1995 XM 2.1 suspension harshness

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alansxm
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1995 XM 2.1 suspension harshness

Post by alansxm »

Have had the car since new in a maanner of speaking- it was my ex company car we bought from them in 98. Done 106K. Replaced front spheres at 80K 3 years ago.
Suspension getting very harsh,Broke chain wrench trying to get rears off, but got local non- Citroen garage to replace them last week. I did warn them to depressurise the system as soon as they had loosened them off a fraction, but they forgot.
Whether related or not, the suspension is still just as harsh - tho I read from the archives that the default is to the hard setting so problem may be elsewhere.
Any suggestions on first thing to try next ? The height adjusters seem to be working OK. although in its first three years the car had the rear one replaced twice.
The heater fan has also packed in again. Last time it was the company's problem & the motor was replaced (or so the bill said). It doesn't respond to the fan control, but every week or two suddenly comes on if the setting is max, but as soon as the ignition is switched off, refuses to work again. I believe the resistor sometimes fails, but am not sure where to find it as Haynes doesn't seem much help.
Alan
rg
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Post by rg »

Alan,
Welcome to this forum! It's friendly and helpful!
I am sure that one of the sages will be along very soon.
However, it might be worth posting on the yahoo! groups forum
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/XM-L
This is here lots of XM "obsessive compulsives" meet. There is much experience from "the university of adversity" to be benefitted from there.
It's no disrespect to this forum. Simply, with the wonderful, addictive, and sometimes tempramental XM, you need all the help you can get!
One thought - how many spheres were changed? The centre ones control softness. Have any of the other spheres been checked? They typically last 60K, but really need checking IMHO every 24K/3yrs. Checking and changing spheres and changing LHM can sort out a lot of ride quality problems and is a good starting point. Where are you in the U.K.? Someone on either forum might beable to recommend a local Citroen independent repair shop.
let us know how you progress.
Best Wishes
rg
'97 2.5 TD VSX
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

Will try the site you mention.
I only replaced the outer spheres, thinking in my ignorance that they would affect the ride ( and since the independent Citroen garage in Edinburgh replaced the front outers when the front became harsh - of course he may have replaced the centre one as well & I didn't notice !). I'll try the centre ones. Are they as difficult to remove as the rear outers, which needed some heat to free the alloy/steel thread corrosison without twisting the alloy housing to destruction?
I agree with you about this forum - it is full of practical advice.
I'm in Boness, near Falkirk in central Scotland.
I've done some stuff on the car myself ( 2 sets of front discs & one rear etc)but the rear spheres defeated me.
Cheers
Alan L
Thanks
Alan
alexx
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Post by alexx »

Of course, corner and middle spheres affect the ride, but in a different way.
If corner spheres are flat, ride will be harsh on sharp bumps, although it may 'float' on longer waves, if central spheres are ok.
If middle spheres are flat, you won't notice any difference between soft and hard mode. The car will be constantly sticked to the road, no 'floating', like some Alfa Romeo.
The problem may be also in electrical connections. When the car is in soft mode (engine running, doors open), you should hear slight buzzing from hydractive electrovalves.
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Post by RichardW »

Hi Alan,
I work in Grangemouth, and live in Lanark[:0]
I assume your XM has hydractive suspension?
You should have seen some improvement from changing the rear outer spheres, but if the centre one is shot it will feel like it is in hard mode all the time. The un-energised state of the hydractive valve is hard mode, so if the power supply has failed you will get hard mode. Note you can't measure the feed to the valve with a normal meter as it is a modulated signal. Have you done some cit-aerobics since the spheres were fitted (eg min - max on the suspension 4 or 5 times)?
Other possibles for the rear still being hard are: incorrect ride height (too low or too high), seized rear radius arm bearings, failed electrovalve.
Taking the spheres off with the system still pressurised must have been 'interesting'[}:)]
Oh, and the blower not working probably means the ignition switch is burnt out - a common fault on other cits of this era, so assume the XM is also afflicted. You could replace the switch, but the cheapest route is probably to find an ignition on live from somewhere else, and use this to power up a relay to feed to blower. You'll need to check the power to the blower first though, as Cit blowers are not exactly known as being 'well built'.....
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

Thanks to all
Off to try the citaerobics before anything else.
The suspension symptons are as you describe an Alfa. Like my Austin J4 camper with the tyres at 50psi. All postage stamps on tarmac detectable & teeth rattling slightly in jawbone.
The car is a late 94 build registered Jan 95 but with the new dashboard layout. It's an SX 2.1 diesel turbo auto. The build code on the door pillar is 6539
How do I find the heater motor feed ? ( and where have Cit. buried the motor itself ?)
Cheers
Alan
95 XM
66 Austin J4 camper
3 Jaguars in bits waiting for attention
"Madras" Enfield 350 Bullet
and other automotive horrors rusting in pieces
NiSk
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Post by NiSk »

I only have experience from a LHD XM. but it's a TD12 from '93-'94 without HA. And it's just about to break the 500 000 km mark (current standing 499525). I've had to oil the bearings on the heater fan a couple of times. On LHD cars the fan is right above the front passangers feet. Very easy to get to one you are down on your knees. Just unscrew two torx screws and the bit of half-stiff capeting wioll pull off from the heater motor (it's held in place with a nasty jagged clip). the motor is held i place with three philips (I think) screws, directly upwards. Try feeding live 12V directly to the red connector, that will tell you if its alive or dead.
A tip for your HA ailment - try radio XM. It's true! just tune in your radior to AM at around 600 meters and you should be able to hear the pulse modulation to the solenoids on the radio. If you can't hear a thing, you're probably not getting an output from the HA computer.
By the way check out this link to find out everything you wished you knew about Xm's:
http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/sus ... suspn.html
there is also a section about the ubiquitous XUD diesel and all the ailments that can befall it!
//NiSk
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

NiSk
Thank you for the heater and suspension advice.
I reckon modern manufacturers get round the customer's reluctance to buy cars that rust, which means they have had to improve the bodywork, by keeping down the design life of parts like wiper & heater mechanisms - and in Cit's case tricks like the easy break electric windows on the XM. Or by leaving rust traps by design in non-structural but unsightly places.
Means they still run but are so annoying you might buy a new car.
Not however us XM enthusiasts.
Darkness has fallen so I'll leave further exploration until tomorrow.
At least replacing the faulty fuel filter with one off a Ford means it starts properly now. Took ages to find where it was drawing air into the fuel. Until it was fixed it would start, run, then die at the first roundabout or junction unless you left it idling for ten minutes to warm up. This made for a few exciting moments if you forgot to do so.
Cheers
Alan L
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

Stepson has borrowed other half's Fiesta, so she has borrowed the XM,hence lack of update.
Centre sphere for rear arrived from GSF today, so I'll retrieve the car & have a go at it. It would have come back sooner, but lack of frost means lack of heater wasn't so critical.
Alan
NiSk
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Post by NiSk »

Alan,
For your own (and your XM's) sake, read the following text in the red box before depressurizing the system!
http://www.tramontana.co.hu/citroen/sus ... suspn.html
As you can read, doing it the wrong way might have got you were you are now!
//NiSk
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

Thanks - have read it - a bit alarming. Still slightly confused as to whether mine is a Hydractive 1 or 2 - it's not here at the moment so I can't check doing the 700 Hz thing
It's a late 94 build reg Jan 95, with the later dash layout. VIN is 7y4td0000td0658.
The garage's last effort when they forgot to depressurise the system after very slightly loosening the outer spheres(which needed much heat to remove) may not have helped matters.
Regards
Alan
alansxm
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Post by alansxm »

Rear centre sphere now replaced, which made no discernable difference.
Neither does changing from sport to ordinary setting, so must have defaulted to sport setting.
As an aside, a few years back the CHG blew towing the caravan to Mull. fortunately I noticed the temp rising & spotted the bubbling in the resevoir, so no head damage. The local garage fixed it - pleased the other half as she got an extra week's holiday out of it & became friends with the owner of Manyana motors as she checked on alleged progress of the gasket from Glasgow to Mull - CHG has been fine but the car has held on to gears longer than in the past ever since. It's a 2.1TD auto. Would CHG replacement have involved meddling with anything affecting gear change points, I wonder.[?]
Cheers
Alan
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