alternator removal Xantia 1.9 TD

[roby77]

Hi anybody/everybody..just bought my first Citroen. A Xantia.
Bought the car with a dead alternator with a view to changing it myself.
Now i understand how difficult it will be..Firstly do i have to remove the hydraulic pump configuration that sits on top of the alternator,cant see how i can get it out otherwise..Secondly i cannot quite understand the Haynes manual. According to Haynes i appear to have bought a hybrid 2.1 TD and 1.9 TD but i am sure this is not right..the problem of moving the spring tensioner back to remove the aux belt seems impossible ..Cannot find the hole to put the rod in..and is just pushing back the tensioner enough to get the belt off...Help Rob..

[swiss_steve]

Hi Rob,
I assume you've got a late '97 1.9TD - just pre Facelift, that might explain the hybrid, perhaps?
In my experience, don't bother with the pin, it's almost impossible to get into the hole with the clearance from bulkhead. Instead, I recommend you hold back the tensioner with a 3/8" ratchet socket wrench, then slip the belt off the Hydraulic Pump, for example.
Then the Hydraulic Pump should be easy to get off. Don't forget to plug off the supply pipe from the LHM Reservoir.
If I recall (when I replaced my Tensioner and Spring), it's still quick tricky to get the alternator out of the remaining space. Keep persevering and remember exactly how you got it out!
Good luck!

[CitroJim]

Welcome to the forum Rob

Later 1.9TDs did get the 2.1TD tensioner. Not real progress, that

Swiss_Steve, you give good advice on the tensioner Do check its condition as it's a common failure item and can make the aux. belt fall off the pulleys and cause untold carnage. Check the tensioner moves freely with no graunchiness. The needle rollers inside it fail.

The alternator can be removed on a 1.9TD without removing the HP pump. Instead, remove the oil filter and you'll just be able to wriggle it out by bending the top hose out of the way. Mind you don't damage the radiator.

[Xaccers]

Best way I've found to change the belt is remove the ECU box (big black thing that gets in the way, over the front of the driver's wheel)
You should then be able to see the tensioner arm, with the 3/8ths square hole.
I have a long breaker bar with a hinged 3/8 bit on the end, which fits in easily.
Pushing down on the breaker bar using the chasis edge where the ECU was as a pivot makes releasing the tension a doddle.
If it's hard to move the tensioner, chances are it's needle bearings have collapsed, so would be an idea to replace it sooner rather than later.

[roby77]

Hi all...Thanks for all the advice. Removal off the black ECU box allowed me access to the 3/8th notch..I managed to get a 3/8th short bar into the notch and get some purchase on it...Unfortunately it was extremely tight and i think probably siezed but with some persuation i managed to get it moving. Unfortunately with the belt almost free the worst thing happened, the 3/8th bit turned in the notch. Yes it has rounded off. actually i inspected the notch before i attempted this and the notch looked quite rounded then. it maybe the man who sold the car to me may have had the same problem and decided sell the car with the dead alternater (speculation). So now i have a bigger problem and must change the tensioner.. ? maybe i need to cut the belt off

[Xaccers]

Sounds like the tensioner's needle bearings are dead so a change of it was needed anyway.
Have you released the eccentric tensioner?
It needs a 6 or 8 allen key to slacken it.
If that doesn't give you enough slack to remove the belt, then keep undoing the allen bolt and remove the eccentric tensioner completely.

[swiss_steve]

Hi Rob,

You might be able to save the belt if you can undo the bolts on the Alternator and/or Hydraulic Pump to loosen the tension on the belt, then slip it off. If your Tensioner has completely seized, then there's no worry about the spring trying to take up the small amount of slack in the belt that can be gained by unbolting the aforementioned units - worth a try if the belt is in good condition.

I recall that when I had to change my Spring-Tensioner, I needed to remove both the Hydraulic Pump and Alternator anyway to get sufficient access to the Spring (which should also be changed as well as the Tensioner rocker mechanism.

Don't forget to grease up the new Tensioner needle bearings, then that should be the first and last time you'll replace that unit. I hope the job goes well!

[citroenxm]

Hi all...Thanks for all the advice. Removal off the black ECU box allowed me access to the 3/8th notch..I managed to get a 3/8th short bar into the notch and get some purchase on it...Unfortunately it was extremely tight and i think probably siezed but with some persuation i managed to get it moving. Unfortunately with the belt almost free the worst thing happened, the 3/8th bit turned in the notch. Yes it has rounded off. actually i inspected the notch before i attempted this and the notch looked quite rounded then. it maybe the man who sold the car to me may have had the same problem and decided sell the car with the dead alternater (speculation). So now i have a bigger problem and must change the tensioner.. ? maybe i need to cut the belt off

Hmmmmm no one sugested you undo the Eccentric tensioner FIRST, thats accessable from in the wheel arch..

If you undo this, 8mm ALLEN key, this will then slaken off, releasing the auto tensioner, then releaving the belt, so when you tighten up auto tensioner on your 3/8 drive the belt will be slack enough to slip off...

EDIT: Ah well done Xac, missed your small post there.... Im surprised it took so long for anyone to sugest the eccentric!

Paul

[vince]

I saw a TD in the berakers last weekend which had the hydraulic pump mounted above the alternator....Why isnt mine like that? Mine is underneath.... Im not complaining mind....

[citroenxm]

Air Con Vince!

It moved to the top when Air Con was fitted to the cars!

Paul

[roby77]

Ok thanks to all, i will do as you say and loosen the eccentric wheel. Yes the belt seems to be in good condition and there is no run off any of the wheels. I read that often the tensioner starts to sit at an angle and the belt starts to run off and fray when the bearings start to go, but maybe thats not always the case . i have seen some tensioners on ebay that look the same with part num..575130 would this be correct.. again thanks to all for advise,this is the first time i have joined a club forum and i am amazed by all the help

[roby77]

Hi , i am back again for more advice..I have removed the belt with the aid of removing the eccentric tensioner .. Have removed the bolts securing the the alternator..BUT i feel its impossible to get out the alternater without removing the hydraulic pump above it.. I have read the haynes manual and it states that before removing the hydraulic pump the system must be depressurised..That the system must be depressurised with the engine running..Well as i have removed the aux belt and partly removed the alternator i think having the engine running will serve no pupose (no drive to pump)..can i saftley remove the pump without depressurising..Ta

[KennyW]

Hi Rob,

You can take the pump of without depressurising the system but be VERY careful. I think you can still release the pressure by opening the valve on the regulator other members will confirm this or tell you the correct way

Can you confirn if the car is on Axle stand/s or otherwise as it is extremely dangerous if not.

Kenny

[roby77]

Hi Kenny..when you say it will be ok to disconnect without depressurising but be careful do you mean that i could to be sprayed with LHM and also the car will drop down ..(its on middle setting now)..I have 3 wheels on the ground and the front drivers side wheel off and on two jacks at the jacking point..thanks

[KennyW]

Hi Rob,

Yes is the simple answer. The LHM fluid will spray all over the place and the car will fall down, hence all citroens with the hydraulic system must be supported.

I have had to do the same as you in the past, i released the pressure by opening the pressure release valve on the side of the pressure regulator.

Have you identified the regulator

The best person to speak to about citroen Hydraulics is Martin or better known on this site as Pleades.

He will tell you the best way and the safest way to release the presuure.

Kenny