Picasso playing up

[barnsleygit]

I have a 2006 Picasso 1.6 HDi 90 with 77500 miles

this morning she started black smoking under strain, LOTS of black smoke!
just took her out again and she is only smoking for a couple of minutes after start up and then seems clear but she seems to not be getting any boost from the turbo!
fuel economy seems fine, the engine sounds to be running as it always has ad there is no warning lights, she has a bit of injector rattle but she has had that for months and was told by my local mech that the rattle is nothing to be concerned about, its a bit like a "pinking" sound

She is due a minor service in the next 1000 miles as well, I no a blocked air filter can cause smoking but I thought this would come on gradually not suddenly
I am currently running Redex diesel injector cleaner in the tank (full tank to half a bottle as instructed on the bottle) put in yesterday, I am hoping its not the Redex

She couldn't have picked a worse time to play up as she has her MOT next week

[Lighty]

Difficult to diagnose your fault given the information, Black smoke means to much fuel & not enough air. Air filters can block on these if the turbo leaks soot, and the filter sucks it in, but not that common.maybe the turbo is broken or damaged, perhaps the airflow meter is not working correctly.
Would be easy to diagnose if I saw it.

[barnsleygit]

Well this is really starting to spin me out now

Took her for a run today to see if there was any difference and for the first mile or so she went well, power was back turbo providing boost but tons of black smoke
then the smoke stopped and she went flat as a pancake, no power, no boost

so I pulled over, shut her off left her a couple of minutes, started her back up and off she flew again for a mile or so, again with tons of black smoke, after a mile or so, no smoke and no power

as I pulled up back at home she just came up on the dash with "Engine Fault" and the management light is now on

the engine sounds as smooth as she always has, there is no sign of her misfiring that I can tell so I am completely stumped!

[Hell Razor5543]

Now that you have the EML on, it is worth running a Lexia session on the car. There are a lot of members with them who are willing to help out. Just check on the following link for the ones nearest to you;

http://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/v ... 19&t=29178" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[barnsleygit]

Thanks m8, just looked but the nearest to me is in Kingswood near Chipping Sodbury, the joy of living in south wales!

Gonna get it up to my local mech next week

by the way what is a Lexia session?

[Hell Razor5543]

The Lexia is a very powerful piece of diagnostics equipment that is used on Citroens to read any error codes, run actuator tests, and a multitude of other things. The ones most members will have is the Lexia 3, which is a device connected normally to a laptop (which is running the software and displaying the results) and the diagnostics port in the car. It is small enough to be fully mobile, allowing for the car to be driven while having various engine (and other) parameters to be read and displayed.

[Mandrake]

Well this is really starting to spin me out now

Took her for a run today to see if there was any difference and for the first mile or so she went well, power was back turbo providing boost but tons of black smoke
then the smoke stopped and she went flat as a pancake, no power, no boost

so I pulled over, shut her off left her a couple of minutes, started her back up and off she flew again for a mile or so, again with tons of black smoke, after a mile or so, no smoke and no power

as I pulled up back at home she just came up on the dash with "Engine Fault" and the management light is now on

the engine sounds as smooth as she always has, there is no sign of her misfiring that I can tell so I am completely stumped!

Sorry mate but that sounds like the turbo bearings could be faulty.

I've had a petrol turbo fail before due to oil starvation and the first symptoms were that it would work fine for a few minutes then under acceleration it would suddenly seize causing an instant loss of about 80% of the power - flat as a pancake. Pull over for a minute to let it cool and it would come right again for a while then sieze again. It got progressively worse until I had to get the turbo overhauled.

The 1.6HDi is renowned for eating turbos - there are a couple of long running threads on here that I think you should read.

[Northern_Mike]

Sorry mate but that sounds like the turbo bearings could be faulty.

It does, but I'd be looking to fuelling, especially the MAF first of all and getting it on a Lexia if possible, or at least a decent code reader.

My experience with blown turbo bearings and seals also include smoke, but thick, blue smoke, especially at idle. A Saab I had would run fine and pull hard, yet sit at the lights idling and it would, quite literally, disappear in it's own smoke. I'd be interested to see what the OP's smoke smells like. The EML coming on also leads me to believe it's a fuelling fault - I don't know if a turbo boost fault would trigger the EML on a 1.6HDi. It doesn't on the Berlingo or C5 HDi 2.0.

Does the smoke stink of unburnt diesel, or a manky old Vauxhall?

[barnsleygit]

Not had any smoke on idol but she smells like and old bus when sitting, the black stuff has no oil smell to it just as I say like an old bus or like you say an old wheesy Vauxhall astra max van!

[barnsleygit]

Quick update:

My local mech spent a spare hour on her today and thankfully the Turbo is fine, code reader flagged up the MAF and a sensor for the turbo?
he also noticed hardly any vacuum at the wastegate so he gonna replace the vacuum pipe first as a precaution, she is boosting but not fully as the wastegate appears to not operating?

Booked in for a full check on Thursday

[Hell Razor5543]

Good news on the turbo. However, as previously mentioned, there is an issue with the 1.6l HDi engine that can cause it to eat turbos. The general consensus is to service the car at shorter intervals than recommended, doing what you can to get as much of the oil out as possible (the fleet service guys usually jack up the nearside so the wheel is very high off the ground), as the sump drain plug is recessed into the sump (what prat came up with THAT idea?). The suggestion is to service the car at half the recommended intervals.

[barnsleygit]

Finally sorted, it was the stainless metal pipe that goes from the EGR valve to the top of the engine (not sure what its called) had cracked thus no boost, have welded it up just to get her through her MOT and gonna order a new one next time I get payed,

My mech said he had never seen one split before but now she is better than ever!

[Mandrake]

Relieved it isn't the turbo! Well done on the temporary repair.