Citroën Says Au Revoir To Its Hydraulic Suspension

[GB]

Sorry it this is a repost.


Automotive News Europe


PARIS (Reuters) -- Hydraulic suspension, once key to the appeal of the original Citroen DS, is to be scrapped by PSA/Peugeot-Citroen as the carmaker cuts costs, sources said.

The technology, manufactured at a PSA plant in northern France, will end with the Citroen C5 sedan, according to several sources close to the company.

A spokesman for PSA declined to comment on company product plans, which remain confidential.

Combining a hydraulic pump with nitrogen-filled pneumatic spheres, the Citroen suspension system first brought an almost unmatched level of motoring comfort between 1955 and 1975 and contributed to the space-age mystique of the futuristic-looking DS model of that period.

It was also credited with saving General Charles de Gaulle from assassination in 1962, when the presidential DS was able to escape from an ambush even with two tires shot out.

More recently, however, electronically controlled alternatives such as Volkswagen's DCC adaptive suspension have beaten Citroen's hydraulics - or more accurately hydropneumatics - on handling and price.

The decision to scrap the in-house suspension could be part of wider cost-cutting measures launched under CEO Carlos Tavares that are cutting inventory, headcount and the production of components that can be sourced more cheaply elsewhere.

"Tavares has made it clear that there are now other systems that can do just as well," one of the sources said. "Hydropneumatics cost a lot for not much benefit."

Ironically, however, the phase-out comes just as PSA is developing DS as a stand-alone luxury car brand, playing on the new models' connection with their famous ancestor.

None of the new DS models use Citroen's hydropneumatic suspension, and the newly upgraded flagship DS5 is supplied with "preloaded linear valve" shocks by Germany's ZF Friedrichshafen.

"We still aim to be best for comfort," a PSA company source said, "but in future we'll do it with technologies other than hydropneumatics."

Among PSA's European peers, hydraulic or pneumatic systems are limited to ultraluxury Rolls-Royce models or high-end offerings from Mercedes and VW's Audi.

Sales of hydropneumatic Citroen C5s dwindled to about 10,000 last year, and their suspension accounted for a small share of overall production at PSA's component plant in Caen, Normandy. The factory still supplies pneumatic spheres to Rolls-Royce.

[mooseshaver]

Nooooo

[vborovic]

You could see that happening from miles away ... sad, but nothing we can do about it ... there goes one era down the drain ...

[Stickyfinger]

I wonder when LHM will be pulled ?

[The Ace]

This is one of these rare occasions when you have simultaneously an epic fail AND a very logical decision

A defining characteristic of modern Citroens, which was -for some- the sole reason for buying a Citroen, and a very expensive and highly complicated system that has obviously seen it's day in the sun and now is time for something more modern, dependable and ofcourse cheaper....

[Stickyfinger]

And what suspension system is better for a "load carrier" ? there is none .

........Citroen had a unique opportunity for vans, estate cars etc.
............and have blown it technically by over complicating things.

They never developed a simple system, they never developed a Plug-in/Plug together system, they never developed a rear end only helper system...etc etc

Shame but it has passed now.....just when roads across Europe are getting crappy, just when other makers are developing top end systems for "comfort"

Add to that the dealer network, French marketing and the French government/Work force/Employment Laws.
...see Ya Citroen you will go like SAAB and Rover group, either gone or just a badge (well that has happened) with the C5 being the last of the line.

[Homer]

They never developed a simple system,

Up until Hydractive it was pretty simple, you had a pump, 4 hydraulic rams and 2 valves to control the height. Maintenance was pretty simple, usually just a case of replacing the spheres every so often and renewing the fluid. Easier jobs than replacing dampers and springs on a conventional setup. And compared with steel springs of the era you got a vastly better ride and superb control over poor surfaces. Even Hydractive I and II had the same mechanical base, and if the electronics failed you just had a slightly harder ride.

Hydractive III, well that seems to have over complicated things for little benefit at a time when steel spring setups were improving hand over fist. And then to be sure to kill it off completely, only offer Hydraulics on the top of the range cars.

Sad to see it go but all good things come to an end.

[demag]

Yes it's all turning into a French Ford. The cheap arm of Peugeot. Bargain basement stuff.....at a price.

[Stickyfinger]

Peugeot-EPB ?


Peugeot -[Extra Plastic Bits]

[qprdude]

When my C 5 reaches the end of it's life, I suspect I shall opt for a boring Ford or something similar. Can't see me going for a Citroen with springs. I love my X7 but a big car without hydractive suspension just wouldn't do anything for me. Son in law has A new Jag xf and brother in law has a mercedes E class, but those are way out of my range. C4 isn't really any better than a cheap to run Focus so my Citroen days will probably come to an end with the C5.

[macplaxton]

They never developed a simple system,

The late Dr Moulton did that and the gas sprung version was Hydrasag.

[wurlycorner]

Hydractive III, well that seems to have over complicated things for little benefit at a time when steel spring setups were improving hand over fist. And then to be sure to kill it off completely, only offer Hydraulics on the top of the range cars.

I have to say, having been under the C5, in comparison to the Activa (ok that's an extreme comparison ) and all my CX's, the suspension system on the C5 is actually very very simple. It's also incredibly reliable and I doubt that much more expensive than a non hydraulic system, because so much of the rest of the suspension parts are now just the same as a pug (not done it, but I'm pretty sure you could whip the hydractive strut out of my C5 and fit a standard 407 strut in its place???)

There really will be no reason to buy a Citroen over (e.g.) a Pug after this.

And of course, we know their parts supply is getting switched off at a shocking rate and I fully expect they won't allow anyone else access to the IPR/existing diagrams in order to make parts to keep older Citroens going, so it's not looking good for the current batch of C5's being maintainable in 5 years time!

Arseholes.

maybe we should arrange a mass 'leakonstration' where we all drive up to Pug's HQ, stop outside the doors and one by one dump all the LHM and LDS out of our cars on their doorstep...

[Homer]

Hydractive III, well that seems to have over complicated things for little benefit at a time when steel spring setups were improving hand over fist. And then to be sure to kill it off completely, only offer Hydraulics on the top of the range cars.

I have to say, having been under the C5, in comparison to the Activa (ok that's an extreme comparison ) and all my CX's, the suspension system on the C5 is actually very very simple. It's also incredibly reliable and I doubt that much more expensive than a non hydraulic system,

The complexity is not so much in the mechanical/electronic stuff as the software.

You have a safety critical piece of software which has to be written and maintained and tested, which has to work alongside all the other software. That gets expensive when you aren't selling many units.

[GB]

Citroen CEO confirms next C5 for China; Europe future unclear

Automotive News Europe
June 30, 2015 06:01 CET
Citroen will replace its C5 midsize model, CEO Linda Jackson told Automotive News Europe, but she would only confirm that the next-generation car would be sold in China.

“In China there is clearly a requirement for a C5 segment car, and that is clearly going to be within the product plan,” Jackson said. “The next question: Is there opportunity in other regions? I don't know the answer to that.”

Jackson said there is a “question mark” over whether Citroen would sell the replacement in Europe.

“Looking at the market you certainly see that segment reducing significantly and being taken over by SUVs,” Jackson said.

European sales of the C5, which is offered as a sedan and station wagon, fell 27 percent to 17,911 units last year, according to figures from JATO Dynamics. Despite its slow sales, the C5 still ranked ninth in Europe's volume midsize segment, where volume has decline by 37 percent since 2011. By comparison, SUV and crossover sales for all brands grew by 21 percent in Europe last year.

Jackson didn't say when China sales of the new C5 would start. The current model was launched in 2008.

Citroen parent PSA/Peugeot-Citroen makes the C5 in China alongside the Peugeot 508 midsize car at its joint venture plant with Dongfeng Motor in Wuhan.



Well, this is the end of Citroen as we know it. The company is slowly changing into Chinese Dongfeng subsidiary. Citroen Cactus will be their main European seller in a few years time, bought mainly by hipsters.

[MikeT]

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-c ... aunch-2017

..."I can guarantee it will be unique to Citroen,” she said. “We have the opportunity to pick new technologies for the future and I am sure this one is best suited to Citroen's core values. I believe I can promise you this will be a Citroen-only system."...