Running rough after cambelt change
Moderator: RichardW
Running rough after cambelt change
Just did a cambelt aux belt change the lot, on C5. Water pump tensioners crank damper etc.
She fired up no problem but sounds rough with knock on bottom end.......banging almost.
Have I missed anything? One timing pin in cam sprocket at about 8 o clock. 8mm bolt in flywheel.What about the second pulley near the front? Does that affect anything The two bolts all in solid and belt on, tensioned , bolts out ,turned a few times and bolts in again easily.
1/ Could timing be out? How? No smoke.
2/ cambelt too tight?
3/Could crank be damaged? The damper pully was a helluva job coming out. I made a toothed locking plate for ring gear and wound it out with a 4 ft extension. It was as tight coming out on the last threads as it was at the start. It made some real cracking and jumping sound at times. I was sure the bolt had broken but it was intact. New bolt went in fine. When turning the engine at crank pulley there is a slight knock I feel from somewhere in there. Woodruff key is fitted properly.
I will strip out and slacken belt. When running it sounds like a worn crank damper but this one is just new on.
She fired up no problem but sounds rough with knock on bottom end.......banging almost.
Have I missed anything? One timing pin in cam sprocket at about 8 o clock. 8mm bolt in flywheel.What about the second pulley near the front? Does that affect anything The two bolts all in solid and belt on, tensioned , bolts out ,turned a few times and bolts in again easily.
1/ Could timing be out? How? No smoke.
2/ cambelt too tight?
3/Could crank be damaged? The damper pully was a helluva job coming out. I made a toothed locking plate for ring gear and wound it out with a 4 ft extension. It was as tight coming out on the last threads as it was at the start. It made some real cracking and jumping sound at times. I was sure the bolt had broken but it was intact. New bolt went in fine. When turning the engine at crank pulley there is a slight knock I feel from somewhere in there. Woodruff key is fitted properly.
I will strip out and slacken belt. When running it sounds like a worn crank damper but this one is just new on.
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
I suspect belt is one tooth out, it's a case of taking off and refitting. Turning engine manually a couple of revolutions and then check all alignment marks match up.
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
The cambelt was tight to get on. I only managed it by taking new eccentric tensioner off and easing it on to its spindle with the belt.
It shouldn't be as tight as that. Same belt and teeth count as original. Will try again tomorrow
It shouldn't be as tight as that. Same belt and teeth count as original. Will try again tomorrow
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
Where do you stay as I'm off if you wish an extra pair of hands. Send me a PM
Kenny
Kenny
C5 x7 2.0 HDi 160 hp Estate exclusive, the newbie
Xantia 2.0 Hdi 90hp 1999 only 189,000 and rising!!!!!!! Moved on to a new home
C3 1.4 petrol (SWMBO)
Xantia TD 1.9 Mk 2 Estate LX 1998 model over 210,000 miles now and still rising!!!!!!!!!!!!! now deceased 17/12/2010.
Xantia 2.0 Hdi 90hp 1999 only 189,000 and rising!!!!!!! Moved on to a new home
C3 1.4 petrol (SWMBO)
Xantia TD 1.9 Mk 2 Estate LX 1998 model over 210,000 miles now and still rising!!!!!!!!!!!!! now deceased 17/12/2010.
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
Almost certainly half a tooth out given it was hard to get on. It's so easy to knock it out a bit like that. So vital to have the crank and cam (and pump if necessary) firmly locked when doing a cambelt...
Jim
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
Kenny W. That is a fantastic and generous offer. I couldn't possibly have you come all the way over here to Paisley mate. You enjoy your time off mate.
My query: How did I get the timing out, if I locked the crank and cam? Do I basically take the belt off once locked up and try it on again? I mean what am I relying on to get it right this time and do differently?............luck?
My query: How did I get the timing out, if I locked the crank and cam? Do I basically take the belt off once locked up and try it on again? I mean what am I relying on to get it right this time and do differently?............luck?
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
How did you lock them Lexi?
Jim
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
Lexi,
I have the cambelt fitting kit if you need it.David Hallworth lives near to you maybe send him a PM.
Kenny
I have the cambelt fitting kit if you need it.David Hallworth lives near to you maybe send him a PM.
Kenny
C5 x7 2.0 HDi 160 hp Estate exclusive, the newbie
Xantia 2.0 Hdi 90hp 1999 only 189,000 and rising!!!!!!! Moved on to a new home
C3 1.4 petrol (SWMBO)
Xantia TD 1.9 Mk 2 Estate LX 1998 model over 210,000 miles now and still rising!!!!!!!!!!!!! now deceased 17/12/2010.
Xantia 2.0 Hdi 90hp 1999 only 189,000 and rising!!!!!!! Moved on to a new home
C3 1.4 petrol (SWMBO)
Xantia TD 1.9 Mk 2 Estate LX 1998 model over 210,000 miles now and still rising!!!!!!!!!!!!! now deceased 17/12/2010.
Re: Running rough after cambelt change
I used two 8mm bolts guys. I did notice that at one point I got the cambelt slipped on freely. I took it off for some reason and never got it on easily again. Probably after tightening crank damper or something. The bolts are going right in as they are marked in depth.
In tightening up damper my woodruff key came out at one point and I had to refit. The bolts were in at this time though.
I will go for it again in the hope I can get the belt on as I did before. I take it the fitting tools are precise at 8mm?
Thanks for your answers guys.
In tightening up damper my woodruff key came out at one point and I had to refit. The bolts were in at this time though.
I will go for it again in the hope I can get the belt on as I did before. I take it the fitting tools are precise at 8mm?
Thanks for your answers guys.
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
Is that a single overhead cam motor?
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
One thing you have to watch is that when the lockers are removed and depending on how the tensioner plays, the timing can jump then. Did you rotate slowly by hand a few revolutions and then re-check timing? I've had it happen.
I always now check and recheck timing after doing about 10 slow rotations of the engine by hand before going for a start...
On a second go Lexi, armed with that, chances are it'll be perfect second time!
I always now check and recheck timing after doing about 10 slow rotations of the engine by hand before going for a start...
On a second go Lexi, armed with that, chances are it'll be perfect second time!
Jim
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Re: Running rough after cambelt change
I will do all that Jim. If anything jumps I will swat it immediately!
Addo: Dohc AFAIK. 02 Plate. The Haynes has the aux belt routing and pulleys different from mine of course for the dohc.?
New puter here so can't get in to CS ATM. Maybe you can run the Vin Addo and check it? VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]
Addo: Dohc AFAIK. 02 Plate. The Haynes has the aux belt routing and pulleys different from mine of course for the dohc.?
New puter here so can't get in to CS ATM. Maybe you can run the Vin Addo and check it? VF7**************[VIN obfuscated, can be read by forum staff]
Citroen C5 1.6 HDI 110bhp Estate 06 plate
French Mistresses gone.
Citroen C5 HDI Mk 1 hatchback
Vel Satis 3.5 v6
ZX 1.9D Est.
ZX 1.9DHatch
Xantia 1.9td est.
Xantia 2.0 hdi Est.
Xantia V6 MK1
Xantia V6 MK 2
French Mistresses gone.
Citroen C5 HDI Mk 1 hatchback
Vel Satis 3.5 v6
ZX 1.9D Est.
ZX 1.9DHatch
Xantia 1.9td est.
Xantia 2.0 hdi Est.
Xantia V6 MK1
Xantia V6 MK 2
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Re: Running rough after cambelt change
It's a good old SOHC 8V DW10.
Yours will have the later floating crank sprocket for the cambelt - on these it's important to jam the crankshaft directly when you tighten the bolt otherwise you can turn the crank relative to the sprocket (and hence cambelt). The timing can't be that far out though, otherwise it would fail the cam/crank synch check and it wouldn't start. No need to pin the injection pump on these as it is not timed.
Yours will have the later floating crank sprocket for the cambelt - on these it's important to jam the crankshaft directly when you tighten the bolt otherwise you can turn the crank relative to the sprocket (and hence cambelt). The timing can't be that far out though, otherwise it would fail the cam/crank synch check and it wouldn't start. No need to pin the injection pump on these as it is not timed.
Richard W
Re: Running rough after cambelt change
That's great guys. It dawned on me that there was one cam when I retuned to the car. I did also notice that the geared sprocket did not sit bang on centre to that Woodruff key. If I see Mr Woodruff at the next bridge meeting I wont be able to face the Blighter!
Citroen C5 1.6 HDI 110bhp Estate 06 plate
French Mistresses gone.
Citroen C5 HDI Mk 1 hatchback
Vel Satis 3.5 v6
ZX 1.9D Est.
ZX 1.9DHatch
Xantia 1.9td est.
Xantia 2.0 hdi Est.
Xantia V6 MK1
Xantia V6 MK 2
French Mistresses gone.
Citroen C5 HDI Mk 1 hatchback
Vel Satis 3.5 v6
ZX 1.9D Est.
ZX 1.9DHatch
Xantia 1.9td est.
Xantia 2.0 hdi Est.
Xantia V6 MK1
Xantia V6 MK 2