differnce between bx suspanstion and the xantia. And ADVICE

[jacksun1987]

whats the differnce between bx suspnastion and the xantia.
Just wondered if theres any differnce.
thanks

[citronut]

deap down not a great deal except the XANT has been over complicated,

regards malcolm

[Citroenmad]

Not a great deal really, though it depends on which Xantia model you are talking about.

Early 'sinkers' as essentially the same, very similar.

Cars with anti-sink are a little more complicated, having an anti-sink valve and an extra sphere

Cars with hydractive suspension have extra spheres to cut between soft and sports suspension

Activas have 10 spheres, two extra ones than the hydractive cars whcih work to keep the car level.

[Xaccers]

If memory serves, the BX pump powers a single output, which goes to the flow distribution valve which splits it between the steering, and the brakes and suspension. Stop the car and it sinks, this has the advantage that it excercises the height control links and stops them seizing up, but you might come back to a very low car.

On the non-sinker Xantias, they basically combined the FDV and pump, so 6 of it's pistons drive the power steering, while the remaining 2 power the brakes and suspension.
They also fitted anti sink valves which cut in when the pressure from the pump drops, isolating the front and back keeping the car up for longer.
As the rear is isolated from the accumulator, they had to fit a rear accumulator so you still have rear brakes, which we lovingly call the anti-sink sphere.
The advantage of this is the car stays up longer, appealing to people who are unsure of hydraulic suspension, while the disadvantages are the height control links don't move much so seize and if sphere pressures are low the antisink valves don't close and with only 2 pistons driving it, it can take longer to rise, especially when you have 10 spheres like an Activa.

Hydractive have firmer spheres at the corners, with a softer sphere between them at each end. When you drive aggressively, it isolates the soft spheres stiffening the suspension.

Activas have two more spheres on the antiroll bars, and when they're isolated it stiffens the bar preventing the car from leaning round corners.

[jacksun1987]

which xantias are better the older ones or the newer ones. Ive notice the older ones are cheaper to insure. a 1.9 td in group 9 2.1 td in 10 or 11
Where as a mk2 xantia 2 liter hdi is in 12 or 13. Bit strange if you ask me.
The c5s are nearly the same groupes as the older xantias. My bx 1.7 td is in group 7.

[Dommo]

If memory serves, the BX pump powers a single output, which goes to the flow distribution valve which splits it between the steering, and the brakes and suspension. Stop the car and it sinks, this has the advantage that it excercises the height control links and stops them seizing up, but you might come back to a very low car.

On the non-sinker Xantias, they basically combined the FDV and pump, so 6 of it's pistons drive the power steering, while the remaining 2 power the brakes and suspension.

I've always wondered, how does the FDV 'know' how to split the hydraulic pressure? It must be able to send all the pressure to the suspension when it wants to which is why it rises up so quickly, but how does it know when to do that and how does it know to send pressure to the steering, etc..?

[Xaccers]

Depends what you want from it, personally the 1.9TD is the best for my needs, sporty and frugal, with the ability to run on veg.
Some people prefer the hdi's, I find the 90HDi's to be sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.
Haven't driven a 110HDi, I would imagine they're more responsive, although I had a 2.1TD and found that very sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.

If you're running on diesel then the 110 is probably the most economical, but with it's ability to run on vegetable oil the 1.9TD beats the lot, even with 45mpg simply because the fuel is so much cheaper (I worked it out last year and on diesel you needed to get over 70mpg to be cheaper)

Also there's the looks, many of us prefer the sleaker lines of the Mk1 while some prefer the bulbous fat lip of the Mk2.
If you want more spec for your money, then a late Mk1 is likely to have it, so a late 97/98 Mk1 SX is likely to have higher trim than an early 98/99 Mk2 SX for instance.
Mk1's have a glove box, for a very thin pair of gloves, Mk2s have a larger one with cup holders (well sort of) in the lid and a passenger airbag as standard (so it depends on how much you love your partner).
Later Mk1's have a keypad immobiliser which can easily be disabled and replaced with an odments tray as well as easily replaced IR plips, while Mk2's have transponder plips (which I believe are more difficult to replace - you can't just put one key in the ignition and rapidly press the button like you can with the IR ones) and the odments tray. You also can't just pull out the keypad while the engine's running to remove the immobiliser.

Rust wise, Mk1 hatchbacks suffer very little, Mk2 ones tend to suffer like estates where the outer skin of the rear wheel arch by the back seats isn't sealed, normally the N/S one is worse. Also press the N/S side of the car, about where the fuel filler would be if it were on that side, mud can get up inside the wheel arch liner on the Mk2s and rust this from the inside out.
Estates rust at the outer wheel arch skin seam by the rear seats, again normaly N/S first, and the front doors can drop and need welding properly (something that wasn't always done in the factory).

Strut tops go too, very important, Mk1s being older are most likely to suffer, also Mk2 (or replacement strut tops) seem to be better protected.
Fail to replace a duff one at your peril.
Jim covered a lot of this in the March Citroenian

[Xaccers]

If memory serves, the BX pump powers a single output, which goes to the flow distribution valve which splits it between the steering, and the brakes and suspension. Stop the car and it sinks, this has the advantage that it excercises the height control links and stops them seizing up, but you might come back to a very low car.

On the non-sinker Xantias, they basically combined the FDV and pump, so 6 of it's pistons drive the power steering, while the remaining 2 power the brakes and suspension.

I've always wondered, how does the FDV 'know' how to split the hydraulic pressure? It must be able to send all the pressure to the suspension when it wants to which is why it rises up so quickly, but how does it know when to do that and how does it know to send pressure to the steering, etc..?

Imagine two self flushing lavatories, each with their own cistern fed from a single tank, but with an overflow pipe between them, and each with an overflow to the drains.
The one on the left (power steering) is smaller so fills up quicker.
Once full water flows through the overflow pipe into the suspension/brakes cistern, so it fills faster than if it was just using it's own water supply.
Once both are full the water overflows to the drains (LHM resevoir).
Someone flushes the left toilet (turns the steering wheel) so the water level above drops, and is replenished from the tank's flow to the steering cistern, and via the the linking overflow pipe, the tank's flow to the suspension cistern.

[jacksun1987]

wow thanks for the info.
Every one seems to be getting new cars. And everyone sems to be against my bx. I bought it for 700 pound from kent. I bought it over the phone. Got to it needed a lot of electrical stuff. Like rev counter reverse lights stuff like that. Then got a new cambelt acuminater all sorts. Spent about 700 pound on it. Still needs 500 pound to get it all sorted. Like arm bearings steering gaitor. Mabye a new hydeolic pump. The body work is superb engine superb. Is it worth keeping it.

[jacksun1987]

heres some photos if you can get on it.

http://s1006.photobucket.com/albums/af1 ... x%20beast/

See what other citroen fans say about it. Then just people from the bx fourm

[Xaccers]

Keep it, cherish it and look after it.

[jacksun1987]

yep i do like the xantias as well. Would love to see how they drive.

[Peter.N.]

Depends what you want from it, personally the 1.9TD is the best for my needs, sporty and frugal, with the ability to run on veg.
Some people prefer the hdi's, I find the 90HDi's to be sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.
Haven't driven a 110HDi, I would imagine they're more responsive, although I had a 2.1TD and found that very sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.

There must have been something seriously wrong with your 2.1 then or the 1.9 was highly modified, they have another 20 bhp and lots more torque, especially at low revs - and the fuel consumption is better, I know, I have owned both, not in Xantias I admit, but the 2.1 in the XM is better than the 1.9 in the ZX.

Peter

[citroenxm]

Depends what you want from it, personally the 1.9TD is the best for my needs, sporty and frugal, with the ability to run on veg.
Some people prefer the hdi's, I find the 90HDi's to be sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.
Haven't driven a 110HDi, I would imagine they're more responsive, although I had a 2.1TD and found that very sluggish compared to the 1.9TD.

There must have been something seriously wrong with your 2.1 then or the 1.9 was highly modified, they have another 20 bhp and lots more torque, especially at low revs - and the fuel consumption is better, I know, I have owned both, not in Xantias I admit, but the 2.1 in the XM is better than the 1.9 in the ZX.

Peter

Xac makes an interesting point here.. Years ago, I had a 1.9td SX Xantia on an L plate, and went to see an R reg S1 2.1 TD SX... and it too was sooooo sllooowwwwww, my 1.9 td was quicker and faster...

All my Xantia 2's are HDi 110bhp's and theres quite a difference, however, my own V reg Exclusive is the quickest, as I have a tuning box fitted, so to me, all the 110bhps are slow to me now....

Paul

[Citroenmad]

Obviously something a miss with those slow 2.1s!

Quite how a manufacturer can make a bigger engine with more power and torque but it be slower is impossible!

I guess the fuel pump makes a difference on the 2.1, whether it be Lucus, Bosch etc?

Still, they should be quicker than the 1.9s