Back end in air, front low when engine off. Xantia
Moderator: RichardW
Back end in air, front low when engine off. Xantia
How should an xantia sit when the engine is turned off? Is it normal for the back end to be in the air and the front to be down? I thought if anything the back end drops low and the front stays high....that's on an older xantia without an anti-sink sphere anyway am I correct?
Surprised ive had no replies, a lot of you guys know your hydraulic suspension well.
Basically the car I'm talking about, it's not stupidly high at the back, the front end isn't stupidly low either, however the back is defiantly higher than the front when engine has been off, like the front sinks a bit but the back doesn't.
Basically the car I'm talking about, it's not stupidly high at the back, the front end isn't stupidly low either, however the back is defiantly higher than the front when engine has been off, like the front sinks a bit but the back doesn't.
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CitroJim
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Ashy, can you pop up a picture?
I'd say, without seeing and observing that you have either a weak accumulator (leading to a delay in shutting the anti-sink valve), weak corner spheres or a leaky anti-sink valve at the front. By leaky I mean leaky as in leaking LHM. Pop the LHM reservoir off and have a look under where the valve sits and look for leaks.
How long does the car take to assume this pose after the engine is off?
What's your pressure regulator tick rate like?
Front struts may also have a tad of wear and finally the rear height corrector may be failing to correct back down after passengers alight (causing the rear to go high) and thus exaggerating the pose. For this, again, the accumulator or rear Anti-Sink sphere may be the culprit.
So, there are may potential causes. Only thing to do is to give the whole hydraulic system a full health check...
I guess that's why this thread has not attracted may replies just yet; the fault could be almost anything!
Quite happy to suggest how to do a full check of everything if you need..
Firstly, what's the exact model and is it Hydractive?
I'd say, without seeing and observing that you have either a weak accumulator (leading to a delay in shutting the anti-sink valve), weak corner spheres or a leaky anti-sink valve at the front. By leaky I mean leaky as in leaking LHM. Pop the LHM reservoir off and have a look under where the valve sits and look for leaks.
How long does the car take to assume this pose after the engine is off?
What's your pressure regulator tick rate like?
Front struts may also have a tad of wear and finally the rear height corrector may be failing to correct back down after passengers alight (causing the rear to go high) and thus exaggerating the pose. For this, again, the accumulator or rear Anti-Sink sphere may be the culprit.
So, there are may potential causes. Only thing to do is to give the whole hydraulic system a full health check...
I guess that's why this thread has not attracted may replies just yet; the fault could be almost anything!
Quite happy to suggest how to do a full check of everything if you need..
Firstly, what's the exact model and is it Hydractive?
Jim
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
Runner, cyclist, time triallist, duathlete, Citroen AX fan and the CCC Citroenian 'From A to Z' Columnist...
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rmunns
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Xantia suspension checks
Please could someone point to the sticky that tells all about how to judge possible faults with the suspension system.
I hear things like 'sit on the boot and the suspension should......whatever'. But, for example, is this test done with engine running?
I just need a definitive list of points to look out for and how to properly maintain a system.
Mine is a standard Mark II year 2000 Hdi90 Forte saloon.
Thanks
I hear things like 'sit on the boot and the suspension should......whatever'. But, for example, is this test done with engine running?
I just need a definitive list of points to look out for and how to properly maintain a system.
Mine is a standard Mark II year 2000 Hdi90 Forte saloon.
Thanks
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rmunns
- Posts: 611
- Joined: 09 Jul 2009, 22:09
- Location: Southern Dordogne, France
- My Cars: 2019 C5 Aircross 2litre diesel, auto.
2018 C4 Pic2 Spacetourer auto. Seems nice so far.
2019 C4 Cactus manual. Didn't like it, lots of niggling points. sold.
2011 C4 Picasso excl. - shaping up to be a disaster, bought June 2019. P/X'd
2009 Citroen C5 X7 exclusive, auto, LHD, 207500km (129000miles) now sold
Citroen Xsara Picasso excl. 2004 2.0 Hdi, RHD, 64000miles. (sold)
Citroen C3 Picasso excl. 2016. sold.
Two Xantias, one petrol, one diesel. sold.
In the past: Renault 16 (in about 1977, for a year). With front pass. seat out transported full bathroom suite from Cambridge to Derby!)
Renault 4TL (in 2011, for a year) - x 9
Hi again. Sorry I havnt replied earlyer to everyones comments, I have been extremely busy, broke my laptop aswell so wasnt able to get online for quite a while. Thanks to everybody who replied.
Jim - I havnt got a picture, it is a friends car not my own - when I went to take a picture on my phone (a few days after I first saw it with its rear in the air) the suspension level looked normal height. It seems that it is only intermittent that the rear end is high up, if that is possible? I will try get a picture next time I see it like that.
Regarding the tick rate, do you mean are there any singular ticking noises from the suspension/pump? Because if so, have a look at my other thread on the ticking upon startup (will find a link) its the same car.
Its not a hydractive version, its a 1.8 litre, 1997 possibly 1998 and the model is LX/SX I think?
Jim - I havnt got a picture, it is a friends car not my own - when I went to take a picture on my phone (a few days after I first saw it with its rear in the air) the suspension level looked normal height. It seems that it is only intermittent that the rear end is high up, if that is possible? I will try get a picture next time I see it like that.
Regarding the tick rate, do you mean are there any singular ticking noises from the suspension/pump? Because if so, have a look at my other thread on the ticking upon startup (will find a link) its the same car.
Its not a hydractive version, its a 1.8 litre, 1997 possibly 1998 and the model is LX/SX I think?
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Xaccers
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LX/SX would be non-hydractive (keeps things simple) so the pipes to the front suspension spheres are only a few mm thick rather than 6mm.
Being 97/98 means it's fitted with anti-sink, so 6 spheres (4 corner, front accumulator, rear accumulator (mis)named the antisink sphere).
Looking at your tick thread, the accumulator sounds like it's very flat if not completely dead and should be changed as soon as possible (they're about £25 from GSF car parts).
You'll need either a very good chain wrench, or even better a sphere removal tool, either one from ebay, a home made one (see the link in my signature), or the best one from Pleiades.
To remove it you need to depressurise the hydraulics by setting the car on low with the engine running, let it settle down for a minute or so, then open the 12mm bleed bolt on the regulator by the accumulator sphere at the front of the engine (it's the only 12mm one there), only open it a couple of turns, you should hear a whistle as lhm rushes back to the resevoir. Stop the engine and nip the bolt back up so you don't forget later
Then use your tool to undo the sphere, once it gets going you should be able to spin it off by hand.
Fit the o-ring that comes with the new sphere to the socket after coating it with fresh LHM.
Then screw the new sphere home until it's finger tight.
Start the engine, do citrobics (raise to high, wait a minute, drop to low, wait a minute, repeat several times), then job done.
Now, if the accumulator needs changing, chances are the LHM will need changing too (any that runs out when you remove the acc sphere should be bright green but will probably be dull or even brown/red) and the anti sink sphere at the back, just in front of the spare wheel.
You'll need a 4.5mm seal available from GSF, and a 9mm flare spanner.
Set the car on high, put axle stands under the rear jacking points, set the car on low (amaze your friends as the rear magically lifts up giving plenty of access and remind them to NEVER EVER work under a hydraulic car unless it's secured on axle stands as they can drop suddenly turning you into a mess on the drive which tends to upset partners) and depressurise as before.
Get under the back and look behind the antisink sphere in the middle of the cross member, there's the pipe which goes to the sphere.
Hook the 9mm flare spanner onto the pipe nut and start undoing it.
Once it's going, let the spanner hang on the nut and unscrew the sphere using your tool. The box frame that makes access to the nut a pain in the backside will stop the spanner spinning and you'll screw the sphere out of it's socket and off the nut in one go.
Coat a 4.5mm seal in LHM and fit it to the end of the pipe. This is where the fun starts so read up on suitable swear words before hand.
Even though there's no recess for the new o-ring, use it anyway as it stops the new sphere rusting to the cross member.
Screw the sphere in just enough to hold it in place, then fit the pipe into the sphere and start the nut going, put those swear words to good use, and once it's working, hang the flare spanner back on the nut and screw the sphere home. Then nip up the pipe nut.
Start 'er up and put her on high, remove the axle stands and do some citrobics again.
Stand back and feel proud that once again man has conquered sphere.
If the LHM is mucky, then it's time to change that for hydroflush, it's not a hard job, if you've got a haynes manual it covers it well.
Tips:
If you pop the plastic pipe holder off the side of the tank it makes things easier and saves you having to disconnect all the pipes.
Use a washed dry 2L coke bottle with the top cut off to protect the filter/pipes unit when you remove it.
Move the air filter out the way so you have a clear view of the base of the tank, use a wide screwdriver under it and twist to pop the spike that sticks out the bottom of the tank out of it's hole (saves spilling LHM over yourself).
A cheap soft toothbrush is great for cleaning the gunk off the filters.
Being 97/98 means it's fitted with anti-sink, so 6 spheres (4 corner, front accumulator, rear accumulator (mis)named the antisink sphere).
Looking at your tick thread, the accumulator sounds like it's very flat if not completely dead and should be changed as soon as possible (they're about £25 from GSF car parts).
You'll need either a very good chain wrench, or even better a sphere removal tool, either one from ebay, a home made one (see the link in my signature), or the best one from Pleiades.
To remove it you need to depressurise the hydraulics by setting the car on low with the engine running, let it settle down for a minute or so, then open the 12mm bleed bolt on the regulator by the accumulator sphere at the front of the engine (it's the only 12mm one there), only open it a couple of turns, you should hear a whistle as lhm rushes back to the resevoir. Stop the engine and nip the bolt back up so you don't forget later
Then use your tool to undo the sphere, once it gets going you should be able to spin it off by hand.
Fit the o-ring that comes with the new sphere to the socket after coating it with fresh LHM.
Then screw the new sphere home until it's finger tight.
Start the engine, do citrobics (raise to high, wait a minute, drop to low, wait a minute, repeat several times), then job done.
Now, if the accumulator needs changing, chances are the LHM will need changing too (any that runs out when you remove the acc sphere should be bright green but will probably be dull or even brown/red) and the anti sink sphere at the back, just in front of the spare wheel.
You'll need a 4.5mm seal available from GSF, and a 9mm flare spanner.
Set the car on high, put axle stands under the rear jacking points, set the car on low (amaze your friends as the rear magically lifts up giving plenty of access and remind them to NEVER EVER work under a hydraulic car unless it's secured on axle stands as they can drop suddenly turning you into a mess on the drive which tends to upset partners) and depressurise as before.
Get under the back and look behind the antisink sphere in the middle of the cross member, there's the pipe which goes to the sphere.
Hook the 9mm flare spanner onto the pipe nut and start undoing it.
Once it's going, let the spanner hang on the nut and unscrew the sphere using your tool. The box frame that makes access to the nut a pain in the backside will stop the spanner spinning and you'll screw the sphere out of it's socket and off the nut in one go.
Coat a 4.5mm seal in LHM and fit it to the end of the pipe. This is where the fun starts so read up on suitable swear words before hand.
Even though there's no recess for the new o-ring, use it anyway as it stops the new sphere rusting to the cross member.
Screw the sphere in just enough to hold it in place, then fit the pipe into the sphere and start the nut going, put those swear words to good use, and once it's working, hang the flare spanner back on the nut and screw the sphere home. Then nip up the pipe nut.
Start 'er up and put her on high, remove the axle stands and do some citrobics again.
Stand back and feel proud that once again man has conquered sphere.
If the LHM is mucky, then it's time to change that for hydroflush, it's not a hard job, if you've got a haynes manual it covers it well.
Tips:
If you pop the plastic pipe holder off the side of the tank it makes things easier and saves you having to disconnect all the pipes.
Use a washed dry 2L coke bottle with the top cut off to protect the filter/pipes unit when you remove it.
Move the air filter out the way so you have a clear view of the base of the tank, use a wide screwdriver under it and twist to pop the spike that sticks out the bottom of the tank out of it's hole (saves spilling LHM over yourself).
A cheap soft toothbrush is great for cleaning the gunk off the filters.
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