Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Moderator: RichardW
- DickieG
- Monaco's youngest playboy
- Posts: 4877
- Joined: 25 Nov 2006, 09:15
- Location: Buckinghamshire
- My Cars:
- x 38
Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
My C5 has left me rather puzzled when it comes to tyre wear, namely the rear tyres wear out faster than the fronts which for me is a first for a front wheel drive car. I've had the alignment checked a number of times, I check the tyre pressures regularly using calibrated gauges, the car rarely carries more than just me, I never drive the car enthusiastically (I have the Merc for that) the tyre wear is even across the width of the tyre suggesting that the alignment is accurate with a matched set of Michelin Pilot tyres yet the rears wear out quicker than the fronts. The previous set were Dunlop SP Sports did the same, has anyone else experienced a front wheel drive car wearing out the rear tyres quicker than the fronts?
13 Ram 1500 Hemi
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
-
- Locked user account
- Posts: 1750
- Joined: 31 Oct 2013, 17:07
- Location: Somewhere
- My Cars: A used Citroen
- x 27
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
After how many miles have you noticed this wear? My Uniroyals RS3s are evenly matched so far on all 4 wheels, they covered approx 3000 miles ...
- DickieG
- Monaco's youngest playboy
- Posts: 4877
- Joined: 25 Nov 2006, 09:15
- Location: Buckinghamshire
- My Cars:
- x 38
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
I've done about 20k miles in my C5 now so over that distance.vborovic wrote:After how many miles have you noticed this wear? My Uniroyals RS3s are evenly matched so far on all 4 wheels, they covered approx 3000 miles ...
13 Ram 1500 Hemi
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
-
- Moderating Team
- Posts: 11563
- Joined: 02 Apr 2005, 16:11
- Location: Charmouth,Dorset
- My Cars: Currently:
C5 X7 VTR + Satnav Hdi estate Silver
C5 X7 VTR + Hdi Estate 2008 Red
In the past: 3, CX td Safaris and about 7, XM td estates. Lovely cars. - x 1199
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Seems strange, if the wear is even I can't think of any reason. The rears used to were out faster on RWD cars because they were transmitting the power but all they do on FWD it hold the car up. Are both tyres worn by the same amount?
Peter
Peter
-
- (Donor 2016)
- Posts: 535
- Joined: 15 Oct 2011, 17:31
- Location: Cambridge, England
- My Cars: C4 Picasso 1.6 Blue Hdi 120 Manual Excl+ 2016
C3 1.2 Puretech 110 Auto Flair 2017 - x 99
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
This does seem unusual. My experience on 2.0hdi 160 manual is c.20 - 23k fronts and c45k rears, so 2:1 ratio with rears lasting longer (just like my former SAAB).
If you had an unmatched set I would suggest looking at the wear rating (letter code stamped on sidewall I think on all tyres now) but as its happened to two sets that is not relevant.
You say you have had alignment checked, is there anything odd with the camber angle?
One quick check, easier to do than to explain in words. If you run your hand lightly over the shoulder area of the tyre, both ways, you can feel if the tread blocks are feathered. Run hand one way then the other, should feel similar. If one way its jagged its an early indicator that something is up with alignment. Most front wheel drive cars have a bit of feathering especially if driven hard but it shouldn't be too noticeable and as far as I know shouldn't be noticeable at all on the rears.
Do you reverse several thousand miles a year?
If you had an unmatched set I would suggest looking at the wear rating (letter code stamped on sidewall I think on all tyres now) but as its happened to two sets that is not relevant.
You say you have had alignment checked, is there anything odd with the camber angle?
One quick check, easier to do than to explain in words. If you run your hand lightly over the shoulder area of the tyre, both ways, you can feel if the tread blocks are feathered. Run hand one way then the other, should feel similar. If one way its jagged its an early indicator that something is up with alignment. Most front wheel drive cars have a bit of feathering especially if driven hard but it shouldn't be too noticeable and as far as I know shouldn't be noticeable at all on the rears.
Do you reverse several thousand miles a year?
Richard_C
Current: , C4 Picasso 120 BlueHdi, C3 1.2 Auto
Past Citroens: Dyane (x2), 2CV, Visa, BX (x2), Xantia, Xsara Picasso, C3 (x2) C5 X7 Tourer, Synergie 1.9TD, C1
Others: Hillman Hunter, Cortina Mk 1, Maxi, VW Type 2, Granada, SAAB 900, SAAB 9-5, R5 Gordini
Current: , C4 Picasso 120 BlueHdi, C3 1.2 Auto
Past Citroens: Dyane (x2), 2CV, Visa, BX (x2), Xantia, Xsara Picasso, C3 (x2) C5 X7 Tourer, Synergie 1.9TD, C1
Others: Hillman Hunter, Cortina Mk 1, Maxi, VW Type 2, Granada, SAAB 900, SAAB 9-5, R5 Gordini
- bobins
- Donor 2023
- Posts: 5697
- Joined: 05 Jul 2012, 18:07
- Location: Midhurst, West Sussex
- My Cars: Kia Sportage
Mazda BT-50
Land Rover SIII SWB
V-F-R800
SL320
MX5 - x 2871
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Have you had a 4 wheel alignment check done ? When mine was checked recently, one of the rears was found to be slightly out of spec, but as they're non-adjustable on the rears, there wasn't much they could do to alter thingsDickieG wrote:namely the rear tyres wear out faster than the fronts which for me is a first for a front wheel drive car. I've had the alignment checked a number of times
Sadly no longer a C5 owner
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
I've never heard of it happening before either, for me the rear tyres on Citroen's last until the rubber has perished and cracked from age...
Is the car an estate by any chance that spends a lot of time carrying loads ?
You also don't say in what way the tyres are wearing - are they just wearing "faster" than the fronts but otherwise look normal, or are they wearing unusually - more on the shoulders or more on the centre ?
Is there any sign of scuffing/feathering on the smooth part of the tread that might indicate a toe in problem ?
IMHO a small error in camber is not going to cause accelerated wear across the tyre, if there is accelerated wear across most of the tread and any sign of feathering it has to be toe in/out.
A close up picture of the tread surface of a front and rear tyre might be helpful.
Doesn't the X7 have a multi-link rear suspension instead of a trailing arm ? If so there is a lot more potential for worn bushes/ball joints to cause tyre wear due to the tracking going out during cornering loads...
Is the car an estate by any chance that spends a lot of time carrying loads ?
You also don't say in what way the tyres are wearing - are they just wearing "faster" than the fronts but otherwise look normal, or are they wearing unusually - more on the shoulders or more on the centre ?
Is there any sign of scuffing/feathering on the smooth part of the tread that might indicate a toe in problem ?
IMHO a small error in camber is not going to cause accelerated wear across the tyre, if there is accelerated wear across most of the tread and any sign of feathering it has to be toe in/out.
A close up picture of the tread surface of a front and rear tyre might be helpful.
Doesn't the X7 have a multi-link rear suspension instead of a trailing arm ? If so there is a lot more potential for worn bushes/ball joints to cause tyre wear due to the tracking going out during cornering loads...
Simon
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
"the tyre wear is even across the width of the tyre suggesting that the alignment is accurate with a matched set of Michelin Pilot tyres yet the rears"
That to me reads that the tyres are wearing evenly all across the tread on both sides. Just quicker than the fronts..
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
That to me reads that the tyres are wearing evenly all across the tread on both sides. Just quicker than the fronts..
Sent from my SM-N9005 using Tapatalk
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Sorry, missed that comment somehow.
Toe in could cause even, accelerated wear, but would tend to leave signs of scuffing or feathering of the smooth surfaces so a close up picture could still be useful.
Toe in could cause even, accelerated wear, but would tend to leave signs of scuffing or feathering of the smooth surfaces so a close up picture could still be useful.
Simon
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
1997 Xantia S1 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive in Silex Grey
2016 Nissan Leaf Tekna 30kWh in White
2011 Peugeot Ion Full Electric in Silver
1977 G Special 1129cc LHD
1978 CX 2400
1997 Xantia S1 2.0i Auto VSX
1998 Xantia S2 3.0 V6 Auto Exclusive
- Stickyfinger
- (Donor 2016)
- Posts: 10411
- Joined: 28 Mar 2013, 21:05
- Location: Somset my lovleee
- My Cars: Xantia V6 ACTIVA 3ltr 24v Manual p1
Xm 2.1TD Ph2 Exclusive
AX, little Daffodil
SAXO White Mk1. Sally - x 1280
- Contact:
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
?? are those tyres Uni-directional and if so are they fitted the wrong way ?..if not, I'll get my coat
Alasdair
Activa, the Moose Rider
3x C5x7 Steering racks and counting
Activa, the Moose Rider
3x C5x7 Steering racks and counting
- osx
- (Donor 2022)
- Posts: 761
- Joined: 08 Jun 2013, 20:09
- Location: Oxford
- Lexia Available: Yes
- My Cars: GSA X
BX 1.6
C5 X7 Auto
C5 X7x2 Manual - x 15
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
What about uneven brake front-rear?
C5 X7 Exclusive 2.0 HDi Auto
C5 X7 Exclusive 2.0 HDi Manual
C5 X7 Exclusive 2.0 HDi Manual
- DickieG
- Monaco's youngest playboy
- Posts: 4877
- Joined: 25 Nov 2006, 09:15
- Location: Buckinghamshire
- My Cars:
- x 38
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Thanks for everyones suggestions, in answer to a few points raised, the tyres are fitted the correct way round, there aren't any signs of feathering on the shoulders and whilst the car is an estate it very rarely carries any load other than full tank of fuel. Being an Exclusive it's fitted with Hydractive and being an X7 it does have multi link suspension, no knocks/rattles. I've had the suspension alignment checked by three different "Hunter" branded 4 wheel wheel alignment machines who all agree with each other that the toe, caster and camber are correct front and rear, the wear is even across the width of the tyres so in a nutshell the issue raised is that the rear tyres are wearing out faster than the fronts.
One other thing that's left me rather puzzled about this car is that whenever I've washed it the rear wheel's get a far faster/greater build up of brake dust than the fronts, I've checked that the brakes aren't binding numerous times on the assumption that maybe the parking brake wasn't releasing but that doesn't appear to be the case as all four wheels run free and when I release the brakes on a minor slope the car will start to roll. Just prior to purchasing the car new brake pads were fitted all round by a Citroen dealer including new front disc's.
Having spent the past few days picking the brains of colleagues I might have now come upon the answer to the mystery, one of them mentioned that with some newer cars the rear brakes do far more work than used to be the case until firmer braking is applied whereupon the brake bias changes towards the front. When I heard this a lightbulb moment immediately struck me as with my driving style I rarely apply anything more than very gentle braking to slow a car as I prefer to use acceleration sense to match speed with the hazard ahead. Having taken a quick look through the wheels at the front and rear brake pads (renewed at the same time) the rear ones are likewise to the tyres wearing out faster than the fronts so I'm now left thinking that a combination of my driving style and the front/rear braking bias gives a reasonable explanation as the cause. Thought's anyone?
One other thing that's left me rather puzzled about this car is that whenever I've washed it the rear wheel's get a far faster/greater build up of brake dust than the fronts, I've checked that the brakes aren't binding numerous times on the assumption that maybe the parking brake wasn't releasing but that doesn't appear to be the case as all four wheels run free and when I release the brakes on a minor slope the car will start to roll. Just prior to purchasing the car new brake pads were fitted all round by a Citroen dealer including new front disc's.
Having spent the past few days picking the brains of colleagues I might have now come upon the answer to the mystery, one of them mentioned that with some newer cars the rear brakes do far more work than used to be the case until firmer braking is applied whereupon the brake bias changes towards the front. When I heard this a lightbulb moment immediately struck me as with my driving style I rarely apply anything more than very gentle braking to slow a car as I prefer to use acceleration sense to match speed with the hazard ahead. Having taken a quick look through the wheels at the front and rear brake pads (renewed at the same time) the rear ones are likewise to the tyres wearing out faster than the fronts so I'm now left thinking that a combination of my driving style and the front/rear braking bias gives a reasonable explanation as the cause. Thought's anyone?
13 Ram 1500 Hemi
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
- DickieG
- Monaco's youngest playboy
- Posts: 4877
- Joined: 25 Nov 2006, 09:15
- Location: Buckinghamshire
- My Cars:
- x 38
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
Lol, out of interest as you have a similar car have noticed a similar trait?osx wrote:Told you so
13 Ram 1500 Hemi
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
14 BMW 535D Tourer
19 BMW i3s
06 C3 Desire 1.4
72 DS 21 EFi Pallas BVH
- Stickyfinger
- (Donor 2016)
- Posts: 10411
- Joined: 28 Mar 2013, 21:05
- Location: Somset my lovleee
- My Cars: Xantia V6 ACTIVA 3ltr 24v Manual p1
Xm 2.1TD Ph2 Exclusive
AX, little Daffodil
SAXO White Mk1. Sally - x 1280
- Contact:
Re: Unusual Tyre Wear C5 X7
found this.....Ok not a C5 but another front/wheel drive with high rear wear
http://www.berlingoforum.co.uk/showthread.php?tid=750
If you where braking hard at the back you WOULD go light on the front and it would feel strange, I don't see that one.
As you have lots of pad dust on the rears then it must be a brake problem one would think (My C5's often loaded to 400kg+ have/had hardly any dust on the rears). I find that particularly strange but would suspect the auto handbrake or some strange miss-alinement.
My new C5 x7 has a matching set of 4 7k mile tyres, more on the front than the back.
Was out today giving it the works, brakes are totally normal and action like any other car. Loaded with some sand (200kg) this afternoon I was brake testing (:) ) and it worked again as normally as my Mk1 and facelift models did. That said the car is a bit heavier than those but she dipped as per normal on sharp application (the same with an 14plate Audi estate I was driving recently as well).
I find the X7 exactly the same as other cars in brake bias. X7 has Bloody good brakes when fitted with Mintex pads
http://www.berlingoforum.co.uk/showthread.php?tid=750
If you where braking hard at the back you WOULD go light on the front and it would feel strange, I don't see that one.
As you have lots of pad dust on the rears then it must be a brake problem one would think (My C5's often loaded to 400kg+ have/had hardly any dust on the rears). I find that particularly strange but would suspect the auto handbrake or some strange miss-alinement.
My new C5 x7 has a matching set of 4 7k mile tyres, more on the front than the back.
Was out today giving it the works, brakes are totally normal and action like any other car. Loaded with some sand (200kg) this afternoon I was brake testing (:) ) and it worked again as normally as my Mk1 and facelift models did. That said the car is a bit heavier than those but she dipped as per normal on sharp application (the same with an 14plate Audi estate I was driving recently as well).
I find the X7 exactly the same as other cars in brake bias. X7 has Bloody good brakes when fitted with Mintex pads
Alasdair
Activa, the Moose Rider
3x C5x7 Steering racks and counting
Activa, the Moose Rider
3x C5x7 Steering racks and counting