407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

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Wil
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407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by Wil »

I have just bought a 2005 Peugeot 407 hdi 2.0 136 bhp. It starts and runs fine until you get to a steep hill when all of a sudden the engine loses power. even changing down a gear does not help. It feels like in the old diesels when the govener slows the engine down. The engine management light, nor any other light does not come on when this happens.
You switch the engine off and re start it and then it is fine untill you get to another hill of which there are plenty of here.
In short the engine loses power when the inlet manifold has more pressure in it when pulling hard as if a pressure sensor might be faulty. I will change the filter next week just in case anyway.
The previous owner has fitted a new turbo a few monthe ago.
On a flat road the car runs like magic.
Any ideas?
Last edited by Wil on 16 Dec 2012, 20:16, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by spider »

First thought is the MAF sensor in the airbox / intake piping if it has one (not 100% sure on the 136) as the lack of power concern can well be this acting up.

Have you tried a diag session to see if anything is stored (I know the lights not on) it may have something stored as to a clue.

Fresh filters will do no harm.

Other thought is a blocked particle filter although I'd expect that to throw a light on, even if it was just a blocked / choked cat.
Andy.

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407iain
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by 407iain »

A 1995 407? Thats about 9 years before they were produced.
05 407 maybe! I'd try a PP diag.
When driving normally do you get proper boost? Mines goes like stink on boost, about 2k in 4th give it a good punting.
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Wil
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by Wil »

Just edited 1995 to 2005. I plan to get a diagnostic test as there is a good bloke just next to my place of work. But thought sombody might have had the same problem with their car.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by 407iain »

Could be the manifold absolute pressure sensor or MAP.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by cranor »

Once sensors and filters checked, if the problem remains :

Has the gasoil filter been replaced recently ?

I hope it's not the EGR valve or the variable geometry mechanism inside the "new" turbo.

Do you have the valves just before and after the turbo ? On some Peugeot models, the servomotors were to weak and had to be replaced by a newer referenced part (having motors with higher torque).
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by Wil »

Here is an update.
I took the car to the garaage next door to our depot which has got a good reputation on electrical problems on cars. Mainly VW and Mercs.
He put the car on the computer and came up with the code -
P2562 Wastegate control solenoid valve position unexpected.
So I replaced the turbo wastegate solenoid which is at the back of the cylinder head on the left looking from the front. 20 miniute job no problem access not too bad
Took the car for a test up the hill and the dam thing was no better at all.
So opened the bonnet and had a good look around checking everything and all pipes for security.
I noticed the pipe from the egr valve to inlet manifold was quite hot so that gave me a clue.
Sat in the car and reved the engine up. The response was slow and took it's time to rev down. It also came to my mind that the car hesitated when accelerating from roundabouts etc.
Got to be the EGR valve sticking open.
I had bought an egr blanking plate a couple of weeks ago for the 407 off ebay for about £4 planning to do away with the egr as I had promlems with my 406 hdi with hesitation and have disconnected the egr valve four years ago with positive results.
Took 10 minutes to slide the made to measure plate between the egr and the pipe going to the inlet manifold.
Here is the ebay link -
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/140831256367? ... 1439.l2649" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Took the car for a good run up the hill and by hell it was running fine. I will take off the egr valve and give it a good clean whenthe weather improves. I have used the car for over a week driving up steep hills trying to get the car to go into limp mode and all is well.
So it proves again that what you get off the computer does not explain what is wrong. But it was right in the sense that the inlet manifold pressure and temprature was not as it should be. Either too hot or over boosting with the exhaust gasses coming in at pressure when going up hills. Thus engine going into limp mode.
I have read a lot of forums of people having this problem with their 407 hdi 136 and have changed the turbo actuator solenoid with no results. I have read of some unable to find out what is wrong and having to just put up with it.
So there you are. The cause THE EGR VALVE STUCK OPEN.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by Wil »

Just to add to what I did to sort the car out. I noticed the response on the actuation was not as it should be when driving thru the gears quickly. So I checked the vacum pipe that works the turbo and the throttle valve. All was well, but on checking where the thin vacum pipe connects to the thicker pipe that comes from the vacum pump I found the air flow was very restricted.
Not sure if this is how it is designed to work or perhaps a bad idea by Peugeot. Maybe something that slipped thru the quality control of the manufacurer.
So I removed the pipes and cleaned out the hole using a small 2mm approx drill bit turning it with a pair of pliers as it was just to clear the restriction.
Now the actuation response is quick with no delay.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by tcasalert »

Hiya, I know it's a couple of years late but I've signed up to say thanks for the tip off on this. I bought an '06 407SW 2.0 HDi 136 in November, and had an identical problem, with the error 'P2562 Wastegate control solenoid valve position unexpected'. Would intermittently lose power, until I turned off the engine and turned it on again, when it would reset for another few journeys. Garage diagnosed faulty turbo, and replaced it at great cost (£800). 3 days later, it went again. :-(

I followed your advice and bought a blanking plate for £2.49 and fitted it myself in around 20 minutes. Since then it's been solid for a good 15 journeys.

Really pleased it seems to have fixed it (and given a welcome performance boost at the same time), but gutted it cost me the £800 for the turbo when it turned out to be, just as you say, a £2.50 part that you fit yourself!!
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by tmead »

I'm even later to the party, but would advise everyone very strongly against drilling out the hole. Its there for a reason - if there's a leak in a solenoid or a pipe around the engine controls, the inflow of air wont be enough to reduce the vacuum for the brakes to a dangerous level. I recently had a solenoid leak that stopped the turbo working, but the brakes were fine - thats what the restriction of the hole is for.
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Re: 407 2.0 hdi 130bhp loss of power

Post by Peter.N. »

This may or may not be relevant but I had a similar problem on my 406 with the 110 hp engine below 2000 rpm and I eventually found it was vacuum pump that had gone weak, I replaced it and not only does it pull better but it has improved the brakes as well 8-)

Peter
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