back to the UK) on anything that's likely to go flabber, flabber, flabber.! neither tyres, nor belts, nor lunch 8-[ .

I believe the spare tyre on my car is the original (1974) but I have no information re. other parts. The car has been started recently (after 16+years sleep), but I don't wish to drive it until I'm confident that the cam-belts have been replaced with the best available. The risk of expensive damage is far too great to be frugal with these.

"who knows how long a shop keeps them on a shelf for before they sell??" - Are these belts date-stamped like tyres ?

42mm socket - for the 1015cc also ?? With no starter crank on the Ami-Super, might I ask - does it need to be a long box type ?

Why the cam-belt tensioners as well ? Surely these are just ball or roller bearings mechanically pre-tensioned by a spring ?

Thanks.. I really do appreciate the advice received.. Peter
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by dnsey »

Most timing belts these days have replacement intervals of so many miles or so many years, whichever comes first (for my C5, it's 10 years). I'd suggest that there's a reason for this!
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by 2cy »

"belts these days have replacement intervals of so many miles or so many years" - valid point :wink:
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by 2cy »

For the G10/612 1015cc motor, I'll soon need to buy :

a complete set of engine & gearbox seals + o-rings + fibre washers
cam belts (..and tensioners ?)
alternator belt
oil & air filters
petrol filter(s) + rubber fuel pipe
all grommets, boots, & edge seals within the engine bay, including those in the engine's ducting
set of new tyres
fuel filler hose (to the fuel tank)
fuel pump service kit
a complete engine & gearbox gasket set
solex 28 CIC2 service kit
brake pads + shoes + service kits for each cylinder + fluid
rubber brake pipes
wiper blades
suspension can gaiters + stop rubbers
and possibly a set of dampers
drive shaft gaiters + grease
battery
points + condensor + ht leads + plugs
most likely special tools
...and a host of other bits.

And so my question is, for an order of considerable value - do I shop in this country or abroad ? ..bearing in mind it's got to end up in Slovenia where the car is.., either by direct postage or postage to Suffolk and my driving it down ?

Experience shared, either here or by PM, would be greatly appreciated.
Peter
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Re: Is NOS (new old stock) rubber any good ?

Post by HDI »

It depends on the rubber compound in question, and the use it's been subjected to. Neoprene, EPDM, Viton, and some other less well known compounds, have a long life. However, if subjected to hight temperature and oil their life is significantly reduced. Also, if left standing, after exposure to high temperature parts take a set. If then disturbed and subjected to stress failure is likely. So a cam belt is a prime candidate to let go! Rad hoses, if made from the compound they should be, have a surprisingly long life. O rings take a set in normal service so will leak when put back into service. V belts vary tremendously in quality and are prone to heat set so it's difficult to know when they fail. Tyres are exposed to many environmental factors and the compounds used are not intended to last many years, just to provide an acceptable wear life. New tyres stored in cool dark conditions and covered up are ok for upto 10-12 years. On a vehicle, service is not advisable after 4-5 years, less if the climate is adverse.
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