C5 LDS Fluid- what and where to buy

[xenton]

Am I correct in believing I should only use Citroen or total LDS fluid or are others available?

I brought some car plan power steering and suspension fluid on the advice of a man in a motor factors. It does say it meets the standard of Citroen LDS, but it's a green colour, and the stuff in my car is orange.

[mooseshaver]

Not sure that's right. If standard power steering fluid would work then why would LDS exist?

I did try some comma fluid that was green, in my first C5 and it made the fluid brown. Didn't fail or anything. The motor factors did ring a dealer before I bought it who said it was just a dye that was different. Bit that was supposed to be direct compatible for LDS not simply PAS fluid

[xenton]

This says on the back it is compatible with many things, I'll get some pics up:

[xenton]

Also how often should the fluid be renewed?

[mooseshaver]

I remember that chs number before perhaps it is ok.
I think the fluid is supposed to be changed every 5 years, but dealers I've dealt with are never asked too. They don't seem to do it as part of normal servicing at 5 years, and when first asked tell me there is nothing to be done at five years.
I did ask a dealer to, but the fluid when I next checked was still brown so not convinced they did.

[xenton]

Thanks for your reply xD

Does anyone know how much fluid the system holds?

[xenton]

Found it in Haynes 5.4 litres for the hydractive 3+ system

[456eec]

You should use LDS only. Even if you drain the LDS and use this stuff it may react with the residual LDS causing gluggy deposits and block components. I just recently bought a C5 here in Australia and easily found LDS in a regional town by looking on the Total website for distributors so it should be easy to find in the UK. I've done a fair bit of research about this.
http://www.total.co.uk/Uk/ukcorporate.n ... enDocument" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[xenton]

I've dropped them (nearest distributor) an email asking where my nearest stockist is. Thanks

[Mandrake]

Not saying that it won't be ok, but I would be wary of a fluid that is the wrong colour and claims to be compatible with so many different brands of car.

I don't know much about LDS but with LHM there is almost nothing else that it is compatible with, (its basically Citroen only) so I would be dubious of a one size fit all fluid for LHM and carry that skepticism over to LDS.

Compatible is a bit of a weasel word - any mineral oil of a similar viscosity will "work" in that the suspension will function, but will it work properly both hot and cold, will the ride quality be as good, will it cause gradual long term damage in the system such as component wear, does it have the correct anti-frothing agents to work at the very high pressures in Citroen suspension etc. Who knows...without a full data sheet you're trusting some label on a bottle of oil from who knows where from a manufacturer who may have thought near enough was good enough to sell one product to as many different cars as possible.

The effects of using a poor substitute may not be felt until a few years later and by then it may be too late. Changing the LDS is something that you would only do every 5 years or so, why leave it to chance to save a few ££, if it was me I would just stump for the correct stuff, (import it from the UK if neccessary to get a better price if you're not in the UK) especially on a C5 where the suspension is electronically controlled with rather expensive replacement parts...

My opinion on the wrong oil in the hydraulic system comes from practical experience - my previous Xantia came with red Dexron gearbox oil in it instead of LHM, and it took a lot of effort to flush that out (about 4 full changes over a few months) and the car always had certain gremlins in the suspension operation that I was never able to fully resolve. Dexron has similar properties to LHM but has added "friction enhancers" to help the clutches in an auto gearbox grip, but those will lay waste to the delicate hydraulic parts in the suspension by causing vastly accelerated wear of internal surfaces...who knows how long that Dexron was in the car but there was definite signs of accelerated wear and damage to some parts like electrovalves.

One of the key ways to keep Citroen suspension happy and reliable is to keep the oil clean and in good condition, change it every few years (3-5 or so) clean the filter, and use the right stuff. Not only is there sludge and particle build up to be removed, some of the components of the oil like the anti-frothing agents do have a limited life time so the "performance" of the oil drops over time, which can be noticed on things like ride quality.

My advice is just find the correct stuff and sleep easy knowing you've put the right stuff in.

[xenton]

Cheers Simon, I will def get the right stuff, worth paying a bit more for the fluid to keep the expensive suspension happy.

[addo]

Manufacturers have a vested interest to ensure that oils are relatively compatible when they're supposed to be.

Oil standards are designed by petrochemical engineers, and if a product meets a particular standard in testing by an approved laboratory, then for purposes in which the specification relates to the nominated standard, any qualifying oil is suitable.

Note this does not exclude special purpose products that may both meet a stringent standard and then contain an unrelated ingredient to assist in serving a purpose outside the boundaries of that standard. For example, a double glazed window may satisfy an insulation standard, but if it's made with bulletproof glass it has an extra ability unrelated to the standard.

"Chicken Little" arguments are also found on paint/panel forums where people swear you shouldn't mix Brand A paint with Brand F hardener. It's offensive to engineering rigour and all the lab work.

[xenton]

Now Im not sure whether to use it or not.

[addo]

Can you cadge a little genuine LDS (new) from someone? Mix in equal quantities in a lidded clean glass jar, shake and see if it remains mixed, if the two separate into layers, if a precipitate forms, or a polymerised skin appears. Try this at room temperature, then chill in the fridge for a few hours, shake and refrigerate again. With lid off, heat to near (water) boiling temperature in a double boiler and see if the two fluids remain mixed.

A few days of experimenting and watching won't hurt your car, and will help your confidence levels.

[xenton]

That's not a bad idea at all, thanks for that!