Peugeot 806 1.9TD. 1999 (T)

[JayA]

Hi
I just bought a 806 1.9 TD on a T reg, 157K miles. Bosch pump. Bought it with "suspected sticking injector". Went to have a look and sounded like a diesel knock but more general than 1 injector. Thought pump timing too advanced. Story from the guy was it just cut out and stopped one day, it re started but had sounded like that ever since. EML flashes on and off as you drive. I have read a few posts on here and although I 'm no idiot with diesel engines, I am an idiot when it comes to ECU controls. Mine is the engine with the wire coming from no.2 injector and a crank sensor. Had it on a analyser, fault code was 144 injection begin.

After getting a bit of info off the forum, I went to the scrappy and got the no.2 injector and CS sensor off a citroen xantia, same engine and diesel system. Replaced injector, no change. Replaced CS sensor and now the EML has gone out, sounds better on tick over but still sound like a bag of nails when you rev it up and still get a fair bit of black smoke.

Questions I have are:
Does the ECU need to be reset before the changes will take effect?
Is the new (secondhand) CS sensor the same for all these models, fitted where it should, plug fitted (3 pin) but it was off a citroen?
Have I simply changed a faulty CS sensor with another faulty one?
Am I barking up the wrong tree altogether?

Next thing I'll do is have a look at the timing physically and check the belt is on right. Possibilty maybe that the belt is just simply on wrong and the story from the fella was a yarn. Just thought I'd see if anyone on here had any ideas first.

Any help gratefully received.

[myglaren]

Could the belt have jumped a tooth?

Also check plug #3, the needle lift sensor may be defective which will invoke default mode that may produce the lumpiness and smoke.
If you unplug it and it makes no difference then that is likely it.
Welcome to the forums Jay

[JayA]

Cheers for the reply Myglaren and the welcome
Going to check the belt tomorrow. First thing my Dad said was, " belts a tooth out". He has been listening to diesel engines for 50 odd years. Just a bit baffled by all this electronic stuff. NLS is in no.2 injector I thought? Changed the whole injector, admittedly for a second hand one , but made no difference. Runs like it sounds too advanced with it plugged in or not. Can get the ECU off the scrapper and change that aswell if necessary.

[myglaren]

PSA number their cylinders from the opposite end to all others so it will look like #2. Only one with a lead on it so you can't go wrong with that.

[spider]

I'm wondering if the advance unit inside the pump itself is stuck, although I cannot quite see how it could. But that would explain why its always too advanced.

The EML / K light not coming on now usually suggests the ECU is happy with the readings being provided from the injector sensor and the TDC sensor at least.

[JayA]

Update on the 806. Bought a new TDC sensor and fitted. No change. Can hear a subtle change in engine note when it's unplugged. Tried the disconnect NLS whilst running and it clonked up like a good un, only the once though. Went back when re-connected then wouldn't do it again. Took timing belt cover off to reveal a big birds nest of shredded up timing belt with about 3/4 of the width of the belt still hanging on thankfully. Lucky me, been driving it around for the last week like it.

Haven't had chance to check the timing marks yet but new cambelt kit on its way in the morning. I'll post on here what the result is tomorrow.

[JayA]

Put a post on yesterday but it has disappeared

Checked the timing with the old belt on and found the engine timing (crank-cam) was probably 1 tooth out, pump timing 2 or 3 teeth out. Looked like a load of old aux belt wound up in there. It's a wonder it ran at all. New belt and tensioners fitted, however on trying to start it had to crank it for 10-12 seconds before it would fire up. Once running sounded fine. Engine sounds fine and pulls like it should now but the starting problem remains, have to crank the thing for 8 -10 seconds before it will fire up, hot or cold. Can have it running turn off the key and immediately try to start again and it's exactly the same. With the belt wrong and mega advanced it started first turn every time.

I have changed the fuel filter, disconnected battery and left for half an hour to re set the ecu and checked the bitron thing. Fans run half speed when air con is on, pull the plug off and they go full chat. Air con off and fans work like normal keeping engine temp at about 85.

Anyone got any suggestions??

[marty1979]

Sounds like the injection pump may be out now?

[dieselnutjob]

I'm not a big expert on these but aren't they essentially an old fashioned pump but with advance now computer controlled?
as they knock like hell with the injector lift sensor missing that suggests that without that sensor they default to some kind of maximum advance position. Maybe disconnect the injector lift sensor again and see how it affects the starting.

806s are not easy things to work. I've done two timing belts, two clutch/flywheels, a steering rack and an intercooler on ours. It's like working through a letter box. I hope I never have to get the head off or turbo out.

[spider]

I've done two timing belts, two clutch/flywheels, a steering rack and an intercooler on ours. It's like working through a letter box. I hope I never have to get the head off or turbo out.

I seem to recall the unit has to be dropped out to get the head off. It would be quicker that way I think regardless.

The pump is electronic advance same as later Xantia / 406 though. As you said if there's a signal problem it tends to go advanced.

[dieselnutjob]

so, if the injector lift sensor is disconnected it will go advanced which should ease starting if it's timing that's the problem
if the sensor is disconnected and it makes no difference then look elsewhere

[JayA]

Didn't start the thing for 2 days and had to crank it for a full 40 seconds before it would start, next morning I pumped the bulb til it went hard and it started first turn so it's clearly a drain back thing. Didn't do it before I did the T belt though. Maybe I disturbed something whilst working in there.

[janhoworth]

hi i'm wondering if you can help i have a Peugeot 806 TD Rolland Garros on a 1999 the EML comes on until i rev the engine and it goes off plus occasionally the car develops a real loud Deisel knock and looses power to solve it all you have to do is turn the ignition off and start it back up and its back to normal i have had it plugged in to a snap on diagnostic tool and it come up with the following A.pedal position sensor circuit B.injection begin control C.injection begin sensor fault i have changed the 2nd injector the one with the sensor but no change i went to Peugeot main dealers and they could not tell me what the fault codes were think its 144 any ideas would be much appreciated i have spent loads on the car and there's just this problem left to fix thanks the car has the Bosch pump on..

[Gibbo_Wirral]

Is there anyone on this map near to you with the Planet diagnostic equipment?

https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=21 ... dg=feature" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[janhoworth]

oldham or manchester probably the closest