C5 window winder

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Napoleon
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C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

What is it with Citroens and blasted window winders?!

I had trouble enough on the '94 Xantia, but now the C5 is playing up. Arghhhhh!

Near side front passenger window... odd graunching noises and now there's barely any sound perceptible, but at least the window is in the 'up' position, and not letting in all this rain we're having.

Where do I go with this? Last time I 'investigated' a similar problem, I screwed up the entire door and got nowhere with it.

Yours, in frustration,

Tim
Tim
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fifth_cit
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by fifth_cit »

I have just replaced my front passenger one and I reckon everyone with a C5 III will be replacing theirs. Mine went like yours, lots of grinding noises then nothing. One of the cables had snapped and the other came off the drum and tangled around it. The water dripping off the window into the door lands on the cables and it rusts.

Not an easy job as the cables are very tight. I have some pics if it helps.
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by mooseshaver »

Something to look forward to then.
How do manufacturers manage to create new problems like this? Using metal that rusts where water is designed to run.
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by oneday »

how else are they to make money out of spares and garage repairs :-D
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by bobins »

fifth_cit wrote:I have just replaced my front passenger one and I reckon everyone with a C5 III will be replacing theirs.
Fifth_Cit....... If you had to do the job again, would you use one of the cable and wheel kits, or would you buy the whole frame ready assembled ? My C5 is due out of warranty in about a week so I'm expecting my winder mech to fail in about 8 days.
Napoleon wrote:Near side front passenger window... odd graunching noises and now there's barely any sound perceptible.

Where do I go with this?

Napoleon.....

There's a 'how to' on replacing the windown mechanism here

Someone has already posted a translation previously, but I got a mate to do an alternative version to compliment it:

1. Carefully start with the plastic surround on the door handle, start to gently pull it, from the top as the principle is as follows: the top part has horizontal clips – unclip them first. Lower part has vertical clips which have been inserted downwards into the slots. So, first pull the top towards you and then from the bottom upwards.

2. Carefully remove the second part of the door handle, but starting at the rear. The secret is that it has two clips that are released via the 2 small holes underneath in which you can insert a thin screwdriver to prise off.

3. Next remove the 2 screws holding the door handle – Torx screws

4. Remove the cover of the door handle. I took it off with by hand since I didn’t want to damage the delicate material with a screwdriver. There are two clips – as usual, don't use force!

5. Now start to remove the trimming / paneling itself. Firstly, get your fingers behind the top black part and pulling it up and towards you whilst pulling it off from the clip. Then remove from the door panel with a sharp tug. One or two clips may remain in the door panel, but WTF, they aren't broken. Remove and reinsert in the trim prior to reassembly. Remove the complete trim in the same way

6. Unfasten all the electrical connections. But don’t rush and be careful

7. Black fixture in the centre – it's attached with a Torx screw. Don’t unscrew it completely, only to the point where it is loose and can move freely. Don't worry as you unscrew it, it’s the way it is, nothing's broken. When you tighten it later, it'll lock in again.

8. Remove the speaker using a Torx screwdriver or wrench. Separate any connectors.

9. ((Not in original Russian)) White insulating seal is glued to the door around the edge. It’s fixed with a reusable adhesive. Start from the corner – lightly pull towards you, then start separating the adhesive with a sharp knife ((end of additional text))

10. The speaker casing ((?, strictly speaking: socket)) is attached with rivets – drill these out. I replaced them with screws and self locking nuts

11. On the top of the door there are 2 grey insulating seals. These are glued. To avoid making holes in them, I followed the same principle as for the white insulating seals; I freed enough to gain access to the window elevating mechanism

12. Carefully lower the glass until the self-tapping screws which hold the glass to the mechanism can be reached. Remove these screws holding the glass to the lifter. Carefully keeping it straight, lift the window glass ((not in original: I then held the glass in place with some masking masking tape to stop it falling))

13. Remove all remaining self-tapping screws – 6 in total.

14. Next, free the construction from the clips on the door. Careful with the top part. If necessary, lower the glass a little bit – the runners will come out easier.

15. You can now free it completely from the door.

16. Usually, only the lower cable breaks (shortest one) It’s the only part you need to replace unless you have a replacement kit, in which case you can replace all. It happened so that the roller on the right door wasn’t damaged. However, on the left – grooves were gone. I had to replace them from the replacement kit. I don’t like it as the plastic looks unreliable. Once you have decided to change it yourself and you've reached the fittings inside the door, then I’m sure you will make it with the right skill when winding the cable. The main thing is that only one spring is compressed when ((the mechanism)) is at the extreme position. If both springs are compressed – you have overtensioned. If both are expanded – you haven’t fully wound the cable.

17. I lubed the runners with graphite oil or grease. To put it all back together, follow the instructions in reverse. ((Yeah, Right! Just goes to show that the Russians have a sense of humour!))
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

Bobins et al - gonna read that in more detail in the morning, thanks guys.

What a way to start 2013!

All the best for the New Year. :)
Tim
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by fifth_cit »

IF I had to do another I would still go for the cables as the assembled unit would include the motor making it to expensive I guess.

It seems that it is the passenger side that goes first probably as it does not get as much use. Mine snapped at the bottom of the strut where it goes around the pulley.

I intend looking at all of mine in the near future and give the bare inner wires a spray with grease.
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

Going slowly on this.

At step three/four, taking out the Torx screws holding the handle on, I can't seem to shift the handle at all. It's like it's stuck to the door.

Any ideas? Am I meant to be levering something there?
Tim
2009 HV09 C5 2.2
1996 N679 Xantia TD VSX estate - sold August 2012
1995 M289 Xantia TD SX hatch - sold March 2012

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Re: C5 window winder

Post by fifth_cit »

No Tim it does not come off, you take out the screws to allow the door panel to come off. Look at the pictures I sent you, the one with the door handle front / armrest off. You can now start to take the door panel off.
Keith
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

Oh, I see, thanks Keith. I wasn't aware of this step.

Unfortunately it's taking days and days just to have access to the car to get ready to do the job itself. So far I have managed to remove the lock release surround and the silver part covering the handle, and now, today, the Torx screws.

Maybe tomorrow the panel/card will come off! On that point, my understanding is that you somehow peel from the top of the lining, where it meets the glass - that about it?
Tim
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1996 N679 Xantia TD VSX estate - sold August 2012
1995 M289 Xantia TD SX hatch - sold March 2012

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Re: C5 window winder

Post by fifth_cit »

Cut the glue at the back of the white panel using a stanley knife blade. You will have to keep peeling it back as it keeps sticking back to itself if it touches.

When you start to pull off the door panel, start at the top lifting and pulling ie bending the top and be prepared for some of plastic clips that hold the panel on to break. I got some new at the local accessory shop but they are on EBAY.
C5 III Tourer 2.0HDi SX
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

ok, it's finally done.

Had to, per fifth-cit's advice, trim the cable sheath back by about 15mm to be able to get the nipple in the place where it's meant to be.

Handy tip, too, about keeping the drilled out 'washer' that you get when you drill out the rivets on the speaker.

Greased the cables best I could once it was assembled.

Now i have done it once, it would be silly not to take advantage of the experience and not buy the cable kit agin, when the other winders fail. A complete kit is around £165 on ebay.

Surprising how much water gets down between the seal and the glass, TBH.
Tim
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Will
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Will »

Grind grind, clonk. Oh well my passenger side front window mech has bust now, as expected (did the driver's side last year). Got the window back up so at least the car is watertight!

As we have a three-month-old baby I have neither the time nor the inclination to tackle the job myself so it looks like the C5 is off to the dealers again for a spot of wallet-raping.

I know this problem is well documented but overall this car is such a paradox. When it works, it is wonderful - spacious, comfortable and effortless. I'm just so disappointed that it is beset with so many annoying niggles and issues. I've also noticed the lacquer on all four wheels is peeling badly too. Seriously considering getting rid for another one (or a C4) but I guess it is better the devil by now. Maybe I just got a Friday afternoon one.

Using the AXGT as the daily instead so every cloud etc :wink:
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Napoleon »

Spacious? Really? I find the boot too small.

Sorry to hear about another window winder.

At least we are experts on that one, now.

:)

It'd be interesting to know how much the stealer relieves you of.
Tim
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Re: C5 window winder

Post by Will »

I find the passenger space is pretty good and it takes all the baby stuff in the boot no problem. Bigger than the wife's Fiesta anyway....

Stealer wants £450 all-in for the job :shock: Getting a second opinion from another place but that is pretty eye-watering, especially as the driver's side was done last year for 'only' £298. Why the sudden jump in price I wonder?

Happy days.
2008 C5 HDi 136 VTR+
1991 AX GT
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1974 AZU250 Belgian PO
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