Lucas EPIC Injection Pump Overhaul Guide

[myglaren]

I found them invaluable back in the seventies and eighties for my Hillman Minx, Renault 4, Hillman Imps and the GS.
Of course, I didn't have a clue what I was doing so the Beano would have been useful too.

[CitroJim]

Of course, I didn't have a clue what I was doing so the Beano would have been useful too.

I don't believe that for a moment Steve You ae doing yourself an injustice Nowadays the Haynes is the Beano... And printed on inferior paper too

[MattBLancs]

... And printed on inferior paper too

Not even that!

Haynes has launched "Autofix" some sort of online thing where there's (who'd thought possible!?!) Even less detailed instructions and more generic pictures.

It's regularly popping up in the adverts in among my Facebook feed - I normally have a quick read see what the typical Facebook user thinks. I know that's a limited demographic, but equally, well, don't think I have seen many positive reviews!

[moizeau]

I think the BOLs went downhill in the late 80's. My BOLs for the XUD engine only is twice as thick as the 407 one which covers 2 variants of bodywork, 2 gearboxes and 3 engines!

[wesacosa]

I have a horrible feeling I know the answer to this based on searching this forum but I will ask anyway just in case. Various symptoms over the last few hundred miles on my XM 2.1 TD EPIC

1) First of all noticed the car would start first time after being left but then cut straight out and take a second or third go, with a whisp of smoke (put down to some air leak as priming with the bulb helped stop this)

2) Then noted that if I turn the car off after a few seconds the engine runs on for a second or so, then on the next restart the emissions light is on but goes away at the next start. This run on only happens if the engine is turned off after less than a minute running. Otherwise its fine

3) Next up I noted that during the cold weather there was a small amount of leakage from the top mounted solenoids for first few minutes of running which would then stop. As the weather has got warm this leaking seems to have stopped

4) As of last week I had a few mad 5 minutes where the idle speed would start to hunt between 1200-1750rpm. It only happened twice. First time it stopped after a few mins driving , second time I pulled into car park and keyed off, and when I started few mins later it was fine and I continued my journey.

Now I know that symptoms 1&4 seem to all be consistent with an air leak, and symptom 3 maybe points to that air leak being from the spill valve O rings, but reading some other posts from @CitroJim on other parts of the forum symptom 2 has got me worried (failing tips of the ESOS valves). So my question is, could symptom 3 also be caused by an air leak (either from the spill solenoid O rings or elsewhere) or could I also have a problem with those tips? Car has not yet done 75,000 miles so would these tips be expected to fail at such a mileage ?

It really is a lovely car and ULEZ is forcing me to sell it, but if the valve tips are the issue I can't see people queueing up to take it off my hands
Cheers

[moizeau]

It's not the mileage that's important it's the age and the heating and cooling of the O rings that turns then hard.
It sounds like the pump needs a complete overhaul regarding seals. Did you do it before? I think the stop solenoid red nipple has to be bought separately, I don't remember it in the kit. The other thing that can leak is the advance solenoid through it's potted resin. These can be changed as well.

[wesacosa]

Its also reasonably late car (1997) so its unlucky if I have a failure when older high mileage cars don't seem to !
I haven't done anything yet. To be honest I think a full pump rebuild might be beyond my capabilities

[CitroJim]

Its also reasonably late car (1997) so its unlucky if I have a failure when older high mileage cars don't seem to !
I haven't done anything yet. To be honest I think a full pump rebuild might be beyond my capabilities

Well worth having it done if the rest of the car is in good condition...

[wesacosa]

Its also reasonably late car (1997) so its unlucky if I have a failure when older high mileage cars don't seem to !
I haven't done anything yet. To be honest I think a full pump rebuild might be beyond my capabilities

Well worth having it done if the rest of the car is in good condition...

Do you know anywhere that would refurbish them ? I am a ham fisted amateur who I wouldn't trust to do this delicate work.
Might have to look to just sell as is, as from next week its £12.50 every time I drive it. Annoying thing is its worth a no questions asked £2000 on the TLF scrappage bribe but I just can't bring myself to even think about doing that even thought its probably worth half of that to flog it !

[CitroJim]

Do you know anywhere that would refurbish them ?

Not off-hand as I've been out of the loop a long time now... Might be worth asking on Club-XM possibly...

I appreciate what a hard decision it is but an XM in good order - even with a poorly pump - is far too good to suffer such a fate...

A relative of mine once put a lovely Peugeot 205 through the scrappage scheme back in 2009 and that still hurts... I actually still have the car he bought with his scrappage bounty!

[wesacosa]

Also, I am a bit confused as to what needs replacing on the actuators. From what I read there are two actuator blocks, one on the top and one on rear. Top has two large and two small o rings, the rear one has two large O rings, one small and the plunger/red tip and spring for the ESOS. But some posts I read suggested there are other actuators and tips , and its a full strip down of pump to get them. Am I confusing two different things here ? Can I just replace the O rings and the red ESOS tip& plunger by just taking the 2 valve blocks off or is there much more to it

[wesacosa]

I appreciate what a hard decision it is but an XM in good order - even with a poorly pump - is far too good to suffer such a fate...

A relative of mine once put a lovely Peugeot 205 through the scrappage scheme back in 2009 and that still hurts... I actually still have the car he bought with his scrappage bounty!

tell me about it, I can get £2000 for my tatty old Skoda Favorit which is worth about £250 but I cant bring myself to do it

[moizeau]

To get to all the o rings, including the hidden ones ( that can't be replaced but can) it a pump off job. If you can change a rear wheel on a push bike, you can renovate a pump. It's not a 'black art' just be clean and methodical. I think I sent you the manual a while ago, have a go, brings loads of smiles when it starts.
P.S. I've never done a full nut and bolt strip, engine included, on a classic fuel injected bike from '83, but it's in bit's, each bit is being refurbished then when all the bits are done it'll go back together. repaint by myself, never done that either, he ho, give it a go.
As Nike say, just 'Do It'

[myglaren]

As Nike say, just 'Do It'

These Nike's?

Nike Hercules

[wesacosa]

To get to all the o rings, including the hidden ones ( that can't be replaced but can) it a pump off job. If you can change a rear wheel on a push bike, you can renovate a pump. It's not a 'black art' just be clean and methodical. I think I sent you the manual a while ago, have a go, brings loads of smiles when it starts.
P.S. I've never done a full nut and bolt strip, engine included, on a classic fuel injected bike from '83, but it's in bit's, each bit is being refurbished then when all the bits are done it'll go back together. repaint by myself, never done that either, he ho, give it a go.
As Nike say, just 'Do It'

Yes you did send me the manual, thanks for that. I did take a look but I still can't figure out where there are other valve tips other than the red one on the ESOS valve