Xantia 2 front wishbone rear bush setting

[harryp]

Hi all, Been searching the site posts for the correct setting for the front wishbone rear bush orientation. The only advice I can find on the forum (and in Haynes) is to fit it as per it was on removal. My problem is that the rubber had parted company with the inner bush, so that on removing bolts, the arm followed Newtons Laws and hung vertically. Can I assume that if the arm is positioned as per andmcit post of Mar 2005 - and diagram - and the replacement driven on horizontally, that this is the correct position? With the trouble I've had removing it, I do not want to do it again soon, although of course all the bolts will be free this time!! I understand that tightening up the front "mushroom" bush bolt should be done after the car is level and bounced around a bit to settle it??

[Stempy]

I think it has to go on at a pretty precise angle to prevent premature failure. Never done one myself, I cheated and bought complete arm assemblies. From what I can gather there are alignment marks but you need to be very careful removing the bush inner so as not to put any stress marks on the arm.

[harryp]

Hi Stempy, Thanks for that. Cannot find any marks on arm or bush and have taken on board the many forum comments on correct alignment - hence the post. Looking at bush I reckon that it would be correct as per my post based on andmcit's post, but would really like confirmation. Inner bush came off ok, but the quality of the machining of the bush spigot is appalling with a pronounced waist in the centre section!! Must have been the last one on a Friday!

[Stewart(oily)]

It might be a pattern arm, all of the ones I have done have needed grinding off, I try to get them as near to normal ride height as I can, some that I have replaced are still kicking about a good few years on.

[Mandrake]

Did you find the diagram I posted in the following thread ?

http://www.frenchcarforum.co.uk/forum/v ... =3&t=39357" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[harryp]

Arm is original Stewart, had to grind bush off; the n/s one will probably be the same! Mandrake, the diagram is the same one as on " andmcit"'s post mentioned, but it only seems to refer to the front bush?..... so if I mount the rear in that position am I to assume it is correct? That is what I was asking really.... sorry if it wasn't clear.

[Stempy]

[CitroJim]

I haven't watched that video fully Stempy but the angel grinder there worries me. If you do use such a tool be very, very careful you don't nick the wishbone shaft as you cut as any nicks so made could become a stress-riser and result in a broken wishbone...

I always drive off the old P bush inner using a large cold chisel and concomitant large hammer. No angel grinders involved unless absolutely and utterly unavoidable.

I have a spare wishbone complete that acts as my alignment reference for the new one. Alignment is critical for reasons already stated...

[addo]

Gotta look after those angels. :p The pictured grinder has no guard - that bothers me more!

[harryp]

Removed the n/s lower arm today to use as a template....... but although it was not a "drop through" fit, it rotated on removal, so no use there. It was much simpler and not completly rusted up, so think it must hasave been replaced before I purchased the car at 60K. I seem to be on two similar threads here somehow?!?. Still have no conclusive idea as to how to set the angle of the P bush correctly, so have all wheels off ground now and waiting for some idea as to the correct setting.... Mandrakes thread on another thread does not allow for the fact that the frame is not flat but has downturned edges. Any ideas?? Getting on with lower ball joints and rear brakes and alternator next.

[isisalar]

I was just about to ask this very same question. I was in one of the local indys the other day getting a minor engine job done and while the car was up on the lift it was apparent that my o/s bush has let go completely and the other one is not far behind. Having now got my sphere and engine problems finally sorted (fingers crossed) this is now at the very top of the to do list, with the droplinks running a very close second.
Discussing the job with the indy, the owner was bemoaning the fact that recently some of these bushes were failing again in as little as a year. In previous discussions they said that they always change the whole arm, so I'm now even more reluctant to going down that route.
So, where to buy them? I've seen supposedly OE standard ones on E bay for about £20, Euro car parts similar price, GSF only do non OE standard for about £8. I've just phoned my local Citroen parts supplier and they are available at £29.79+vat. I'm thinking this is probably the best option unless anyone can tell me different please, the price difference is almost the cost of the droplinks.
Then to solve the problem of getting them fitted correctly, having studied the threads on this I'm not even sure I'd trust either of my local indy's with the job and it may well come down to giving instructions to a local place who have done a few jobs for me recently.
This business with fitting them loose and then tightening up after the car has been moved about a bit to settle it, is this something peculiar to Hydraulic Citroens? Certainly sounds important.
The most critical part seems to be positioning the bush on the arm before hammering it home. I've studied that video and Simon's diagram, would I be right in saying that putting a 8mm spacer under the bracket with the arm on a nice level surface would give the correct position?
Re the video, I take it that hammering the bush directly is not the right way to do it.
So looking forward to getting these last two jobs done.
Cheers guys
Paul

[RichardW]

It's more than 8mm - if you look at the diagram carefully, it's 8mm below the subframe, and that is lower than bottom of the arm by thickness of the bush and the offset between the bush and bottom of the subframe (which will need careful measuring, since IIRC there is a lip on the subframe around the hole where the bolts are). In order to work out the dimensions, we need to know:

Height of the bush from the bottom of the mounting flange to the bottom inside of the centre hole;
The difference in height between the bottom of the subframe and the bottom of the bush flange when it is installed;
The difference in height between the bottom of the bush mounting spigot on the arm and the flat face of the bottom of the arm

What you need is a snug box that the arm will drop into, supported at the ball joint end, and the bottom of the arm, with a flat section the bush can slide along whilst it is driven into place on the arm.

Oddly mine has always run a bit high at the front, but is still on its original bushes at 150k - they're a bit tired granted, but didn't even warrant a mention at this year's MOT!!

[harryp]

Addo of far far away fame(!) had a very good idea on a much earlier post (July 2012) when he said that he had used 2 blocks of 38 and 17mm under the front mushroom bush and the P bracket assembly respectively. So I set up the arm and scribed a line along the held in place Pbracket and arm. Clamped arm in vice and used a can of pipe freezer on the spigot (plumbing materials, B 'n Q )aligned marks and 10 blows from a 3lb hammer and it was on. Freezing it really did work, as without it I could not get the bush to start. The wood blocks is a genius of an idea! Full marks addo!!! As has been said before, getting them off is another matter, but again freezer seems to help. By comparison, the second one is a doddle... Oh, and copaslip on reassembly! Be interesting to see how long they last. I bought the car at 60K and it has now done 120K, but by the amount of black paint still on the n/s P bush, reckon it was probably changed just before I bought it. The two Pbush bolts undid easily too, as opposed to the 2 hours it took to remove the o/s bolts having to use a thread file on the bolt threads and even then it was a struggle with a 20in bar. Interestingly this one had an 18mm bolt head and a 17mm nut; the other easier one, heads were both 18mm. As always, thanks for all the advice on this forum, a lot of it very hard won!!