immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

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wiggie_me
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by wiggie_me » 12 Jan 2010, 18:53

i have a peugeot 306 td with a key pad immobiliser, i broke down so i got towed back to my garage, slacked off an injector line - no feul being pumped. its possible that the stop solenoid was nakered but it is sheilded. iv have got a replacment pump (locus) the same as origenal. but the immobiliser will not accept it. with the new pump wired up the immobiliser shows green and red and makes all sorts of nagative noises. then i tried pluggin the old pump back in and it goes back to normal?? can anyone help? many thanks to anyone who can . Ellis

Lawrence1973
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by Lawrence1973 » 12 Jan 2010, 22:40

Hello,
There are greater authorities on this on the forum but I'm pretty sure your new pump won't work because the hidden immobiliser won't match the key pad on the ignition.

I'm not sure if the lucas systems are the same but the bosch pumps need to be de armoured and hard wired directly to the stop solenoid. There are lots of other threads on the forum, have a hunt.

Good Luck

Lawrence

wheeler
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by wheeler » 12 Jan 2010, 23:00

Yeah the code is stored in the pump module not the keypad. Your code will not start the car,you would really need the code of the car the pump came off.

citroenxm
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by citroenxm » 12 Jan 2010, 23:18

Isnt the code stored in the ECU... So in thoery, which it DOES WORK on the Xantia, is plug the OLD pump back in, tap in your code to unlock the ECU, then unplug the Keypad...

Should this then KEEP the ECU unlocked like it does on the Xantias?? Untill you plug a Keypad back in?

Once the ECU is unlocked and keypad disconnected you can even take the battery off and it stays unlocked...

Paul

wiggie_me
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by wiggie_me » 13 Jan 2010, 01:15

Thank you , i was under the impression there wasnt any technology at the pump end. i have tried the removing the key pad once it was disarmed but with no joy. i think its fairly unlikly the scrap yard i aquired the pump from will know the code.

stumped! i cant get this armour off

. . . i spoze the easiest way round this is to find a pump without armour. maybe off a older car?

citronut
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by citronut » 13 Jan 2010, 10:03

i dont think so Paul,
as its the imobaliser module which energises the stop solanoid, not the cars main ECU, im 99.9% sure they are completly sepperate from each other,

regards malcolm

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CitroJim
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by CitroJim » 13 Jan 2010, 11:12

Yes, the code is stored in the pump and yes, the ECU is not at all involved.

The armour on a Bosch is difficult whereas on the Lucas it's a tad easier.

Can you confirm which pump you have? I can then offer further advice.

citroenxm
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by citroenxm » 13 Jan 2010, 11:14

Gettin it wrong again ... :x :oops: Prehaps looking like time to retire.


Paul

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CitroJim
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by CitroJim » 13 Jan 2010, 11:23

citroenxm wrote:Gettin it wrong again ... :x :oops: Prehaps looking like time to retire.
Nooooooooo... Not Likely Paul... Please nooooooo. What would the good residents of Anglesey do without you tending to their antomotive needs?

wiggie_me
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by wiggie_me » 13 Jan 2010, 11:36

CitroJim wrote:Yes, the code is stored in the pump and yes, the ECU is not at all involved.

The armour on a Bosch is difficult whereas on the Lucas it's a tad easier.

Can you confirm which pump you have? I can then offer further advice.
im using a lucas from a R reg 306 mine is a P. i did see an L reg td in the scrappy cant remember what make it was though. it looked much diferent

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CitroJim
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by CitroJim » 13 Jan 2010, 13:09

Good. A Lucas pump is easy (ish) to de-armour.

Remove the pump from the engine. This is necessary.

Observe that there is armour around the distributor and to the side facing the engine.

Identily the "shear screws" securing the armour. These screws have round, plain heads and you can see oin the top where they have been sheared. Obtain a reverse flute socket (used to undo damaged nuts - I use ones made by a company called Irwin) that is a tad smaller than the screw head. The socket can be hammered on each in turn and used to undo the screws.

OPne screw you will find is obscured y the armour and the socket won't quite go on. Hacksaw away the offending part of the armour to give you room.

Remove all armour. You will find the immobiliser module under the armour on the side of the pump and this is hard-wired to the stop solenoid in the distributor head. Cut these wires.

It's best to replace the immobiliser type stop solenoid with a screw termainal type from a non-armoured pump but you can use the existing one. Takle one wire to earh and the other to an ignition-switched 12V supply and away you go.

There is no need to replace the armour if you don't want to.

Hope that helps...

If this is all Chinese to you, I can do a few pictures later...

wiggie_me
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by wiggie_me » 13 Jan 2010, 13:17

cheers citro :) but dosnt the armour have to be replaced for the throtle cable to attach too? iv jus got off the phone to the scrap yard and there happy for me to swap the pump for one off an earlier model (L reg) i had a quick look at it yesterday. there is also one on a 405 td im fairly shour there was no armour on it. all though the pump look totaly diferent. do you think this would matter? or would you say de armouring the one i have is a better option? many thanks for your time

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CitroJim
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by CitroJim » 13 Jan 2010, 13:32

Yes, if the throttle cable is supported by the armour. It can be replaced and you can replace the shear screws with normal ones.

If the pumps look totally different then you're likely looking at a Bosch. Not a straight swap.

Also, if you look at an earlier Lucas pump, it may not have the turbo overfuelling disphragm and cold start advance solenoid.

I think you're best off de-armouring what you have. It really is not too bad a job.

citroenxm
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by citroenxm » 13 Jan 2010, 13:41

Its not a real pain to conver to Bosch..OF COURSE YOU NEED THE INJECTORS TOO!!!!!

You WILL need to move the Pump mounting studs to the "Other" holes next to the studs, um, if you look at the mounting plate AT the dowls move them CLOWISE direction, so the BOSCH pump sits in a "More Advanced" position and closer up to the engine..

I think this calls for a Pictorial really to explain better...

Guess I can look into this.

Paul

xmexclusive
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immobiliser wont accept new fuel pump?

Post by xmexclusive » 13 Jan 2010, 13:50

Think we ought to put Paul (citroenxm) out of his misery.
It entirely depends on the car designer where the electronics for the immobiliser code is stored. To start with when immobilisers were first put on a few upmarket cars keypad and code in the engine ECU was the norm.
Pauls isolation fix usually works on these cars.
Then when immobilisers needed to be fitted to a wider range of cars the problem of those with no engine ECU cropped up. For those diesel cars a little bit of electronics to store and operate the immobiliser was fitted to the injection pump along with its anti-tamper armour. At the same time they closed the door on the "unplug the keypad" method of immobiliser isolation.

John