Hi all,
Yup, I just bought her, and yes she’s my first Citroen… Seems to me the hydraulics and suspension (perhaps wheel balance too) needs some attention, but not sure…
Symptoms in order of obviousness…
Hydraulics:
1. So far, there’s always a sudden and very nasty smell in the cockpit when the engine is turned on or revved high whilst in motion. I suspect this is LHM dripping (or recently spilled) onto the block somewhere. For those who have ever dabbled in electronics I would liken this smell to that of an old brown Vero board, or any old and heat damaged circuit board. For those who haven’t dabbled in electronics I would say this smell is like a combination of stale urine (pub toilet), carbolic soap, and burning cardboard. Nice eh? [:p]
2. The brake pedal is somewhat “fidgety”. A little pressure on the pedal that feels right just isn’t quite, and a little more is often too much. So the resulting braking action is somewhat jerky. When the pedal is released it makes a squelching noise that seems too loud.
3. The fluid level indicator on the hydraulic reservoir is pushed all the way to the top of the plastic (or is it glass) bubble. I don’t know whether it’s just jammed up there or there really is way too much LHM in the reservoir.
Suspension (wheels?):
1. There’s a slight wobble in the steering at about 65mph
2. The overall ride seems a bit harder than I’d expect for a car of this type, but cornering seems fine.
That’s enough to be getting on with I’m sure... I was thinking I should forget about the smell thing for a while because it could merely be something that got spilled on the engine recently. The previous owner excused the smell saying it was one of those magic cleaning fluids that he had used all over the car.
I thought I might use a syringe to take some LHM out of the reservoir and see what happens to the indicator. Or maybe you guys can tell me how to check if the indicator is jammed.
I guess I’ll have to get the wheel balance checked at kwik-fit or some such. Naturally I am concerned most about the brakes.
OK, so maybe I’ve bought a very nice looking lemon, and it was that thought which inspired me to call myself Le-Mans. Har har!
FYI: She has 99k on the clock, and according to the service book she was serviced properly up until 54.5k at which time the timing belt was changed. After that, who knows? But she damn sure looks good inside and out!
All comments welcome. [:)]
Xantia 1.8i ’94 – Hydraulics?
Moderator: RichardW
The Citroen LHM is commonly overfilled but have you been checking the level with the car at maximum height? This is the correct procedure.
The brakes will feel different toa normal setup as the operation is simply opening a valve against spring pressure and there is therefore little pedal travel as such. There has been extensive correspondence on thisboard about the feel of Xantia brakes and various other problems. As a first point for the brakes and hydraulics in general you should be sure that the acccumulator sphere is good.
The first indication that the accumulator is flat is that the regulator ticking gets rapid - ie below 10 secs. there can be other reasons for rapid ticking but the accumulator is the most usual and the easiest to cure. New spheres about £19 + VAT from GSF - see online catalogue.
The suspension spheres also fail with age giving a hard ride (NO Spring!). They can be checked by sitting in the boot with the engine running and the height control in the normal position. The car should sink a long way and then rise to its unladen position after 20 secs or so. When you get off it should rise and fall back after a similar time. You should be able to do tha same on the front but somehow it never seems to work in quite the same way. If you can't bounce the front suspension (engine running etc) the chances are your front spheres have gone.
Steering wobble - try wheel balance first.
Smell - Might be a burning circuit board. I don't think LHM smells like this when it burns - after all its only mineral oil.
Jeremy
The brakes will feel different toa normal setup as the operation is simply opening a valve against spring pressure and there is therefore little pedal travel as such. There has been extensive correspondence on thisboard about the feel of Xantia brakes and various other problems. As a first point for the brakes and hydraulics in general you should be sure that the acccumulator sphere is good.
The first indication that the accumulator is flat is that the regulator ticking gets rapid - ie below 10 secs. there can be other reasons for rapid ticking but the accumulator is the most usual and the easiest to cure. New spheres about £19 + VAT from GSF - see online catalogue.
The suspension spheres also fail with age giving a hard ride (NO Spring!). They can be checked by sitting in the boot with the engine running and the height control in the normal position. The car should sink a long way and then rise to its unladen position after 20 secs or so. When you get off it should rise and fall back after a similar time. You should be able to do tha same on the front but somehow it never seems to work in quite the same way. If you can't bounce the front suspension (engine running etc) the chances are your front spheres have gone.
Steering wobble - try wheel balance first.
Smell - Might be a burning circuit board. I don't think LHM smells like this when it burns - after all its only mineral oil.
Jeremy
-
- Posts: 1503
- Joined: 26 Feb 2003, 10:52
- Location: Yorkshire
- My Cars: Current:
Volvo V60 D4 180
Previous:
BX16RS (two of),
BX19TZI,
Xantia 2.0i saloon,
Xantia 2.0 Exclusive CT turbo Break,
Peugeot 807 2.0 HDi 110,
Renault Grand Scenic, 2.0 diesel (150bhp)
C5 X7 2.0 HDi 160 which put me off French cars possibly forever - x 16
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Le-Mans</i>
2. The overall ride seems a bit harder than I’d expect for a car of this type, but cornering seems fine.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
When the spheres 'go' the ride firms up and on a smooth road can make for great conering. Hit a bump mid bend though and you will know about it.
2. The overall ride seems a bit harder than I’d expect for a car of this type, but cornering seems fine.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
When the spheres 'go' the ride firms up and on a smooth road can make for great conering. Hit a bump mid bend though and you will know about it.
-
- Posts: 449
- Joined: 28 Sep 2003, 11:08
- Location: North West UK
- My Cars:
BonceChops -
I'm sure the gang here can get your Corsa started [;)]
First check :
Unplug one of the HT cables from a plug - any spark while cranking ?
If no spark - check for spark from ignition coils' HT cable while cranking.
If spark here - remove & check the dizzy cap - it may simply be damp inside - considering the recent weather changes. A dry cloth & a squirt with silicone spray may then do the trick.
If no spark from coil - then suspect the ignition module and/or it's multiplug.
If you have a spark :
Sure there in fact is adequate fuel in tank [;)]
Happened to me once - with a dodgy fuel indicator [:I]
I'm sure the gang here can get your Corsa started [;)]
First check :
Unplug one of the HT cables from a plug - any spark while cranking ?
If no spark - check for spark from ignition coils' HT cable while cranking.
If spark here - remove & check the dizzy cap - it may simply be damp inside - considering the recent weather changes. A dry cloth & a squirt with silicone spray may then do the trick.
If no spark from coil - then suspect the ignition module and/or it's multiplug.
If you have a spark :
Sure there in fact is adequate fuel in tank [;)]
Happened to me once - with a dodgy fuel indicator [:I]
-
- Posts: 449
- Joined: 28 Sep 2003, 11:08
- Location: North West UK
- My Cars:
Ya mean checking the coil ?
Then you only need to figure out the coil's +12V ignition key feed - & the coil's breaker signal input.
A test wire from any +12V source to the coils +12V feed pin - and a free wire to the coil's breaker input pin. This free wire is then slided over any good earth - which will produce lot's of sparking from a good coil.
Checking the ECU I guess would be way too fiddly - unless you get a s/h unit for swapping.
It must have a TDC ignition sensor fitted somewhere on the perimeter of the flywheel (clutch) bellhousing. This can easily be tested - as the standard types are simple coils - with a winding resistance in the vicinity of 100ohms. If you're lucky - the sensor cabling may simply be damaged - or any connector corroded.
I would NOT try simulate a test signal to the ECU from this sensor - as the ECU also uses this sensor for other purposes - like calculating rev's & deciding fuel jet firing etc.
Then you only need to figure out the coil's +12V ignition key feed - & the coil's breaker signal input.
A test wire from any +12V source to the coils +12V feed pin - and a free wire to the coil's breaker input pin. This free wire is then slided over any good earth - which will produce lot's of sparking from a good coil.
Checking the ECU I guess would be way too fiddly - unless you get a s/h unit for swapping.
It must have a TDC ignition sensor fitted somewhere on the perimeter of the flywheel (clutch) bellhousing. This can easily be tested - as the standard types are simple coils - with a winding resistance in the vicinity of 100ohms. If you're lucky - the sensor cabling may simply be damaged - or any connector corroded.
I would NOT try simulate a test signal to the ECU from this sensor - as the ECU also uses this sensor for other purposes - like calculating rev's & deciding fuel jet firing etc.
Thanks for your replies Jeremy. Read on...
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by jeremy</i>
The Citroen LHM is commonly overfilled but have you been checking the level with the car at maximum height? This is the correct procedure.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Yes I had checked the LHM level with the car at max height. Today I figured out how to remove the LHM level indicator and make sure it was working properly. Then I filled a 100g coffee jar with siphoned off LHM, and there was still too much in the reservoir. Unbelievable! The rest of the surplus comes out tomorrow.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
The brakes will feel different toa normal setup...
The first indication that the accumulator is flat is that the regulator ticking gets rapid - ie below 10 secs...
The suspension spheres also fail with age giving a hard ride (NO Spring!). They can be checked by sitting in the boot...
Steering wobble - try wheel balance first.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I need to read a bit more about this suspension system to know exactly what an accumulator sphere is, though I could have a good guess right now. [:)]
I may have been a little hasty to say anything about suspension problems. I took the car for a long drive today on varying road conditions and it behaved quite well.
Will check wheels soon.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
Smell - Might be a burning circuit board. I don't think LHM smells like this when it burns - after all its only mineral oil.
Jeremy
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The smell is definitely subsiding. [:D]
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by jeremy</i>
The Citroen LHM is commonly overfilled but have you been checking the level with the car at maximum height? This is the correct procedure.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
Yes I had checked the LHM level with the car at max height. Today I figured out how to remove the LHM level indicator and make sure it was working properly. Then I filled a 100g coffee jar with siphoned off LHM, and there was still too much in the reservoir. Unbelievable! The rest of the surplus comes out tomorrow.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
The brakes will feel different toa normal setup...
The first indication that the accumulator is flat is that the regulator ticking gets rapid - ie below 10 secs...
The suspension spheres also fail with age giving a hard ride (NO Spring!). They can be checked by sitting in the boot...
Steering wobble - try wheel balance first.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I need to read a bit more about this suspension system to know exactly what an accumulator sphere is, though I could have a good guess right now. [:)]
I may have been a little hasty to say anything about suspension problems. I took the car for a long drive today on varying road conditions and it behaved quite well.
Will check wheels soon.
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
Smell - Might be a burning circuit board. I don't think LHM smells like this when it burns - after all its only mineral oil.
Jeremy
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
The smell is definitely subsiding. [:D]
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by Homer</i>
[brWhen the spheres 'go' the ride firms up and on a smooth road can make for great conering. Hit a bump mid bend though and you will know about it.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I threw her around a bit on the corners today. Average bumps in corners didn't throw her. But I found the swerve test at speeds over 60 was less stable than I'd hoped for.
[brWhen the spheres 'go' the ride firms up and on a smooth road can make for great conering. Hit a bump mid bend though and you will know about it.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">
I threw her around a bit on the corners today. Average bumps in corners didn't throw her. But I found the swerve test at speeds over 60 was less stable than I'd hoped for.
-
- Posts: 449
- Joined: 28 Sep 2003, 11:08
- Location: North West UK
- My Cars:
-
- Posts: 449
- Joined: 28 Sep 2003, 11:08
- Location: North West UK
- My Cars:
Thanks,
Back on topic. I don't think too much LHM will cause problems. Mine expelled some from the overflow pipe when set it to low level. There was always too much in when i got the car. I have just changed the accumulator this morning and noticed the fluid was a bit on the yellow side of green so i will have to replace it soon.
Back on topic. I don't think too much LHM will cause problems. Mine expelled some from the overflow pipe when set it to low level. There was always too much in when i got the car. I have just changed the accumulator this morning and noticed the fluid was a bit on the yellow side of green so i will have to replace it soon.