Xantia hdi clutch

[Gresleyite]

Hi all,

Newbie on here with an interesting(?) clutch question, car is a W reg 110bhp hdi sx with a hydraulic clutch.
The car has been up on ramps, on and off, at both front and rear over the last few weeks while I have worked on the suspension linkage and ride height, having got everything working as it should I taxed the car and took it out for a test run which was fine for about half a mile and then I noticed the the clutch pedal was only returning about half way up, after stopping and pumping the pedal a few times it seemed ok but then a grinding noise from, I think, the release bearing started every time the clutch pedal was touched. The car still drives ok and the cluch action is still light and gearchange fine.

Is there any way the release bearing can be lubricated, and would it do any good anyway, or is it the onset of clutch failure?

Any ideas greatly appreciated as the car is really too good to scrap but the labour costs of fitting a new clutch would seem to make it uneconomic on a car with 210k on the clock even though the engine uses no oil or water. Unfortunately I don't have the facilities for a gearbox out job, especialy at this time of year.

Thanks again for any ideas.

[Peter.N.]

It does sound like a failing release bearing or could be a finger or two on the pressure plate has broken. If it still drives OK I would just go on using it, if it fails completely you can still drive it home with judicious use of the starter and carefully judging the revs.

I bought an XM in Slough and drove it back down here with no clutch and that was failure of the release bearing, I didn't know that until I got the gearbox off and only changed the bearing which apart from labour is a cheap job and I would say well worth it if the rest of the car is in good condition.

Peter

[lexi]

I bought an XM in Slough and drove it back down here with no clutch

That's the kind of style I like

[CitroJim]

If the release bearing is on the way out it is going to go suddenly... Thge release bearing is held into teh clutch diaphragm spring with a C clip and it can suddenly pull out...

I'd get it sorted ASAP as if the bearing does let go it'll cause an issue with the slave cylinder; whilst not fatal it does add to the hassle...

On the HDi the clutch can be done without completely removing the gearbox; just move it to the side and there's just room...

[Gresleyite]

If the release bearing is on the way out it is going to go suddenly... Thge release bearing is held into teh clutch diaphragm spring with a C clip and it can suddenly pull out...

I'd get it sorted ASAP as if the bearing does let go it'll cause an issue with the slave cylinder; whilst not fatal it does add to the hassle...

On the HDi the clutch can be done without completely removing the gearbox; just move it to the side and there's just room...

If the release bearing is on the way out it is going to go suddenly... Thge release bearing is held into teh clutch diaphragm spring with a C clip and it can suddenly pull out...

I'd get it sorted ASAP as if the bearing does let go it'll cause an issue with the slave cylinder; whilst not fatal it does add to the hassle...

On the HDi the clutch can be done without completely removing the gearbox; just move it to the side and there's just room...

Thanks for replies, having slept on it and thunked about it I have decided, sadly, to offer the car in the buy & sell on here, or if no interest strip usable bits off it and let the scrap man collect it.

[Peter.N.]

Its a shame but I have just done the same with my last XM.

Peter

[Sl4yer]

If the release bearing is on the way out it is going to go suddenly...

This. Mine did about 15 miles of town driving from when I first felt a vibration to sudden failure. Luckily the hydraulic cylinder was fine.

James

[rory_perrett]

If the HDi is the same as the 2.1td which I believe it is, then the hydraulic clutch system is "sealed" and there is no system for bleeding (although there are some on here who have managed it). If the rod pops out of the slave cylinder then you will have this hassle. As said, the clutch release bearing is held in the arm by a spring, if it disengages then you'll loose the clutch. A dying bearing could last a while, worn fingers may suddenly leave you without a clutch or the clutch operation could degrade overtime. The problem is you just don't know and the only way to find out its to get the gearbox off the engine and have a look. By that point you would be silly not to fit a new clutch as the car is on 210k miles. I had the engine out of my previous 2.1td at 190k miles for another reason and although it didn't really need it I changed the clutch. Current HDi is at 320k and still on the original clutch so they can last a fair while. If you knew there was at least another 100k miles in a car would you fit a new clutch?

[CitroJim]

Indeed Rory, the 2.1TD, HDi 110 and Activa all share the same hydraulic clutch...

[Gresleyite]

If the HDi is the same as the 2.1td which I believe it is, then the hydraulic clutch system is "sealed" and there is no system for bleeding (although there are some on here who have managed it). If the rod pops out of the slave cylinder then you will have this hassle. As said, the clutch release bearing is held in the arm by a spring, if it disengages then you'll loose the clutch. A dying bearing could last a while, worn fingers may suddenly leave you without a clutch or the clutch operation could degrade overtime. The problem is you just don't know and the only way to find out its to get the gearbox off the engine and have a look. By that point you would be silly not to fit a new clutch as the car is on 210k miles. I had the engine out of my previous 2.1td at 190k miles for another reason and although it didn't really need it I changed the clutch. Current HDi is at 320k and still on the original clutch so they can last a fair while. If you knew there was at least another 100k miles in a car would you fit a new clutch?

I have been pondering this very point, as I have another Xantia I could leave it until the better weather or perhaps take it to one of the Mr clutch type people, but I am a little dubious as to wether they know what they are doing with this type of cluch, there are so many varying reports.

[CitroJim]

I am a little dubious as to wether they know what they are doing with this type of cluch, there are so many varying reports.

True, you do need to know precisely what you are doing with this type of clutch. The opportunities for muppetry are aplenty...

[citroenxm]

Dooing my first hdi 110 clutch I made an error. Id done many 1.9 TD clutchs, these also a pull clutch, however, the clutch came with the release bearing already mounted to the pressure plate..

Thinking the HDi 110 operated in the same way, I clipped the release bearing in place and fitted the clutch! Then?? Yes, the gearbox would not go on!!

This is the clever bit, the clutch is supplied exactley like a conventional push clutch, in the release bearing goes on the input shaft on the gearbox, the pressure plate on the engine you then mate the gearbox up, and while the starter is removed REVERSE operate the release arm, by pushing it though the starter orface... this then clips the release bearing on the presure plate, and then when the slave presses from the other side it pulls on the release bearing...

As for push rods falling out and your in trouble, Ive not actually had an issue with this yet, though, I seem to be the only person on here that experiances "One Offs" in which no one else ever sees or crooses them selfs...

[Gresleyite]

Dooing my first hdi 110 clutch I made an error. Id done many 1.9 TD clutchs, these also a pull clutch, however, the clutch came with the release bearing already mounted to the pressure plate..

Thinking the HDi 110 operated in the same way, I clipped the release bearing in place and fitted the clutch! Then?? Yes, the gearbox would not go on!!

This is the clever bit, the clutch is supplied exactley like a conventional push clutch, in the release bearing goes on the input shaft on the gearbox, the pressure plate on the engine you then mate the gearbox up, and while the starter is removed REVERSE operate the release arm, by pushing it though the starter orface... this then clips the release bearing on the presure plate, and then when the slave presses from the other side it pulls on the release bearing...

As for push rods falling out and your in trouble, Ive not actually had an issue with this yet, though, I seem to be the only person on here that experiances "One Offs" in which no one else ever sees or crooses them selfs...

That's extremely useful information (To other readers as well), many thanks. Pity the BoL doesn't mention this sort of thing.

[citroenxm]

Well, Ive done about 4 of the things now, and one slight draw back, the ML gearbox is that bit bigger then the BE box, and in a compartment thats the same size as a BE equipt car this means theres a lot less room to move the box. Its a bloody fiddle, but its possible to do the clutch swap... its not one I look forward to dooing now. And the ML is damm sight heavier too....


Sorry, probably just put you off the posibility of dooing it now..

Despite these TINY draw backs, I would defo get the clutch done!

Ill tell you something else! I had a HDi exclusive... I ran her to 283k, and recently sold her on and been useing a C5 HDi..

I must say though Id far sooner have the Xantia HDi, and sadly there will be few n far between because of small weakness like the release bearings, or heater matrix's.

A damm shame for a car that we found superbly capable! Dont tell anyone, I might be back in one again soon...

[Gresleyite]

could always sell you one.-;