Lies, Lies, Damm Lies and Haynes Manuals...

[CitroJim]

We think the Citroen BoLs are bad enough...

You ain't seen nothing until you've seen the Rover 75 BoL.... In comparison the Citroen BoLs are paragons of accuracy and helpfulness...

A pal's dad's Diesel R75 had a duff alternator and we've just replaced it. Dead easy to do, just move the A/C pump to one side and job done. In fact just as you'd do an alternator on a PSA ES9 V6

Anyway, we looked at the BoL first for the procedure as the alternator does look, on the face of it, a bit of a 'mare to get at..

Mr. Haynes suggests removing the PAS pump and both the coolant rad and A/C condenser to make space. To remove the rads means pulling the whole front-end off the car as per XM... The 'Rover 'book' method perhaps?

If we did this we'd have had to have the A/C system depressurised....

A quick look at the Rover/MG forum gave us the 'proper' way of doing it by dropping the A/C compressor. From start to finish in just under a couple of hours Had we been serious at it the job could have been done even faster...

Just imagine the struggle if we'd have blindly followed the BoL

And gawd only knows how much a garage would have charged if they had blindly followed the BoL.

Surely the BoL authour must have realised the easy way of doing the job?

Or are they in collusion with the garage trade to put people off jobs like this? Sadly I suspect the latter

[OwenP]

We think the Citroën BoLs are bad enough...

You ain't seen nothing until you've seen the Rover 75 BoL.... In comparison the Citroën BoLs are paragons of accuracy and helpfulness...

A pal's dad's Diesel R75 had a duff alternator and we've just replaced it. Dead easy to do, just move the A/C pump to one side and job done. In fact just as you'd do an alternator on a PSA ES9 V6

Anyway, we looked at the BoL first for the procedure as the alternator does look, on the face of it, a bit of a 'mare to get at..

Mr. Haynes suggests removing the PAS pump and both the coolant rad and A/C condenser to make space. To remove the rads means pulling the whole front-end off the car as per XM... The 'Rover 'book' method perhaps?

If we did this we'd have had to have the A/C system depressurised....

A quick look at the Rover/MG forum gave us the 'proper' way of doing it by dropping the A/C compressor. From start to finish in just under a couple of hours Had we been serious at it the job could have been done even faster...

Just imagine the struggle if we'd have blindly followed the BoL

And gawd only knows how much a garage would have charged if they had blindly followed the BoL.

Surely the BoL authour must have realised the easy way of doing the job?

Or are they in collusion with the garage trade to put people off jobs like this? Sadly I suspect the latter

I'd go with collusion, or idiocy on the part of Haynes, but then I'm ****** *** and uncharitable tonight, so probably shouldn't be posting on the net.

On the other hand I found the 405 one useful a few times, but then I might not have known if there was an easier way, or been able to spot it.

Certainly thier method sounds far more complicated than yours.

[dnsey]

They used to claim that they were based on a full strip and rebuild by their own mechanics, which was evident from the 'tricks' which they'd worked out, but I doubt that that's the case these days. I suspect that a lot of the procedures are indeed 'translated' direct from the factory manuals without any reference to a real vehicle.

[gadgetgricey]

Mate of mine has just had the Alternator (and battery) changed on his MG ZT 2.0 Diesel (R75 is disguise )

Now he was over a barrel a little bit as was driving back from Edinburgh to Birmingham on Sunday evening when it failed. Towed back to a garage in Edinburgh for it to be fixed, which they did on Monday.

Texted him prices of both. (Eurocar parts 25% off code, brought it down to under £200 notes all in, after the refund for the alternator)

However the garage still charged him £500 for the work

Not even certain he needed a new battery.....

Better not show him that it's about 3 hours work tops

- Dave -

[addo]

I disagree with the Haynes story about a full stripdown and rebuild - reckon that went out several decades ago. When you look at some of the photos carefully, it's apparent they are pulling apart wrecked cars.

[lexi]

Their manuals on the washing machines don't work either. I bought the wife one for her Xmas................she still breaks and buys a new machine every two yrs

I am only getting a Lexia cos I told her it would plug into her Hotpoint for testing

[CitroJim]

Better not show him that it's about 3 hours work tops

- Dave -

No, best not to as I'm sure he'll not be happy but for interest, here's the original article from the MG-Rover forum.

Lexi, great news on the Lexia Damm useful with a MK2...

And yes, Adam, I reckon that's right about the later manuals. I notrie our library now has them in the fiction section...

Oh, for the good old Haynes manuals of yore when they told you everything in exquisite detail... The last good Citroen one was the original BX manual with the brown cover. It even covered a full strip of the gearbox.

[spider]

They are a bit um yes, now

Have you ever looked at a 70's or early 80's one ? , they went into so much great detail.

I can recall (I still have it) an Escort or Cortina manual with several pages explaining how the VV Carburettor (which is quite complicated anyway) worked and how to properly overhaul it, not a 'fit these parts in the kit and go to a dealer' thing, also they went into transmission overhauls to some extent too, rather than regard it as a sealed unit.

I think its all a case of dumbing down now

[myglaren]

I haven't had an Haynes manual for ages - one came with the Accord but I never opened it.

The older ones were excellent though - Hillman Minx, Renault 4, Renault 11, Renault 14, GS, Imp and more), all invaluable.

[lexi]

Are we missing the point that vehicles are more complicated?

My Landrover manuals are the original factory type. There is also a parts book with every P/N and pic. Rover went to a lot of trouble to do it but the trucks were simple enough.