1.9td Xantia Overheating in warm weather+losing coolant

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msr
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1.9td Xantia Overheating in warm weather+losing coolant

Post by msr »

Last summer on a couple of warm days my Xantia would be reading high on the temp meter.
When noticing it do this i would stop and turn my engine off, at that point i'd see coolant\water leak out the lower part of the radiator (in fact it could be coming from a small outlet pipe which is dangling on that side).

After topping up with water or more coolant everything was fine.

I'd forgotten all about this over the last few months but now the weather has got nicer ive noticed the same happening.

Yesterday i suddenly noticed the fans were on and the temp was 90 and rising. Pulled up, engine off and when getting out i saw loads of coolant coming out again.

So im just trying to work out what could be causing this?
Perhaps the thermostat?

Any help or advice would be really appreciated. Im driving around with loads of bottled water but really want to fix the problem asap
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Post by spider »

You don't say if Petrol / Diesel or engine size etc ;) although the usual checks are the same regardless of engine type: :)

If its pressurising, it may be either an airlock from not bleeding it carefully during filling or headgasket failure (as compression pressure leaking into the waterways will soon push water out and air in)

I'd first of all check the fans work, should cut in at low speed around 88 to 90 and high speed a bit later say around 95 to 97.

Once the fans function, carefully bleed it to remove any trapped air and see if it still does it.

Is it less likely to overheat with the AC on ? , as that usually brings a fan on when its engaged regardless of engine temperature.

I did think about a stuck thermostat but that would cause overheating all the time, regardless.
Andy.

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Post by RichardW »

Hmmm the words 'head' and 'gasket' are forming themselves into a sentance in my head.... :evil:

Check the following:

Engine cold, is there still pressure in the cooling system?
Refit cap, run engine a minute or so, stop - check for pressure in system?
Re-start engine with the cap off, are there bubbles rising into the header tank, worsening when the engine is revved?

Answer yes to any of the above and it's probably decapitation time.

It could be the stat, but I would do the above checks first - if they come back negative, then stat is probably next point of call.
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msr
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Post by msr »

Sorry i put 1.9td in the thread title but didnt mention it in the post. Its a 1995 1.9 Turbo Diesel SX without A/C

The fans definitely work as they've been coming on at both speeds when it overheats.

Thanks for the advice i'll do those checks.

Head gasket has been on my mind but im really hoping its not that :(
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Post by Xantidote »

This leak in the lower part of the radiator: have you confirmed whether or not it's the rad leaking , or a hose connection?

Not sure what happens if the cooling system over-pressurises, but would have thought the pressure cap on the header tank would release any excess pressure.
Martin

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Post by citroenxm »

OOOEEERRRR DO NOT... I MEAN and STRESS DO NOT put straight water in her, you WILL make things worse in the long term.

Putting plain water in time after time will weaken the anti freeze mixture to a point of none in there... but its NOT The cold protection thats important, its the fact that anti freeze ALSO has anti rust inhibitors!!!

As the block is cast iorn, they rust quickyl inside and this can and will and DOES block up the head gasket and other narrow water ways.... Ive seen many a gasket with rust built up around the water ways blocking the ways up.

Sorry, as for your Q, Id suspect a sticky thermo stat.. possibly caused by brown rusty water...

Id change that.. Other areas for water loss, rad, as mentiond above, and Water Pumps.. are the two favorties, followed by heater matrix, but thats told by "Currie" smells when the heater is put on hot....

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Post by the_weaver »

I've got a ZX, but I expect the system is similar. On the ZX, there's a clear plastic pipe that's attached to a spigot that comes out of the side of the filler neck, just below the radiator cap. The pipe dangles downwards towards the bottom of the radiator. This pipe carries the flow of hot ejected coolant downwards, to a safe place at the bottom of the radiator, and onto the road.

The radiator pressure cap has a metal plate and rubber washer and there's a spring which keeps the cap shut normally. When too much pressure builds up, there's enough pressure to force the spring back and coolant is then ejected.

There could be a number of reasons for coolant being ejected. It could be the head gasket, as somebody suggested. However, you seemed to be ok driving the car in the winter, but the problems are now back because of the warmer weather. It could be that the car is just overheating. If the checks for head gasket failure are ok, then I would inspect the radiator. Is it blocked with leaves, dirt etc? Are there any signs that the radiator is leaking? Check for green or blue gunge on the radiator. Check both sides. Is there water sitting around the bottom of the radiator? I've heard that the cooling systems on the TD's are only just good enough to cool the engine, so an old radiator that's blocked might be a problem.

A water leak anywhere in the system could cause problems. Check all hoses etc for signs of leaks. Run the engine and look for water dripping onto the ground.

The cooling systems do need to be bled properly, to get rid of air locks. Did these problems start after a coolant change? Some garages might just fill the system, without bothering with the bleeding, as it is time consuming.

Are you filling the system to the right point? There's usually a "min" and a "max" mark. If you overfill, then the excess coolant might be expelled.

Could the radiator cap be faulty? I once had one that was hissing (leaking slightly). Run the engine, then switch off and listen to the radiator cap.

Paul
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Post by citroenxm »

The Xantia has an expension bottle on the Offside inner wing... with no min or max level marking..

I think its ONLY the Xantia D Non turbo that has a rad with filler on it..

Paul
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Post by Peter.N. »

Is the temperature rising before or after you loose the water, a faulty head gasket won't in itself cause the engine to overheat, it overheats because the pressure in the cooling system has blown out the coolant.

If its just overheating and then blowing out the coolant I would suspect a clogged radiator, if its done anything like a high mileage it probably needs replacing, especially if its had a lot of fresh water in it.

Peter
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Post by the_weaver »

Is the thermostat housing high up? If there is air in the system, then maybe the thermostat is sitting in air, instead of being surrounded in water. So it might not be sensing the true temperature of the water. Just speculation. I don't know if this actually happens or not.

Edit: Could the electric fan sensor have the same problem? It's important to bleed the air out properly using the method described in the manual.

Paul
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